too bad we can't build a wall around these countries & fill it with water

All of these countries- Iraq, Pakistan, Afghanistan, Iran and ALL OF THEM have the right to fulfill their own destiny without interference by the war-mongering international bankers buying and selling every politician they can corrupt. Most Americans want OUT of the war- NOT more of it! It looks to me like there is no politican except for Ron Paul who will pull all our troops out and leave these people alone! It is utterly immoral for the neocons to change American policy to pre-emptive war! I do believe that there are people doing everything possible to create a third world war with the support and help of all the major media- it is time we said NO MORE!!!

america aint intersted in us!although it will step over us inorder to surround china and india wid RAW and america is messin up all da pathan and balauch side cs dey dont want gwadar to become and runnin!!!!its sinpple if it gts up and running indias mumbai is outa buisness and china ad pakistan prosper like hell!!!ds is nt wanted by both india and america!!!all u americans out dere gt it?v aint gna give up dat easy!!!benazir ws killd by america to destabalize us!first shia and sunni cs shes a shiaa and dn punjabi and sindhi fights!!!!v gt unstable and dn u cum in gt our nuclear arsenal and sit here forever!very clever i must say!bt i urge all da pakistanis to stay united in ds grave hour!v aint gna giv up dat easy!allah hu akbar!pakistan zindabad!

At last... America got the ultimate reason to enter Pakistan though everybody knows what he wants. They have always proved to be wrong. Where are the weapons of mass destruction in Iraq? Where is the Osama in Afghanistan? The America will attack many nations to control the resources of Muslims specially. The US troops will bring much more instability in the region. I condemn this act.

William M. Arkin, spot on man, you are too much, incredible. We saw your post and made reference on ITVN and here we are, the 6th of January and headline, NY Times, "U.S. Considers New Covert Push Within Pakistan".

You get the award dude, I am blown away.
Your credentials are without question, or you are truly psychic?

And when we covered the "Who killed Bhutto?" angle, we asked her main man, on the phone in Pakistan, would Benazir have allowed U.S. Special Forces on Pak soil, Sen. Khosa said "no way, she'd have taken it to the Parliament and they'd have rejected it".
Here we are the NYT validating your post, PPP saying no way, and US Intel (read Dick Cheney) seemingly overheated for another conflict. 160mm Pakistanis ain't 24 million Iraqis.
We will have to find a path to contain Taliban in Wazerstan short of Chamberlain style deals by Musharraf or Gordon Brown. And we need to turn Taliban against Al-Qaeda. We should save our Machiavellian tactics for baby steps first.
A third wave, third front will break a military already vastly over bloated and over extended, no?
For Mohamed, who claims to be a journalist in Wazeristan, please pass on the phone numbers of some Tribal (Taliban & Al-Qaeda) warlords who would welcome the US Military. Anyone believes that, I got a bridge in Brooklyn....
For the usual anti-semitic ranting bloggers, not all politics begins and ends in Israel. Find other words in your screed beside "Zionist" for once.
Peace, Shalom, Salem.

I am journalist living in tribal areas situated on Pak-Afghan border. I can say that the people of tribal areas will welcome the Americans as friends. Actually the rulers of Pakistan has palyed an ugly game as on the one hand they have been getting dollars from the United States for countering terrorism, but on the other hand they have been breeding terrorism. The tribesmen have not been believing in Pakistani rulers therefore, they will welcome the US troops.

Just remember, Afghanistan has 18 million
people, Iraq has 22 million and Pakistan
has 160 million. You don't have to be a rocket scientist to know the outcome.

Good luck and best wishes.

I can tell you that there is more anti American sentiment in Pakistan than ever, if americans try to put foot on pak. soil, they will have their worst time. Pakistani army is doing same in pakistan what americans are diong in the world.
There will not be danger of collapsing pakistan if we go politically to natives in tribals as it has been done in last 60 years. but the results of non political solution has brought this war in to the cities of pakistan

Well the only nukes the world should be afraid of are the american ones. USA is the only country which ever used them and killed hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians in Japan. Iran for example did not attack any country since a dozen centuries, they are not such an agressive and brutal empire like USA is. Another christian fundamentalist like GWB as president and i fear that Syria, Iran or another muslim country will get nuked by America.

Well the only nukes the world should be afraid of are the american ones. USA is the only country which ever used them and killed hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians in Japan. Iran for example did not attack any country since a dozen centuries, they are not such an agressive and brutal empire like USA is. Another christian fundamentalist like GWB as president and i fear that Syria, Iran or another muslim country will get nuked by America.

Something stinks about this. Methinks Condi cooked this dish. Another scare tactic courtesy of Bush to shock us into believing we're threatened by outside forces. It's the inside ones who are our enemies. I hate GWB, CR, DC, DR. Any so-called reason they give for their despicable terrorist plots should be suspect. No such thing as morals in our neo-con, NWO White House. State Houses as well. PERVERTS!!!

I Think a nuk would of been much more efective in distroying our humanity. I don't know about you all But I am geting tired of this, Quit gagggin on pretzels and just finish the job. Its not like are children have a future @ this point.

Obviously this was like 9-11 an inside job to produce the next criminal preemptive war

The real reason behind this is that Musharraf only granted Bhutto amnesty and let her back into Pakistan so he could have her murdered, which he did. Now he needs to deal with a possible revolt against his dictatorship, led by the PPP, which is the strongest political force in that country against Islamic extremism and theocracy. Naturally the US government is far more interested in propping up "friendly" dictators who can provide us with fossil fuels than it is with actually stopping religious extremism and political oppression. The election here later this year won't change that, unfortunately, no matter who's elected, nor will a PPP takeover of government over there; 'tis simply the nature of all government, and indeed all criminal organizations, to show a violent disregard for the lives and property of others. Sad, really, that man hasn't yet outgrown this perverse inclination to form them, when all reason and history would dictate that it's folly to do so. I guess it's that same strange mental quirk that gives rise to religion.

Hum this seems like that USA is now making there foot strong in Pakistan and the next target after Afghanistan and Iraq is Pakistan....
are they really want to make peace in the world or just want to kill all the Muslims and want to be the king of the world ..
USA government is just killing there own peoples along with others.
since last few years USA had killed thousand of peoples just in the name of peace ,,is this really peace please concentrate on it...
Wake up world Wake up..

"if we stop the war the U.S will be attacked. "

This sounds like you watch too much TV, and get your news from Foxnews or CNN. This is exactly how fascist governments want their citizens to feel; "we are in danger, they are going to attack us". Whereas in reality USA has not been attacked on it's land for many many decades but has continously attacked other countries, with this idea in mind "they are going to attack us if we don't attack them". This is plain militarist propaganda. Do not believe such things. WAKE UP!!!

"We already went through 9/11 and we werent ready for that."

So catch those who did it. Put the neo-cons in jail for treason and killing their own citizens to create reasons for further invasions. WAKE UP!!!

"if we take our troops out, there will be massive problems for the U.S."

Do you really believe by keeping your troops all over the world instead of back home where they belong you are creating any security for yourself? Do you mean that the security of the American people is more important than all those thousands and thousands dead and dieing everyday as a result of US invasions or intervensions? Do you believe your armed forces can keep you safe from feeling the repercussions of all the suffering you create around the world?

Please inform yourselves correctly and turn off that TV. WAKE UP!!!

HAHAHAHA is it possible that Bhutto misspoke when she said Omar Said Sheik murdered UBL, instead of saying Daniel Pearl? Nooooo of course not... that doesn't fit into the vast ZIONIST SATANIC REPTOID conspiracy.

ohhhhh man

You people don't make any sense. Of course everyone wants peace and no more war but if we stop the war the U.S will be attacked. Do we really want that? We already went through 9/11 and we werent ready for that..but you people need to understand that if we take our troops out, there will be massive problems for the U.S.

Any Americans out there?

What are you waiting for to stop your military machine from destroying the world?

I do not think any Americans want to see the world in full retaliation and I'm aware it seems very unlikely considering the brutality of US tactics, but if you fail to stop this madness, your war machine attempt to hijack the world, sooner or later you'll be the ones to suffer. This is not a threat but a wish from you guys to stop it when it's time. Or do you think it is already too late?

CIA goes kills a leader (Bhutto in this case) to spark up conflict; mass media feeds lies to make it bigger (like 911 attacks being staged by non-American muslim forces) and creates fear ("Pakistan has nuclear weapons, they can attack israel") and the US army goes for yet another 'unsuccessful' invasion. We have seen this movie soooo many times it gets really frustrating now. Pakistan, like Iran, is too big a morsel to swallow for US anyway so this is another step towards the war-without-end. You can't be wanting this! So what are you going to do? (yes it is YOUR responsibility first)

So what's the plan of the peaceful American public to stop this gone-crazy war machine? Shall we expect some solution to this cancer from within US or despair and think of something from without?

Peace,

Eray from Turkey

NO MORE WAR!

We've had enough of wars.

STOP THIS MADNESS!

I don't think so! This might be a dream of some queer neocons, but US is broke: financially, morally and name it.

Go home Ami!

the americans have planted their nuclear weapons in israel for "safekeeping" as was stated recently by u.s govt. Pakistan should also keep its weapons safe by stationing them around the israeli borders in friendly countrys to ensure that these devils in human form, the zionists jews and so called chosen people are put in their place and to ensure the palestinians get the justice and human rights they deserve. i am sure you will find peace break out before you can blink.
the zionist jew is an existential threat to the muslim world and should be tackled in that form or the world will suffer accordingly.
If the muslim despots play the games of the jews and christians they will lose in both worlds, there is a master of this world and he is known as Allah and not any man or monkey, his will is what the muslim accepts and not any criminal murderers in tel aviv or washington.
peace to all believing people from all faiths.

The mujahiddeen have denied involvement. And they always announce the truth with respect to these operations.

So that leaves The americans.

This story confirms it. Plenty of visits and ending with a deal in December for amerika to enter Pakistan.

Then a few days later Bhutto is killed.

So instead of hunting down UBL or WMD, US Troops are going to train and support indigenous "counter-insurgency forces" and "clandestine counterterrorism units."

The People of Pakistan have every right to overthrow their tyrannical Government, in fact so do the American People. That doesn't make them 'insurgents or terrorists'! Blowback is such a *****!

SWELL-what happens when we run out of money? I guess that's the price of "making the world 'safe' for democracy" or facism,depending on what your definition is.

Has anyone seen Elvis, Benazir and Osama at a New Year's party in Dubai?

FACT CHECK REQUEST:

Speaking of Bin Laden, as other Bloggers have mentioned on your previous EW blog.

Al Jazeera [English] has posted a clip to 'YouTube' of Sir David Frost's interview with Ms. Bhutto on 02 Nov 07, in which the late Ms. Bhutto casually refers to the murder of Osama Bin Laden.

Does anyone have the facts on this comment?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oIO8B6fpFSQ&feature=related

http://www2.jumptv.com/seo/Frost_Over_The_World/Frost_Over_The_World.htm

Reposted from: Bin Laden Killed Bhutto? How Blind Can We Be? Section of EW blog.
---------------

Pete in the UK; just curious, is there any more information from overseas sources you have on this commet? Txs.

So now we are in three wars and still shooting for a fourth.

nothing will change until the bodies of the banksters,corporate criminals on wall street,and zionist pigs infesting the US government pile up in the morgues.

Ok everyone. Try to say PIPELINE all together now P-I-P-E-L-I-N-E. Very good. Can you not see what went down here ? Drag her back in, create chaos, knock her off, create REALLY BAD CHAOS, then bring in the US Troops to put everything in order and insure our old pal democracy once again. Its about OIL, and securing the pipeline. Please, enough of the Al CIAda joke.
Thanks,
DR

http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/december2007/281207_said.htm
This link will give you an clue why they killed her,It was NOT al Quida she was shot for being a big mouth listen to her when she talks of WHO KILLED OSAMA BIN LADEN.

The dark side of the moon is next. Get ready, Pakistan, for our bikini'd military elephantinas to be hanging out, and letting it all hang out, at the "mall" in Dera Ismail Khan. Maybe all that military hardware we, er, lost in "Eye-rack" is on sale there.

This is the day that the LARD has made, let us be glad and rejoice in it.

Drug money is the lifeblood of the world's Intelligence agencies. They work for the super rich. Globalism is their grand chessboard. Nationalism is the enemy of these vampires and they have no love for any Nation. Their defense of Israel is to maintain a safe haven if the people of the world try to prosecute them. Hence the "Samson Option" they use to threaten ALL governments of the world.

They make more money in one day of war than in a year of peace. So they always promote war.

Drug money is the lifeblood of the world's Intelligence agencies. They work for the super rich. Globalism is their grand chessboard. Nationalism is the enemy of these vampires and they have no love for any Nation. Their defense of Israel is to maintain a safe haven if the people of the world try to prosecute them. Hence the "Samson Option" they use to threaten ALL governments of the world.

They make more money in one day of war than in a year of peace. So they always promote war.

I'd love to see this agreement's details that now permits US troops into Pakistan to "train and support indigenous counter-insurgency." Just bet it required Bhutto's removal overtly or covertly since it's plain that she wouldn't have allowed it. Her murder looks less and less like a Kennedy tragedy and more and more like Wellstone.

Did Congress approve of this invasion by our military.

funding?

Obviously this is just a civil war, use of the military is limited to defense of this country against invasions.

Certianly the only obvious result of the US attack on Afganistan and Iraq was the destablization of the entire middle east.

Long live the word imperialists of the R and D political system. Corporatism over Constitution.

RON PAUL '08

The need for bhutto to die was the fact that she would not let American troops fully in Pakistans "business".After all we need to go after yo momma assamma.
Now that we have Iran virtually surrounded we can have a false flag operation such as a ship being "attacked" to open the gates of hell in the middle east.
GW will suspend elections making him the first dictator.
Hitler would have been proud.

Lets face it Bush and the Neo-Con's don't have a clue as to the problems of the Mid-East or any understanding of the people and thier culture.So much more could have been accomplished with a little HONEST diplomacy,but somewhere along the line we have lost that capability.....

It seems to me that the Super Rich 'Empirialists' have read 'MEMETICS AND THE MODULAR MIND'. I guess that they couldn't wait to test the theory. It looks bad for the American 'Pride' image. I think that it's time to call these Evangelists what they realy are: A sad lot of lost souls, led by a dark horse.

We have a new worldwide religion that goes by the name of 'ENERGY'...weather it be oil, nuclear, switchgrass, biodiesel etc...I see daily worship and killing in the name of it. There's hope though...I saw a flower, in the middle of winter, all by itself. I'm caring for it, NOW!

It seems to me that the Super Rich 'Empirialists' have read 'MEMETICS AND THE MODULAR MIND'. I guess that they couldn't wait to test the theory. It looks bad for the American 'Pride' image. I think that it's time to call these Evangelists what they realy are: A sad lot of lost souls, led by a dark horse.

We have a new worldwide religion that goes by the name of 'ENERGY'...weather it be oil, nuclear, switchgrass, biodiesel etc...I see daily worship and killing in the name of it. There's hope though...I saw a flower, in the middle of winter, all by itself. I'm caring for it, NOW!

Well Dimitry, the 'skinny guy' that shot Bhutto in the neck with a pistol could not have been carrying the explosive power that shattered the scene. Clearly, if he would had so much as a pack of gum in his pocket, his skinny frame would have made it visible.

The story coming out of Pakistan stated that the powerful bomb blast that killed twenty Pakistani nationals was ignited some twenty meters from the vehicle that Bhutto was in when she was shot at close range.

Conspiracy is defined as the agreement of two or more individuals to commit a crime. That being said, when one sees the video that shows the gunman on the back of the vehicle firing on Bhutto, and only seconds afterwards - a bomb then explodes some twenty meters away is beginning to make this claim of conspiracy more likely.

We know that ISI most likely would have been privvy to the information that disclosed Bhutto's route. If the ISI has been infiltrated by AQ, we can only speculate until new information becomes known.

Musharaff is in a difficult position with the death of Bhutto. Pakistan future is unsettling and those who hold the reigns have more trouble on their hands that they are capable of handling. If it was Musharaff behind this assassination, then he has miscalculated its effects, by what can be seen from the media reports.

The US policy on Pakistan may be in question at this point; but it is still up to their own leadership to be able to deal with their problems. In the not-to-distant past, the US had to ask permission ro enter their border to give chase to taliban and AQ members that had fleed across its border in order to escape. In many cases, US forces were denied entry. Nukes are a complication, and if AQ has any designs on usurping power to obtain them in Pakistan - they are taking their time to do anything about it at this point.

Pakistan - like Turkey - has been given the respect by the US to act on their own accord. AQ strongholds in Pakistan and their sudden interest to play havoc with its politics are not well documented in the news yet. I would not be so quick to pin the blame of this situation on President Bush as I would the ambition of AQ.

What will happen in Pakistan next? I will tell you that I will stay glued to CNN and other news agencies for further details

Aziz Huq writes smartly in "The Nation":

...

Compounding the problem has been American incompetence. As in Iraq, billions of dollars in aid have been frittered away through incompetence and carelessness, leaving the Pakistani army just as unwilling and unable to take on the Taliban's sanctuaries. Worse, there is no remedial plan on the horizon. Under American tutelage, the military has gotten fatter and more ham-fisted.

The Bush Administration's policy with respect to Pakistan, in short, is a train wreck. As usual, the White House has assumed that military force--here deployed by a vassal state--could clamp down on terrorism. As usual, it has utterly failed to understand complex relations, here the links between ISI and Al Qaeda going back to the Afghan war, and the way in which corruption and a drift to purely "faith-based" politics push more and more people toward the violently eschatological ideology of our enemies.

The Administration's Pakistan policy is worse than a shambles; its failures radiate out. It is fostering the erosion of what limited success there was in Afghanistan. It is feeding terrorist propaganda that claims America sustains tyrants. And it is impeding the long-term goal of a Pakistan that cannot serve as a terrorist safe haven or a training ground for recruits from the West.

The death of Benazir Bhutto shows that the Bush Administration has left itself no way out. Beyond the tragedy of Pakistan's history cruelly replaying itself, today should go down as the day it became clear how badly the Bush Administration has failed in the region. For on September 12, 2001, there was one failed state that could be a terrorist haven. Today, it is violently and tragically clear that the Administration's policies have wrought two more failed states that could, and likely will, sustain terrorist activities in the future.

Al-Qaeda claims Bhutto killing
By Syed Saleem Shahzad

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/South_Asia/IL29Df01.html

KARACHI - "We terminated the most precious American asset which vowed to defeat mujahideen." These were the words of al-Qaeda's top commander for Afghanistan operations and spokesperson Mustafa Abu al-Yazid, immediately after the attack that claimed the life of Pakistani politician Benazir Bhutto on Thursday (December 27). [Full story @ link.]

Daughter of tragedy
By Kamran Rehmat in Pakistan

"An inescapable aspect of the near-Greek tragedy governing the Bhutto family is how three members of the twice-elected prime minister's immediate family also fell prey to such grand ill-fortune."

http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/C4297A22-375E-4F23-9F4B-32AAA19D2ACC.htm

Today is indeed sad day for the nation state of Pakistan and people of Pakistan; my condolences.

But maybe some blog Readers would be interested in how very complex this political story really is...

Pakistan: The "Other" Bhutto
BY Sharmeen Obaid-Chinoy
14 December 07

Make sure to WATCH the video clip....

http://www.pbs.org/frontlineworld/blog/2007/12/pakistan_the_ot.html#

You know, even if AQ claims they did it, we cannot know. If Musharraff, the ISI, or the Pakistani Military was involved - AQ can still claim they did it. It doesn't make any differnce who did it, but what we do next is important - I will agree with you there.

Here's a distinct possibillity: Someone would have to been privilidged with Bhutto's schedule to plan ahead for this 'quasi-coup'. That makes it look as if may have actually have been done by some component of The Pakistan gov't. Now, that is true. Like you said, maybe we should be there to keep a close eye on the nuke weps...

Seven years of seven pillars. Yesterday, Bhutto was armless, but her words sound like a nay playing Pakistani history as if it were the wrath of Khan. The world will mourn for her rest.

==What happens next? Very good question.............==

We won't have to wait long. I expect some movement on our venerable terrorism color code system shortly. There is a new AQ message on the way (Reuters reporting_) and the electronic "chatter" must be off the scale.

Hope I am wrong.

Well Dimitry, I have read several accounts of this event. Few stories have agreed what happened. Was a sniper/rifle involved - when she popped up for less than a minute? Maybe. Was it a man with a pistol - and a radio-controlled bomb srapped to the vehicle that was set off when he began to fire? There isn't even a chain of evidence. That is what really sucks here...

Here's the thing. This event didn't take place in the US; can we be sure of the evidence that was gathered? There isn't even going to be an autopsy; that automatically looks like a cover-up. In this country, any death that occurs without an attending physician present - by law - must have an autopsy. I think we will may never know - given the circumstances that have taken place in Pakistan. There is no 'chain of evidence'.

Who could have done it? One internet newspaper stated that Bhutto sent an email to (?) that somehow ended up in the hands of Wolf Blitzer, that stated if she were to be killed; then Musharraf was somehow to blame. Another paper claimed that the Pakistani military or the ISI was probably to blame. And I will admit - under these circumstances with no other way to differenciate the evidence - that they are equally capable and culpable.

I do know that the only one that actually profited from this would be the oil industry and especially - the speculators that control that market.

I am not disagreeing with you, I'm just saying that we may never know. The US - of all the possible suspects - had no motive at all - that I can see. In fact, the death of Bhutto really screwed us over. I am pretty certain that it wasn't in our best interests - I can see that much - pretty clearly. What happens next? Very good question.............

whoever ordered the hit clearly decided it was better to get it done before US troops arrived there.

There is no reason only one gunman was involved. It would be hard for a close-up suicide bomber to get a right vantage pont for well-aimed neck shot at a target above the vehicle roof. A sniper from a high place will be much easier and a classic from our history.

Reports also say there was no autopsy on the body. So the "sucide bomber with gun" version would become official with no bullet evidence or an autopsy to contradict it. However, it is probably the military trained sniper in a nearby building that actually killed her. In a military controlled garrison town. Hmm.

There are two concerns. One is that this is a AQ-ISI operation to foment chaos in Pakistan prior to a large scale terrorist attack on the US mainland, which will occur in a few days. Another is that our concern over developing AQ-ISI ties will trigger an over-reaction on our part, which will most likely take a form of a ill-conceived attempt to drop several US teams to take control of Pakistani nukes. It is hard to imagine the fallouts from either disaster.

Well, there is a problem here. Witnesses claim the saw a gunman firing at Bhutto. First reports claim the sound of a pistol shot.

A pistol - when fired - makes a distinctive 'popping' sound, and a rifle shot makes a distintive 'crack' noise. It is already part of the report; which report do you want to accept? If nothing else, it goes to prove what I said earlier; who was the reporter that first filed the story? Is there a cover-up at the scene? If we can see a change of info in the press, we may be seeing a cover-up.. Just a thought to consider.......

Garrison town, sniper, "clean-up" suicide bomber...looks like the old gang (AQ+ISI) is back together again. I guess I would check on those nukes, after all...

-------------------------------------------
The attack bore hallmarks of the Qaeda-linked militants in Pakistan. But witnesses described a sniper firing from a nearby building, raising questions about how well the government had protected her in a usually well-guarded garrison town and fueling speculation that government sympathizers had played a part.
-------------------------------------------
www.nytimes.com

I think america need a hitler or a putin to get everything right here in amerca.

Bomb,bomb,bomb,Karachi!

Silly sod...

Just a request to the US/Mossad snipers thats going to be doing all the shooting and bombing to both sides over there to get a civil war going...will you please not shoot the chefs we need them for our curry houses over here in the UK...They are the ones with funny looking hats a chequered pants and whistle to the tune of Vinda Loo.

Looks like Pakistan going to get the good old USA treatment they learned from the British...that old trick of devide and conquer.
And if you think that voting for Ron Paul is going to make any differance to any problems now with Uncle Sam then forget it...they will just bump him off like they did with your JFK...the day they did him JFK was the end of your once great country the end of your freedom,liberty and justice for all. Mr Super Rich is calling the shots now so look out Pakistan your about to be Iraq'ed.

Fema in NYC on day of 911... US troops in Pakistan right after agency assets take out Benezir Bhitto........ in the words of the church lady.............

HOW CONVENIENT!!!!!!!!!

Western intelligence is likely behind the attack. This is an old ploy used by the New World Order to destabilize the region so that the people there start killing each other, thus reducing the population and causing tyranny. By doing so, the country will remain a dictatorship and in the control of the New world Order. They don't care that the people start killing each other...they want it, and they want it to continue forever. Once they reduce the population it will be easier to control the people. They want the people to turn on each other.

The goal is very simple. Keep Americans scared and dumbed down. As soon as the Super Bowl is over, look for a hot war to start in Pakistan/Iran. The Neo Cons need another war to keep Americans scared and keep the welfare checks rolling into Apartheid Israel. The same Neo Cons that invented "Al Quida" and other assorted fairy tales to spoon feed to the American people are now working overtime to manufacture the next boogy man. We have come to the point where the New York Times is now nothing more than a mouth piece for the zionist traitors within. It is no longer just "FAUX NEWS" (MURDOCH's FOX) that is lying to the American people...

CNN, NBC, ABC... they are all to blame for helping the zionist traitors within push their message of fear, hate and un Americanism upon our great Nation.

There stands one glimmer of hope on the horizon. There stands a man who is ready to fight to bring back the rule of law to our great American Nation. There is a man who wants to shed entangling alliances, a man who knows that when you surrender liberty for security, you in effect, get neither... this man is Dr. Ron Paul.

Ron Paul 08'

Bush-Cheney: Gravediggers of America!

Well -'nameless' - Afghanistan is not a lush and richly foliated region. It is mostly semi-arid and in higher elevations. You cannot compare it to growing weed clandestinely as it it done in the US. We are talking about apples and oranges here. If the junkies in Europe, Russia, and the US get sick and go without - then they will just learn to go without. If one can make heroin from codeine; even the codeine has its roots in the supply of opium and its point of origin. we need the will to stop it, stop its damage to the future. We cannot stop the past damage that it has done; be we can learn from those mistakes. And 'nip it in the bud' means to stop something before it has the chance to continue. That's all..............

"Growing the opium poppies are not done in clandestine fields. Its not comparable to pot; that is not a proper perspective.

Tha Afghans have tens of thousands of acres that can be seen from the air; there is nothing to hide it. It does require the will to stop it, though.

To produce the hectares of opium that Afghanistan is putting out for export, large acreages are responsible to supply the illegal output levels. It is a lot simpler to stop it by eradication programs.

Another option is to supply alternative crops that have value to their own people, and to export to local counries for trade.

This concept beats the snot out of the damage it has inflicting in the past. The future of Afghanistan's poppy affects all of us - either directly or indirectly."

Hmmm... You've never heard of camouflage, have you? Like I said, you start trying to eradicate the opium crop, you will fail. Sure, you can destroy a large percentage of visible opium crops, but you can always conceal crops by intermingling them with "legitimate" crops. And, as I said, all you'll do is jack the price up globally. This doesn't wean addicts off heroin or morphine, it means they'll go to greater lengths to obtain their drug of addiction.
The opium crop is comparable to cannabis cultivation in the Western world, as (at least in my part of the world) commercial cannabis crops are either grown hydroponically, under lights at home, or dispersed through bushland, of which we have a plentiful supply. And what happens when there's a bad season for bushfires? Supply is strangled, the price of pot goes up, the quality goes down. Do you seriously think that, even if they wanted to, any government could completely eradicate their opium trade? They can't even find Bin Laden in that terrain, nor defeat the Taliban, and you think they'll divert that much military power to wiping out vegetation? As well as destroying their ability to maximise their income in a country with bugger- all infrastructure and savage intertribal conflicts?
No-one is proposing "doing nothing," but some half- arsed idea of eradicating the Afghan opium industry by destroying all visible crops will have only two effects: The price of opiates and their derivatives skyrockets, and the thinly- spread military forces on the ground will lose what little support they have from local warlords and ethnic/ tribal leaders.
Promote alternative crops for export? Sure, YOU try telling Third- World farmers and their chiefs that they'd be better off growing soy beans, because Opium is illegal in your country. How about education in the societies affected by opiate abuse? You can't kill off supply, the "war on drugs" has proved this much. What you can do is try to kill off demand.

Remember marine barrack attacks in Lebanon in 1983?

If the US troops arrive in Pakistan, they may receive the similar treatment of large-scale bomb attacks.

If this happen, it will give Bush an excellent opportunity to attack Pakistan. At least Ronald Reagan saw the Middle East affairs as "irrational" and wuithdrew after barrack attack.

If the US really wanted Osama Bin Laden he would have long been a victim of a hellfire missile from a preditor drone. As long as there is a boogey man, a phantom almost invisible on the loose, the Military Industrial Complex can continue to mint arms and munitions. Al Queda is an enemy made in heaven for the power elite in the US who Cheney and Bush answer to.
With 70% of Americans including servicemen and women opposed to the war, wishing a pullout and increasingly suspicious of US intelligence against Iran, the US needed another strategy to maintain and prolong a military presence in the middle east. They now have it. The fact that this will put further pressure on oil prices doesn't hurt the oil based administration in Washington.
There should be concerns in Washington about an unstable nation possessing nuclear weapons but then again Washington may have contributed to the instability and the administration is no stranger to taking big risks.
There are a lot of very perceptive posts in this thread and I encourage everyone to spend time going through them.

US is doomed to fail in Afghanistan, Iraq and Pakistan. Pakistan is already lost. US does not know who they are messing with.

Hum... Pakistan is now living without a Western Puppet Master..

Musharif ran out of usefullness to the West, so the were going depose him, and put in Bhuto as figurehead.

Bang Bang,, the figurehead is dead.

Now Pakistan is unstable, it has nukes, it hates the West, and the Zionists who started the mess, have their hands full..

The special forces are going there to secure the nukes.Hello.....

Well Dimitry, I think that motives speak louder than newspapers. And big money and oil moves things. You may be right; but I am pretty sure the speculators of oil futures are still behind this. Yes it's my opinion. But it is not without foundation - either....

9/11 was an inside job.. OBL had no hand in it. Bush just blamed it and everything they need on Al-Qaeda to get his war agenda started. Al-Qaeda seems to be a phony set up.. can never be caught and is always seen to be at a place so Bush can drop bunker buster bombs.

Legalize freedom and imagine whirled peas

Here is what sounds like an actually informed source, from the NY Sun, of all papers:

------------------------------------------
...
The assassination is particularly troubling for American policy. For the last year the State Department in particular has tried to broker a power sharing agreement between Mr. Musharraf and Bhutto, reasoning that Mr. Musharraf alone lacked the legitimacy to wage a full military war against Al Qaeda. In 2006, Pakistan's military cut a series of agreements with the governates of the federally administered tribal areas on the border with Afghanistan, giving local tribal leaders the equivalent of home rule. The Al Qaeda leader, Osama bin Laden, and his deputy Ayman al Zawahiri are believed by American intelligence agencies to reside in these areas. American forces in Afghanistan on occasion will fire missiles at select targets in these areas and Pakistan's military will claim official credit. Over the last year however, it became clear to American policy makers that a sustained ground offensive would be needed to disrupt Al Qaeda's new home base.

Secretary of State Rice today urged Pakistanis to remain calm. "The deadly results of this attack will no doubt test the will and patience of the people of Pakistan," she said. "We urge the Pakistani people, political leaders, and civil society to maintain calm and to work together to build a more moderate, peaceful, and democratic future."

The vice president for research at the Foundation for Defense of Democracies, Daveed Gartenstein Ross, said the assassination of Bhutto made an overt American military campaign less likely.

"This undercuts the case for a massive military intervention, massive air strikes, or the insertion of ground forces," he said. "It was unrealistic previously because it would result in Musharraf being toppled. If Bhutto had somehow shored up Musharraf's legitimacy, it could perhaps have made a stronger case for military intervention in Pakistan, because Bhutto could possibly have sanctioned it without being toppled from power. With Bhutto dead, we will be unlikely to see the kind of figure needed to emerge in Pakistan that would allow for military intervention."
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http://www.nysun.com/article/68672?page_no=2
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So...AQ wants to make a massive American invasion of Pakistan impossible...Why would one be in the offing soon...You do the math.

I say NO!

STOP THE MADNESS!

No U.S. troops to Pakistan. Not to anywhere else!

This is a red herring - a fish hook put out to We, The People - to see how we'll bite.

I'm tired of war. Bring back our kid soldiers!

NO MORE WAR!

Maybe you are right, Dimitry. I don't know about that one. Right now, I am concerned for the Bhutto incident.

The motive behind this was to destabilize Pakistan. Who benefitted from this? Who needs to destabilize an already fragile situation? Someone that wants to see oil prices go up - perhaps? Did you read today's paper? The oil giants are going to raise prices because they are worried about the situation. All they need is a reason to raise their prices, and they do.. I think the oil speculators look pretty guilty to me right now....

To reiterate the obvious:

Afghanistan's Masood (head of Nothern Alliance) was assasinated a couple of days prior to Septermber 11, 2001. Professional AQ squad posing as a TV crew did that job.

ILL TAKE A DUMP ON YOUR COUNTRY, AFTER IM DONE BURNING IT TO THE GROUND! BAW HAW HAW, I AM IN CONTROL, AND I WILL RULE THE WORLD I SEZZ TO YOU I SEZZ! OH, AND RON PAUL, YOU BETTER JUST SIT DOWN BOY!!!

The Secret Service, FBI, CIA, or any other US agency would have used a sniper rifle; this wasn't the US that was behind this event.

This was done by a paid amateur that was probably promised legal help if he was caught or captured. He became a sacrificial 'terrorist' after the fact that a pre-planted radio-controlled bomb went off after he fired the shot. Then the bomber pushed the button; the shot was the signal to detonate the bomb. The shooter had no idea he was about to be sacrificed. You know - a 'patsy'...

The end effect? Well, the bomb makes the whole event look look a terrorist effort. This is why it was necissary to do it in such a fashion to create an aura of confusion to follow..

Usually, a small-calibre weapon up close to the head is how assassinations have been done with this mode of operation. Who knew ahead of time that US Special Forces were going to Pakistan - in advance of the media? This was planned when they found that info out. Someone went a long way to lay this at the feet of the US..

One more point I need to clear up: the nearest people to the event that survived were disoriented due to the shock wave of the blast. So, who was the reporter closest to the scene that broke the story?

This looks bloody confusing. A kill shot to the neck would suggest the work of a professional, the secret service type. The bomb blast is indicative of terrorists. Together they suggest an effort to obfuscate.

The US had a choice just now between the lawyers or the generals in Pakistan. It - well, the administration - chose the generals. Just like Iran thirty years ago we may end up with the mullahs in control of Pakistan - and the nukes - instead.

Precarious indeed.

I am not so sure it was the US that did this.

Somebody felt it could have been the right time to pull this off just after we arrive. That, in itself - is quite suspicious...

Who else has the motives to promote this detstablization? What have the oil markets done today? Who are the oil speculators?

A gunman shoots Bhutto, and then blows himself and others up? Why bother to shoot then? Why not just detonate the bomb - as was done earlier this year twards Bhutto? It looks to me as if the gunman was unaware that a bomb was set to go off. That bomb very well could have been already planted there - the gunman might not have known a thing about it. Gunmen, as modes of operation go - generally flee the scene or are caught with a pistol in their hand. But that is not what happened. After the shooting, a bomb goes off and then the crime scene is sanitized by the explosion. That is what I see so far.

Let's keep in mind that the people that were closest to the event are probably still in shock. They cannot be reliable witnesses at this point. But the media covers the event and we hear the 'official story' from them first. Now, that makes real sense to me so far. I didn't say that I like this - or even believe what I have heard. Keep this in mind.........

Well, I guess if it will escalate the demise of US, we should welcome them to Pakistan...

Behold all you doubters who question the legitimacy of the Glorious United States. Our fearless leader, anointed by the MOST HIGH, shall lead where all men fear to tread. It is the destiny of the United States to rule the World for the Glory of GOD. If you are of military age, go at once and enlist in the Holy Crusade to rid the World of that which is repugnant to our great Leader Bush. If you are deceived by false promises of freedom and liberty from Ron Paul, then know you will be embarrassed. Our Saviour Abraham Lincoln welded the Union together, so we are strong. All that is good is embodied in the Holy United States. The MOST HIGH works through our fearless leader, George Bush, to bring the benefit of Americanism to the world. Be proud. Be Red.

Bush got what he wanted.

Now the USA can have more of a presence in the middle east to make up more stories about wmd's, which in turn, will get the dumbest people in America, (FOX viewers, Hannity supporters, O'Reilly lovers, etc...) to get behind the man who is laughed and spit at across the globe, the one who wasn't elected into the White House, but appointed by his friends on the Supreme Court.

September 11th 2001, was "blow back" for USA's involvement in the Middle East over the last half century.

I wonder what else will happen to the USA next.

Let us all keep in mind that, Putin supports Iran, (which I believe truly does want to get along with the USA) and Russia apparently has weapons that can be launched and reach a six thousand mile away target.

What is wrong with Americans?

Do we expect the next president to not use Bush's history as a precedent when they do something illegal?

We get what we ask for.

Enjoy the New Year.

Corey Mondello
Boston, Massachusetts
cpmondello@yahoo.com
www.CoreyMondello.com
12-27-07

I am really quite shocked to hears of Bhutto's assassination. Shot by a gunman - and then the gunman detonates a bomb? Verrrry strange...... And this all happens just after we send in our Special Forces teams? Where were they? Who was assigned the duty of protecting Bhutto? Who is doing the follow-up investigation?

Somehow, someway, we must elect Dr. Ron Paul President of these United States. Without him, we, as a nation, are going to face an unending series of wars across the globe. Rather than tend to our own problems, too numerous to mention, we seem hell bent on satisfying the greed of TPTB, and destroying our neighbors around the world.

ONE THING... DON'T USE THE WORD 'PAKI'

Who are the 'redcoats', now? It is US.

wow people taking this way serious!

George Bush is going to read this and change his mind! However its a bad idea to keep interfiering with other countries. Providing aid is one thing but gettin involved american style such as they did in Iraq is another.

I think teaching Pakis to kill each other more efficiently is an excellent idea, we certainly can't have enough dead brown people. Let's get rid of those old fashioned assault rifles and give them a dose of the good stuff. Automatic grenade launchers, shoulder fired anti tank weapons, give them helicopters and fighter jets, give them napalm, sarin and VX. Let there be an orgy of blood the likes of which the modern world has never seen!!!!!
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And then, we can invade the country to overthrow a bloodthirsty dictator who is menacing his countrymen, his neighbors and us with those weapons, we can haul down his statues, put him jail and snap off his head with a hangmans noose while his enemies jeer at him.
Maybe then they'll like us and learn to obey and if not, we can do it all again, and again, and again...

We have got to stopped this insanity of intervention. Don't let the Military industrial complex suck us into this any further. This has nothing to do with the security of the United States. This only makes us less secure. People..we need to get out and vote. Vote for the only candidate that understands this. Ron Paul

Well now I guess the picture is getting clear

secret operatives have done it again now it is the turn of Bhutto assassinated .

CIA involvement? could be.
The Evil dictators are at it again.

Soon in a close future humanity is going to have to stand up again't these bad evil people.

Since elements of the CIA and other western intelligence agencies are heavily involved in international drug trafficking (as supported by their own documents, their own agents, agencts of others countries, and Iran Contra) I highly doubt there is going to be any effective program to truly fight the drug trade. Too much mone being made among other things.

Unfortunately it is starting to look the same with terrorism. Our republic is crumbling from all of this stuff, and people are compeltely distracted by Paris Hilton.

Whe this tab comes due,(and it will)it's going to cost everything...

Only hope for America and the rest of the world:

www.aLoveLetterToAmerica.com

Connecting dots:

Bhutto killed, we go into Pakistan

Saudis and Egyptians attack us, we go into Iraq and Afghanistan

Makes perfect sense.

Impeach Bush & Co.!

"Elect a non-Republican, any non Republican I say! "

Sorry to pee on your utopian political simplicity, but the only anti-war candidate for President with a slim chance of winning in Ron Paul. He's a Republican. Clinton, Obama, Edwards, et al want to continue the war because they all get their advice from the CFR.

VA_Lady2007
What a truly arrogant and ignorant statement from a typical ignorant, brainwashed and propaganda stuffed american with no sense of history what-so-ever. You wrote "this is precisely the method by which we got sucked into Vietnam. " Did you really believe that or did learn about it from fox news? In Vietnam as in Pakistan right now, nobody invited you to their rescue. You are always looking for a pretext to invade other peoples land in your quest to dominate the world. Go read a real decent history book for a change, it will open up new vistas for you and your kind and hopefully learn to spare the world from your murderous aggression.

Bhutto assasinated.

Is it in our interest to stand up another non-government irregular army of shifting loyalties in this region?

Bhutto's assassination earlier this morning may make deployment of US SOF inadequate... securing Pakistan nuclear weapons is a top national priority.

The troops will start out as advisors and trainers. Then, when it comes time for the Paks to do their stuff, they'll discover (as have our troops in Iraq) that the locals are either not capable or unwilling to do the job on their own. So the Marines, most likely, will go out with them. Pretty soon, the Paks will be dumping their weapons and the Marines, yet again, will be fighting someone else's war.

They might come around, if we hang around and fertilize the rocks with American blood long enough. The Iraqis, some of them at least, have done so. But at what cost to us all?

Does this sound at all familiar? It should: this is precisely the method by which we got sucked into Vietnam. Now Deserter George and Our Draft Dodger Vice Dick wouldn't know about that, having deserted, and dodged the draft, respectively.

Deserter George, apparently being unable to read, wouldn't even know about it from a history book, but this is EXACTLY what has happend in Iraq.

Let's spread what we've got even thinner, on a fruitless, wasteful, bloodletting which won't accomplish ANYTHING except to sully the good name (what's left of it) of Lady America even further, if possible.

Please do not send your troops to Pakistan.By commiting this act of aggession the United States will make more enemies.May I also advise the peace loving people of America that it is in their interest to support the people of Pakistan.The policy of supporting an undemoratic President who has subverted the constitution of Pakistan will not be of any help to USA.

i don't know why all the times governments think about resolving problems with forces while they could discuss and resolve these problems with peaceful talks.we must respect human beings all over the world.

The best thing to do is to train and equip the paramilitary using the local resources. Think that they are also from the same group of people who are in conflict with the Pakistani Army. The paramilitary troops have almost similar mentality, similar views towards the foreign forces as their brethern have. Why do you think a group of 150-200 men lay down their arms without fighting a shot. This phenomenon is not new. 100 years ago when Britishers tried to contain these people, they suffered heavy loses and it was only after it that they named this area FATA and put it under control of local or fderally appointed political agents. The presence of American or any other country's forces can undermine the country's sovereignity and freedom too.

As far as US forces going into Pakistan, I really do not see the need to involve our troops where they are not needed.

Pakistan's ISI are quite capable to do their jobs without the need for our Special Forces.

Let's hurt trrorism and hurt the narco trade. Hit them where it really hurts terrorists and their friends the most - in their wallet.

"This concept beats the snot out of the damage it has inflicting in the past"---------- Correction:
Read- "This concept can beat the snot out the future damage that is likely to occur if we do nothing at all".

Growing the opium poppies are not done in clandestine fields. Its not comparable to pot; that is not a proper perspective.

Tha Afghans have tens of thousands of acres that can be seen from the air; there is nothing to hide it. It does require the will to stop it, though.

To produce the hectares of opium that Afghanistan is putting out for export, large acreages are responsible to supply the illegal output levels. It is a lot simpler to stop it by eradication programs.

Another option is to supply alternative crops that have value to their own people, and to export to local counries for trade.

This concept beats the snot out of the damage it has inflicting in the past. The future of Afghanistan's poppy affects all of us - either directly or indirectly.

"It's quite simple - really. To divert opium production in Afghanistan to other useful crops will deny the source of drug addiction. That is a stone fact. You cannot inject what you cannot get. Russia is also bitten with the same problem, they would also benifit from stopping the major producer and exporter of opium. I can no longer tolerate international organized crime from benefitting from what is gathered in Afghanistan. These same crime bosses also provide arms, ammo, and supplies to destabilize Karzai's government and allow for the continuing export of opium. It is just that simple. I have not insulted you as you have done to me."

It seems as though some people, not just the one I have quoted here, are oblivious to the extensive uses for opium production. Morphine, Pethadine, and Codeine are all derivatives of Opium. Any second- year Chemistry student (in my country, anyway) would be able to synthesise heroin from codeine. In fact, it was a question on a 2nd- year paper at the University of Sydney, several years ago. Naturally, there was an outcry, but those "concerned" citizens could all go and get stuffed. You don't teach an Apprentice to assemble an engine without teaching them how to pull one apart.
You can try to eradicate the opium production in Afghanistan, just like trying to eradicate all other "illegal" crops, but you will fail. That is a fact. I know this because Cannabis is illegal, yet I am offered pot at least once a day when I walk through my old neighbourhood. It's hard enough to eradicate noxious weeds, when no-one benefits from their growth, let alone a lucrative crop that has wide- ranging medical and pharmaceutical benefits.
The fact is, that after another foreign invasion of their country, or collection of tribal areas, opium production has become a viable cash crop, and the supply routes are being manned and protected be the foreign invaders. How do you think the U.S. got ANY local backing for their invasion? By bribing local warlords, especially in the South, whose Opium crops had been decimated by the Taliban.
Do you feel any guilt or remorse for the fact that farmers in your countries grow barley, hops, malt, wheat etc. that contribute to alcoholism? Why, in the "war on drugs," do we not include alcohol? Or tobacco? Alcoholism affects far more families directly than heroin or cocaine addiction, and it's completely legal. Smoking- related diseases kill more people than all other drug deaths and motor vehicle accidents combined.
Personally, I think that all Western governments should decriminalise all drugs, which would drop the value of illegal crops immediately. Import and tax the goods- even better, grow the crops domestically- and put the tax revenue gained into health and education. Perhaps if our own societies weren't so far from ideal, and people (especially the young) weren't looking for something to add something into their miserable lives, then drugs of addiction such as alcohol, tobacco, heroin and cocaine might not hold such appeal.
Cutting off the supply only makes the price go up, and the addicts more desperate. Just see what happens when you force addicts into cold- turkey quitting.

as part of an effort to train and support indigenous counter-insurgency forces and clandestine counterterrorism.

Hey what happened, in the old days we preferred the term advisors?

Here we go again. Has Oliver North been secretly redeployed to the bowels of the White House yet!

Let me see, a kid that is currently in the Boy Scouts, should be somewhere between 12 and 16 years of age. If the Republicans retain the presidency of the United States in 2008, these kids will likely grow up just in time to be drafted and deployed to fight in a muslim country around 2013.

So why don't we just go ahead and provide our pre-teens and teenagers with some actual military training right now, while they are still in the Boy Scouts. At the very least we could create more realistic military video games for them to practice on.

It is clear to me that if some Americanw get their way, current 7th and 8th graders will be seeing real action in a muslim country in less than a decade.

Why, because the policies of their Republican parents continue to create more and more enemies for America in the muslim and arab world?

Elect a non-Republican, any non Republican I say!

So Mary, what is it that you bring to the party?

Pakistan has elections soon and anything can happen so good luck and watch your back.

By the way, what happened to our debate on Iran, which you and your brother were roundly loosing? Didn't you promise to come back with all kinds of logical and legal arguments showing how my position is wrong?

Well, I am still waiting. Of coarse you and your brother may be too busy sending your "analysis" to the White House, in which case I certainly understand your silence.

==Wanna watch someone you you get bit by the dragon again? Then do nothing, be nothing and say nothing.==

And by the way, you can drop the fake "junky jive". It is highly unconvincing.

==If you hit the domino that exists in Afghanistan - corruption - wherever or whomever it may be - will likewise fall over -DIMITRY==

I guess I am flattered that I made such a strong impression on you that you "see" me everywhere. While I am one, there are many of us who don't want to have our country become a rogue nation under control of overgrown boys with small brains and big guns.

==Take out the opium growers by destroying their crops - and watch all of the dominoes fall over. And I want to add this thought - too: and Good Riddance to the opium fields and the Taliban and international organized crime that have kept them supplied with weapons, ammo, and money that support the Taliban, Al Qaida, and the junkies in Russia and the US that make them rich. ==

Wasn't the Taleban pretty much the only regime that had the opium growing stopped in Afghanistan?

And didn't the opium trade get restarted in Afghanistan under the American occupation/Karzai government?

Since we have only about 50,000 western troops in Afghanistan, which are very busy holding the line on the surging Taleban, how do we "stop" the opium growing all over Afghanistan, when we are trying the get friendly with the very farmers that grow it, so they support us and the Karzai government?

Do you suffer from some kind of weird amnesia, where you operate only in the present, completely oblivious to even the recent past history? If the Taleban stopped opium production and we took out the Taleban, why are you incensed that the opium production has restarted? It pays a lot better than walnuts or pistachios, or whatever we are trying to tell these farmers to grow.

The only "dominoe" that will fall after we spray half of Afghanistan with poison will be any residual support the Karzai "government" still has outside of Kabul.
-------------------------------------------

As to Arkin's reporting, I am not sure that starting another civil war in a Muslim country is in our interest as part of the "War on Terror". Economic development sounds like a much better strategy. Arming independence minded Pakistani tribes with modern weapons will likely create an environment for long-term civil strife in the region and further erosion of the power of the state, facilitating furtile ground for another 4th generation conflict.

I thought we were supposed to be against this sort of thing, not for it. I am afraid our brave leaders are still fighting tactical battles, while the strategic initiative has long slipped away from their unimaginative grasp.

If you think that it is not possible to take it out at the source, you may be wrong and you may be right. It is the source of the majority of opium. It is the source that comes to the US and Russia. It is time to try, rather than sit on butts and do nothing. If this uncovers corruption; then let the chips fall where it may. But this is not the time to do nothing at all - when the source can be whacked. Wanna watch someone you you get bit by the dragon again? Then do nothing, be nothing and say nothing.

Friend... You will ALWAYS be able to buy heroin. Price is NO OBJECT. It just adds up to more murder and mayhem on the streets as the prices go up and addicts need to steal more.

End of Drug Econ 1.

You flunk.

The only people who would gain from a strategy of 'strangling the supply'(not feasible, as anyone operating in the upper levels of powder-world have already paid off anyone who could possibly bust them)are the drug lords, and their friends who get to spend billions of misused dollars every year to fight their quite misnamed 'war on drugs'.

It's a 'war for control of the drug trade'.

It's quite simple - really. To divert opium production in Afghanistan to other useful crops will deny the source of drug addiction. That is a stone fact. You cannot inject what you cannot get. Russia is also bitten with the same problem, they would also benifit from stopping the major producer and exporter of opium. I can no longer tolerate international organized crime from benefitting from what is gathered in Afghanistan. These same crime bosses also provide arms, ammo, and supplies to destabilize Karzai's government and allow for the continuing export of opium. It is just that simple. I have not insulted you as you have done to me.

Plainfacto, you are wrong about two things... ...and one of them is: I'm NOT Dimitry.

The other is You don't seem to think that even a 10% portion of the foreign aid budget (including mil-expenses) allocated to Afghanistan/Pakistan/Iraq/South Asia etc. could make a dent in drug addiction, treatment, and it's concurrent decriminalization?

What have YOU been smoking?

The ounce of effort to remove the supply is far more simple to accomplish than the pound of effort exerted to deal with the after effects to police, prosecution, jail, hospitalization, and let's not forget the cost of human lives. Your arguments are stupid and self-centered DIMITRY.

Methinks the emphasis needs to be on WHY Heroin & Methamphetamines are so popular in the West.

The demand is a lot simpler, and less bloody, to eliminate.

Also remember that cars don't run on heroin power... They run on petrochemicals, and methamphetamines are not a component of the high tech metals needed to build a B-2 bomber.... but Manganese, Chromium, and Molybdenum are...

If you hit the domino that exists in Afghanistan - corruption - wherever or whomever it may be - will likewise fall over -DIMITRY

D'evidence suggests OBL has been dead since Dec 2002. He died in a Pakistan military hospital. It unclassified common knowledge and anyone continuing to lie for the Bush administration does so at the peril of the genuine United States government. Live free or die

D'evidence suggests OBL has been dead since Dec 2002. Died in a Pakistan military hospital. It unclassified common knowledge and anyone continuing to lie for the Bush administration does so at the peril of the genuine United States government. Live free or die

...and let's see... When Eschievera was president of Mexico in the 60s, according to documentation by the National Security Archive, he was an ACTIVE CIA ASSET!

Want to capture the real narco-terrorists?

Storm the White House/State Department/Justice Department... Not Afghanistan & Pakistan.

That may very well be true - Buff. One needs to remember that Afghanistan suppies ninety percent of the available opiates. Myanmar and Indo-China (Vietnam, Cambodia, Laos) are also suppliers; the N Koreans have been know to smuggle their product to the US. Now South America and Mexico grows enough for personal consumption and some makes its way to the US via the Mexican Mafia.

Actually, I understand Methamphetamine labs are in vogue now... at least in Myanmar:

http://www.google.com/search?q=myanmar+methamphetamine

Capture bin Laden? You must be joking. You REALLY think they want to capture him? When you look at his bogusly inflated history, you see what a pathetic figure he is. Watch THE POWER OF NIGHTMARES, a BBC 3-hour special. It is on the Web. Free. It shows what a joke this war on terror really is. As others have said, it is just to secure the oil and related resources. The war on terror is merely a surrogate for the USSR so we always have a scary enemy, justifying egregious military spending and extension into other lands. Elect Ron Paul or Dennis Kucinich and see how long this lasts. How long? Until the one elected is murdered.

last evening i had the pleasure of watching "CHARLIE WILSON'S WAR". this is recommended viewing for anyone that wishes to know some of the history behind our support of the mujahadeen in afghanistan in their war with the soviets during the 70s. everyone should also read the book; afghanistan: the bear trap. this would give everyone a lot of insight into the "dirty deeds" of the u.s. neo-cons and the cia. the newest book coming out on this subject is "EXPLODING MANGOES". ANYWAY, u.s. involvement in pakistan will amount to nothing more than a huge waste of american taxpayers dollars(do we really need more?) and will result in the same endgame dirty poll that the u.s played in their dealings with pakistan and the mujahadeen that resulted in the taliban in the first place. u.s. troops on pakistani soil will also erupt in violence and create many new enemies. do we really need more enemies? and would bin laden be captured? not hardly!! and no doubt the chinese will welcome u.s. special forces on their doorstep. the presence of u.s. forces on pakistani soil is a recipe for disaster. but then of course, hasn't the bush whitehouse been nothing more than one endless foreign policy disaster already? read a book and see a movie over the holidays. and then you can decide for yourselves. i think you may see my point.

The Taliban were defeated once before; it can surely happen again. We need to act with Putin and make this a joint counter narco-terrorism operation.

To do this in this fashion, it would pull the rug from beneath Al Qaida that is said to have moved to Pakistan. It doesn't make any difference that AlQaida has moved to Pakistan - when their funding has not been cut from Afghanistan. This is a ploy; a magician's trick to merely avert our eyes so they can continue as they have without unplugging them. Don't buy into it; I can tell you that I surely have not.

Take out their opium and you take out two birds with one stone. You firstly take away the Taliban's and Al Qaida's funding and secondly you destroy the 'Dragon' that has bitten the US and Russia without interruption or mercy. This also removes the fangs of the drug warlords that supply the Taliban with money and weapons to continue their fight.

I'll agree that Afghanistan has capacities to export natural gas, but that is something that can honestly build their economy and the well-being of their citizens - rather to allow opium to be their 'cash cow' that also adversely affects Afghanis considerably.

Afghanistan is landlocked - so the possibillities of them exporting minerals - other than natural gas - would cost too much to get it to market. They would need to rebuild their entire rail structure and build redundancy into it. That would cost far too much for them to presently afford. And unless they do it themselves, which they cannot possible do until the Taliban is removed, no one will want to depend them as a continuous source of their raw materials.

What is key? The narco-terrorism that still has a grip - however tenuous - on the Afghani people and their countryside. I am restating what I had said on Arkin's previous article - entitled 'Afghanistan - it's stll about air power'.

Take out the opium growers by destroying their crops - and watch all of the dominoes fall over. And I want to add this thought - too: and Good Riddance to the opium fields and the Taliban and international organized crime that have kept them supplied with weapons, ammo, and money that support the Taliban, Al Qaida, and the junkies in Russia and the US that make them rich.
Yes Mary Jane - it is that simple and that difficult!

Who let school out early; the kids with the Bush hater parents are posting here along with what appears to be a couple of Taliban talking trash about our military.

Sir Oslon appreciation of the situation will prove incorrect. He has decided to send troops for deployment along pakistan and Afghanistan border to check and eliminate Taliban on a plea that Pakistan national forces have been unable to control the situation. May I ask Oslon why US army has not been able to control situation in Iraq? Taliban are ferocious and great fighters. It is impossible to break their will to fight. History is witness to it. So US troops will fail in their mission. However sending troops will enable US to take Pakistan in its control.

It only took George Bush 7 years to figure it out, good job little georgie maybe next year we will let you ride in the big yellow bus with all the normal kids. And if you keep progressing we will buy you a pair of real shoes with strings and teach you to tie them.

I HAVE ONE QUESTION FOR THIS SUPPOSED TERRORIST FIGHTER, HOW DID WE END UP FIGHTING A WAR AGAINST SECULAR BAATHISTS WHEN WE WHERE ATTACKED BY SAUDI AND EGYPTIAN TERRORISTS LOCATED IN SOUTH ASIA AND FINANCED BY THE UPPER CLASS OF SAUDI ARABIA? HOW IS IT THAT AFTER NEARLY 7 YEARS WE STILL HAVE VIRTUALLY NO MILITARY PRESENCE IN AFGHANISTAN AND THE PAK BORDER YET NEARLY 200,000 TROOPS GUARDING EXXON AND HALLIBURTON'S PROFIT MARGIN IN IRAQ?

To state that George Bush is not a smart or effective leader is like stating that blue whales are big and water is wet. This administration has an incompetent and sociopathic leadership: and the dark appointed underlings from regent university are even more partisan, biased, and ignorant than the frightening leadership of this administration. 12 and half months have never felt this long.

UBL isn't in Pakistan OR the Autonomous Tribal Zone.. Nuh Uh! Saw him just the other day at the local niteclub.

He's a real party animal!

DUDE! He was drinking a mai tai, wearing a pair of dark shades and one of those rasta tams with the built in dreadlocks.

Linton Kwesi Johnson & the Roots Radics were playing "Gonna Smash Their Brains In, Cause They Ain't Got Nothing In 'Em..."

But enough of that. To My Point:

What part of al-Qaeda STILL works for the Pentagon All these years after Kosovo...

http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2007/03/05/070305fa_fact_hersh

...and their buddy's airline recently 'lost' 1/4 million AK47s for us ...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viktor_Bout

...while Blackwater USA was 'losing' 100s of thousands of Glock machine pistols & silencers to the Turkish underworld

...don't you understand Arkin?

al Qaeda and a couple of thousand dead American civilians are NOT why we are willing to fight a three (or more) front war in the region.

Enough local stability for Natural resource & Gas PIPELINE OPERATIONS is the reason.

From the CIA World Factbook entry for Pakistan: "...extensive natural gas reserves, limited petroleum, ...coal, iron ore, copper"

...and we must undo those nasty international treaties they've signed (and the US for the most part HAS NOT):

"...Biodiversity, Climate Change, Climate Change-Kyoto Protocol, Desertification, Endangered Species, Environmental Modification, Hazardous Wastes, Law of the Sea, Marine Dumping, Ozone Layer Protection, Ship Pollution, Wetlands"

Afghanistan: "...natural gas, petroleum, coal, copper, chromite, talc, barites, sulfur, lead, zinc, iron ore, salt, precious and semiprecious stones..."

Just think of ALL THE PIT MINES in AMERICA's back yard with the concurrent results of such operations:

"...inadequate supplies of potable water; soil degradation; soil erosion; overgrazing; deforestation (much of the remaining forests are being cut down for fuel and building materials); desertification; air and water pollution from raw sewage, industrial wastes, and agricultural runoff..."

..If we didn't pillage, rape and scavenge these 'backwards countries & peoples' who just happen to be destroying the U.S. military and America's economy in much the same manner they destroyed Russia's.

It's a desperate gamble Arkin.

Tell the full truth dude, not just some US government created patina of plausibility & deniability that's been pounded into our brains since 9/11

usa forces already at five bases in pakistan and these forces wold be here when election process wold be going on.we think may usa forces coming here for monitoring election too.military training is good thing but here majority of peoples dont like americans.american govt always supported military rulers so peoples are angry.pakistani peoples suspicious that may usa forces coming for complet another agenda which hidden.

6 years after 9/11 and finally the Defense Dept. is crafting a plan to go after OBL...it's about time.

Maybe Sec. of Def. Gates and Adm. Fallon will finally do what Rumsfeld, Cheney, and Bush felt would somehow be counter-productive to THEIR " War on Terror", the very essense of Bush/Cheney Incompetence,...and actually target OBL and Co....instead BushInc wasted our Military Might going after the wrong "Enemy" (Iraqis) which has seriously degraded our once vaunted military.

It is quite a best decision which should have taken much earlier. If it is the decision of the defense officials involved with the planning is same as the wish of the mojority of Pakistan's. But it will need to do through the clean and the effected people of this area but not only the government officials. We are awaiting for you and prey for your desisive success.