I find it funny how Flyer "faithfuls" continue to be so up in arms over this, despite relishing in their often overrated "reputation." But the only lingering rep they have is their fickle attitude and general insecurity when facing a loss, as evidenced in them booing their "beloved" team out of Wachovia Center after game 6. I'd say abandoning loyalty during crucial moments is a more despicable sports-fan trait that general boorishness, of which the Flyer "faithful" are egregiously overrated. I was ecstatic to hear about the post game seven viciousness at Verizon. I'm tired of the Metro being clogged with people in Mets hats trying to figure out how to get to the green line, or hearing audible chants for teams not represented here. Enough of the niceties towards the scads of transplants. I didn't hear any boos after game seven.

When your team is down by 2 goals with 2 minutes left, and you desperately need to pull your goalie, and your two defensemen are skating backwards in their own zone, it's severely frustrating. It was a moment of 'are they conceding the game?' in front of a home crowd who won't stand for lack of effort.

And it's a difference between the bulk of the crowds at the Wachovia Center and the Verizon Center. Having attended Game 5 of the series, a large part of the home Caps crowd would boo icing calls and offsides plays, then look around wondering what happened.

Philly fans deserve the rep/fit the stereotype, but we understand the game very well and are really just dying for ONE championship. We're a championship-starved city who have lived with great potential, but overwhelming disappointment, and anything less than all is unacceptable.

But, to clarify, I do not condone the actions of the select few boorish fans. When a Caps fans starts a fight, it's just a bad seed; but if a Philly fan does it, that's Philly fans for ya. I understand that's how stereotypes work, and it's not going to be shed, but at least have the stones to recognize that it happens everywhere (another prime example being the beer shower that Mike Richards took at the end of last night's game in Montreal).

@ Phillyfan -- I understand what you are saying ALL TEAMS HAVE THESE FANS. That's the bottom line. Philly's got the stereo type for it -- but those of us in DC shouldn't throw stones when we live in a glass house. Don't believe me, sit in my seats for a Skins game and they're losing; and after game 7.

Every city has A-holes.

There's a different mindset in Philadelphia, especially when it comes to the Flyers, and it's generally understood by the team and the fans.

The 'booing' isn't a statement of "I hate you, and I'm no longer a fan", it's an expression of disappointment in play, and that they expect more.

To Bobtimist: Questioning the 'faithfulness' of the Flyers fans? If the flyers had lost game six the way the caps lost game seven, I can assure you the Flyers would've gotten cheered off the ice. I love how you as a capitals fan, I'm assuming, will question the Flyers fan loyalties, when 70% of your fanbase didn't even know you had a team until Alex Ovechkin showed up. What would happen if he left? Yup, a sea of red @ 1/2 capacity.

This is the way it is:

philly people throw batteries at baseball players, had a jail under their armpit of concrete (the vet) and have the sterotype of being ignorant, fat, and drunk for a reason. there is no comparison here. philly fans boo santa claus. philly style hockey takes out our goalie over and over again but can get away with it becuz the zebras have their heads shoved up their gary bettman sized a$$e$.
and then we throw a some trash on the ice after game 7 where you guessed it, the refs had a say in game by allowing that bs second goal to count. waaaa waaa we threw a pizza box and a bottle of plastic. o shut up and get over yourselves. if ya'll like philly so damn much stay up there and bathe in the filth...dont bring it down here.

philly sucks

Make a distinction between Flyers fans and fans of the Eagles and Sixers, of which I am not. Flyer fans didn't throw snowballs at Santa, nor did they hurl batteries. Don't just lump Flyer fans in with the fans of the other sports teams in Philly. That is all.

Pete,

You need to get over the reffing. It's all bad, and it's all human. There's no excuse to throw stuff, regardless of where you're from.

You're also using events from Eagles games (Santa, and the jail are Eagles), the JD Drew battery day was very ugly, too.

But you like to use broad strokes.

Dan, did you thank Wise for being a regular reader of the Bog?

As much as I don't like Philly, my consolation for the Flyer fans was that Caps' fans don't like Wise either. They could put pieces of his articles on the big screens at the Phonebooth and receive the same reception they got in Philadelphia. The Post has some good sports' writers, but few know the DMV since they aren't from here. They often fall back on stereotypes of DC fans when they don't know or understand the fan bases. This is as annoying to local fans as it is to the opposing team fans. It even divides fan bases locally.

The remainder of this comment may fit better as a comment to another bog post, but that's a couple of extra clicks. Washington area sports have a lot of knowledgeable fans like every other town. The Redskins get the bulk of the coverage with the other teams battling for the next bit of coverage. Too often the fight for coverage even divides the fans. When teams are doing well and that team is front page, it is easier for the fans to "reunite" behind the team that has always been their team. Regardless of the attendance, unless you're a season ticket holder, you rarely sit next to the same people at local events. The fans at the end of the season are the same fans that have been coming out all season at one time or another. Some are good fans. Some are bad fans. Some are more knowledgeable than others. Some are classier than others. They're all fans.

Little of that has anything to do with the subject of this post, but Web 2.0 rules say any comment over 5 lines must have a undecipherable, off-topic rant or semi-rant(as defined by the IEEE). As is evident here and in other bog posts, fan groups get stereotyped. A lot is made of the transplants in the DC area when the group of transplants that are the most disruptive are actually the media and not the people raised in Philly or Dallas. The booing at the end of Game 7 wasn't for the Caps. It was for the celebrating Flyers and the officials. The Caps did receive an ovation. I wish the crowd hadn't reacted like they did. I don't like booing, but I would have had a hard time not at the end of that game because of what was at stake and the tension in the building. I never condone throwing any objects at opposing fans or anywhere near the playing surface. I say the same of any fans. It doesn't matter what type of reputation they think they have as WVU, UMD, VT, Eagles, Caps fans, etc.. That was despicable.

Now would somebody do me a favor and summarize what I just typed so I understand it?
//C'mon Wise, a gang fight at a high school football game and the NBA "fight" that reached the stands are the worst and ugliest things you've seen at sporting events? How long have you been doing this?

If "the fans" don't like Mike Wise, its probably a good thing for Mike Wise. WHO CARES?

Fans (in both cities) acted stupid and these are the people who are a little of center and think that they are a BIGGER part of the event than they actually are.

I had a revelation when I attended the UVA Football team's season finale against Va. Tech this year (they don't sell *any* alcohol in the stadium, though I'd assume some college students smuggle in cans, bottles or flasks). It was exceedingly family-friendly, there was refreshingly little cussing, people seemed incredibly decently behaved even after bad calls or when the team was losing. I remarked about it to my friend as we left and he mentioned casually "I think everyone's well behaved cause they don't sell booze at the stadium."

Since a lot of the louts are simply drunks who wanna get angry about something, why not consider making the alcohol-sales cutoff earlier? (I know it's financially unreasonable to make them alcohol-free). Why not offer some "family friendly alcohol-free zones" where you might be able to take your kids without worrying about drunks getting in a fight or screaming obscenities at the refs or opposing team all night.

I'll confess I'm an old fart (almost 43), and didn't think this way when I was 23. I think you reach a point where getting drunk, screaming, and running to a filthy arena restroom repeatedly is no longer a good time. :-)

So Washington fans want to call out Philly fans for throwing things and being ridiculous, but then they act in an extremely similar fashion? Um, wow. How embarrassing, and hypocritical, for those D.C.-area fans. Do you not realize you just lowered yourselves to their level? Gosh, nice job, a$$hats.
I've only had one good sports experience in Philly--and it was because the nice Philly lady next to me was 1. sane, and 2. had a daughter living in Arlington, VA, at the time. We had much to discuss and it was a fairly pleasant time, except for the rest of the Philly fans in front and behind her who kept yelling vocal bile at me. It's nice to be loved, I guess.
And THIS is civilization? REALLY?!?

Like Agt. Stenz said, "I mean, if you take it that far the shoe fits, right?"
Avoid hypocrisy.
(Dan, you were THERE for the Cathy Freeman moment?!? Whoa, baby! That's hot! That stadium was beyond out of control for their Aboriginal heroine. Awesome.)

The post was a Wise post not Steinberg, Arlington Pimp.

A note on Mike Wise: He was just on Washington Post Live requesting a "14 year old to fawn over."

I don't anything else needs to be said.

*don't think

Good call, sitruc; thanks.
In that post please replace any mention of "Dan" or "Agt. Steinz" with "M-Wise," "Mikey-Dub," or some other ridiculously easy nickname you can insert. My fault. (Apologies to Mike Wise. Heck, some people seem to think Mike Wise is really Dan Steinberg in a crappy, intense mood--sans eyewear. Or maybe they think Dan is Mike in a chipper mood--not sure.

That would explain Wise being at the Mystics exhibition and Steinberg at the Wizards shoot around.

Last I checked this is still just a game.

I guess it's fun to say "They threw snowballs at Santa", but it only works if you leave out that it's a 40 year old event and leave out the entire back story. And battery throwing was popularized in NY before it became a one time event in Philly. But who's really fact checking when someone is just looking for the sensational angle?

Stupid people are everywhere and pretending an entire fan base is above it is disingenuous since the more recent events have taken place elsewhere and in many different levels of sports, but should never define a fan base or the actual town in which most of those people don't actually live (most offenders are suburbanites acting in anonymity because most teams don't even play in the actual city they purport to be representing or travel in for the games)

Defining the level of retardation of a few against an out of context ancient story is living in denial. It's just a game and just because Santa wasn't involved does not make it okay or lessen it's pettiness.

Lastly, I loved watching Ovechkin in that series and even more when he applauded his fans right back before leaving the ice after game 7.

I really respect the Caps team after this series .They are my second favorite team .I am from Philly and we are the greatest fans in the world.What other fan base would continue to support 4 teams that have not won anything since 1983 . We are angry and tired but we still go to the games and pour our souls into it . Best of luck with your team .Ovie is way above cry baby Cindy .

Speaking of not recognizing satire:
I think the following was meant as a self deprecating joke:
"You made us sound angry and violent that's why I'm going to bust you up in the parking lot tonight"...

Somehow I left that out of my rambling comment. Too many writers think they are above their readers and don't look themselves in the mirror. People wrote him, responding that they did not fit his stereotypes and sometimes used the stereotype in their response. Meanwhile, he turns around and takes the responses literally....

Oh Mike, I absolutely love the underhanded slight at the end of your somewhat veiled blog reportage (veiled because it appeared in this lower=than=your=standard forum). Ah there it is, I've given you an underhanded compliment, though it is not quite worthy of the levels of exacting satire that you so eloquently divulged during the Flyers Caps series. I must admit that what saddens me most is not your tone, or your unabashed insensitivity, or your demanding of unnecessary and largely irrelevant self=referential attention. What saddens me is not your capitalization on a series that was going largely ignored in media circles (blame ESPN for this, after all, since the strike they have abandoned virtually all hockey coverage since they turned to NCAA basketball, NBA basketball and NASCAR, to fill the void), a capitalization on a silent forum. What saddens me is not that you start a fight without any just provocation (boredom perhaps? stress?too much time?). What saddens me is not that you are painfully obvious in wanting this reaction. What saddens me is not any of this. What saddens me is, you guessed, you're right about just about everything you say. The Megadeath statement, well that aside (and some of your inadequate hockey knowledge as well), almost all that you said was utterly, refreshingly, down right satirical. The key to the satire was its precision. I understand and relish in the detail that you employ to this end. Unfortunately, when you start a fight like this, you must seek to prepare for the immediate retaliation of your foe. The Flyers and their fans will of course take offense to your offensive remark (after all, the Megadeath comment was just flat out classist), because everything you said prior to it was ramping them up to respond actively to it. Your detail was fabulous and the writing was vibrant, though I suspect written under some foreboding spell or journalist mood of deadline frustration. Or perhaps you had more time to write this article than normal, a full day perhaps (there is usually at least one off day between every playoff game). Either way, it's clear that some creative impulse, be it time, stress, or too much time and not enough stress, enabled you to strike a startling satirical chord among your readers and naturally, your Philadelphian foes. I applaud your effort and only regret that you made your minor Megadeath disaster (I can't stress enough how amazed I am that you actually carry such sway as a journalist to get away with this, that is, not be fired for your undeniably classist, satirical Megadeath reference)...you must actually retain some say at the Post. I must say, some insensitivity is unavoidable, but c'mon Mike, this was egregious. Though I must admit, I never would have known your name had you not made the slip up. So hmmm, what does this say about the nature of our business? Well it says, if nothing else, that you've gotten the hang of it. Congrats Mike, you're on the top of your game. Let's see how long you can stay in the center of the art museum steps, a surprising gem of a purportedly literary sports columnist. God forbid you get offset from your new found perch some day like Bob Ryan recently did, it's tough to get centered again. Your Megadeath comment is loaded, but nevertheless, one step below the thin line, the ever=tenuous boundary that separates your payraise from your resignation letter. Don't step out of bounds any further Mike, it will probably cost you your job. And I for one couldn't stand for this, because higher journalism like yours deserves a place on everyman's coffee table and indeed, a spot on the bit of skin atop my father's bare and prickly thighs to serve as a delightful surface for the sweltering toilet=top reading of Mike Wise's latest lament during early morning sessions in America's next best reading room, the water closet, the bathroom. Don't stop stinking up my reading room Mike, I just couldn't breathe right without you.

For the record, that Santa Claus was terrible. He was thin, and he was extremely drunk. Seriously. We booed an inebriated imposter. It was not Santa Claus. You would have booed him too.

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