The Fact-Checker, by Michael Dobbs

The GOP is playing it's usual "no taxes" song, knowing full well that the net result will be increased profits for big business (in this case oil companies) and loss of tax revenue.

Summer is, of course, a great time to encourage putting more carbon into the air! Long live global warming!!!

What makes Clinton's position on this even more laughable is when I read that "Clinton said she would make up the lost revenue by imposing a "windfall profits tax" on oil companies."

Umm... if the oil companies are hit with this tax, do you really think that they'll pay it out of pocket, or pass the cost on to the consumers with higher gas prices? I'm betting they'll pass that cost on to us.

So Hillary joins the Republicans and her pander earns her two Pinocchias.

The economists quoted here certainly win this debate. Quite possibly producers would make up some of the temporary consumer gain unless subjected to controls.

And what happens to gas prices after Labor Day?

This "holiday" will hurt more in the long run..Obama is correct , we can not afford it..not just financially but also on the job market.There would be over 3500 lay offs for that time frame.
We should be hitting them with a wind fall tax anyway..we have given them break after break and they have not provided any clues for alternative energies that we give them subsidies for.
I understand the concept of a Capitalists society however, these large oil companies are not stoking our economy but stuffing their coffers..and I can almost guarantee that they are not keeping their monies in our banks!
Time for America to get tough..make them pay..we already pay those extremely large CEO salaries..Maybe if they were not making such record breaking profits..our consumers might not feel as though they were being physically raped every time they go to a gas pump.
Carter had it right back in 1979..and he walked the walk as well as talked the talk..
He wanted us to become more independent from foreign oil..he turned off the lights in the white house...why didn't we listen?????

A gas tax holiday!!! Boy oh Boy! What will they think of next to try to appease the restless? One day of relief and then what about the next million days? This is certainly NOT an answer. Shrub and Cheney don't have to worry about the price of gasoline or the tax on gasoline (since they own the oil companies and their windfall profits), so why do the rest of the American citizens? I suspect it is so that we can continue to line the very deep pockets of Mr. Shrub/Cheney and company! Why is it ALWAYS we the regular citizens who have to struggle to make ends meet and yet those who have control and are the wealthiest among us, have no worry or fear of rising costs not only on gasoline, but food as well? This government is BROKEN and we need to throw most of these "do-nothings" out of elected office and vote for people who 'know' what is like to live like most of society. A one day tax break (along with the relief tax checks that we are supposed to receive next month - and PAY BACK WITH MORE TAXES) will NOT BENEFIT us now or ever! We the American public need to get these hacks out of office and start fresh with real PUBLIC SERVANTS; NO MORE PUBLIC BETRAYERS!!!! HRC and McBush will pander to anyone who is dumb enough to listen!!!! People educate yourselves!

Why does HRC only get 2 Pinocchios when we ALL KNOW (beyond a shadow of a doubt) that she is a TOTAL LIAR? I should think you would have a continual 4 Pinocchios for her - no matter the topic - since we have all seen how 'truthful' she has been and continues to be on "everything" she spews from her ugly mouth!

Here was Clinton in June 2000 when she was running for the U.S. Senate, opposing any idea of touching the gas tax:
Campaigning in the Hudson Valley, Lazio continued a two-day assault on Clinton's support of maintaining the 18-cent federal gas tax and then used tough rhetoric to declare that "trust" and "character" were campaign issues during an evening fundraiser in Manhattan that raised more that $1 million.
Clinton, meanwhile, lashed out at Lazio's plan to repeal 4.3 cents of the gas tax, calling it "a bad deal for New York and a potential bonanza for the oil companies."
During a visit to a shopping mall in the Buffalo suburbs, Clinton said that "the gas tax is one of the few exceptions where we actually get more money back than we send to Washington.
http://www.politicalbase.com/profile/Mark%20Nickolas/blog/&blogId=1966

If you are voting next week this should be big to you. Here you have someone willing to tell you the truth instead of what you want to hear. Vote Obama and make a change. Reject Hillarys continues lies, you are smarter then that I have confidence in you.

Enough empty politics! Do Clinton and McCain think we are so amazingly stupid that we will fall for this? Won't lowering the price have the effect of increasing demand and our reliance on foreign oil? And isn't the stated goal of all three of them to decrease the reliance on foreign oil and to do something abt climate change? Clinton and McCain seem to suffer from the same logic deficit.

UGH! Please, God, get this race over and get Obama in the White House.

Someone PLEASE make sure this article runs in USA Today... or People Magazine... or something Mainstream America will read. This is the first article I have read on the gas tax holiday that even ATTEMPTS to analyze the impact it will have on consumers. It would be even more obvious that the tax break is a bad idea if the article pointed out that the "tax break" is rewarding people for driving more - you only get the (minuscule) economic benefit if you drive, so those who can't afford or choose not to use cars lose out. On top of that, encouraging people to drive more is the last thing our environment needs now. The money could have been better spent by encouraging vehicle efficiency, or by providing a tax break across the board rather than favoring drivers.

I think Mr Dobbs ought to settle the controversies surrounding evolution vs creationism and tax cuts increasing tax revenues. He seems completely confident he's up to this sort of task and, lord knows, it's about time someone settled these matters.

Enough empty politics! Do Clinton and McCain think we are so amazingly stupid that we will fall for this?

Posted by: | April 29, 2008 8:57 AM

Yes. And not only are we falling for it but it will cost Obama big time.

Unlike Obama, Clinton realizes they will lose the election to Republican tax cut promises unless they also promise the same cuts.

99% of Americans will never bother to educate themselves on why the gas tax cut will hurt them even more, as they will end up using more gas sitting in congestion as our gov't will have no money to build and fix our roads.

I've been heavily critical of Michael Dobbs recently, but this article does make sense, and is pretty fairly balanced, even if it does make four in a row criticizing HC.

How swings swing and roundabouts roudabout. In 2000, Obama was the one voting *for* a tax holiday on gas. Clinton campaigned against it, citing the very sort of arguments mentioned above (especially its effect on highway building). In the words of Jeremiah Wright, "Politicians say what they say and do what they do based on electability, based on sound bites, based on polls."

Of course, no candidate will be in office this summer, so neither Clinton nor McCain will ever have to implement these policies.

Didn't Bush, who is usually so stubborn about the national oil reserve, open it for once just before the 2004 election?

Republicans have a history of trying to lower gas prices just before elections in which they're the incumbents. Then after the election, the price resumes its inexorable rise.

Americans are fools to whine about gas prices all the time. Do they know that gas has always been twice as expensive in Britain, and three times as expensive in France and Germany, yet you hear far less whining there.

Oil is bad news, and we should be getting away from it, not trying to buy it more cheaply.

It's like an addict complaining about the high price of heroin.

To all of those looking at this as some kind of bad flip-flop by Obama: he voted for something that seemed like a good idea, saw that it DIDN'T WORK and so won't vote for it again.

Silly me, I don't call this flip-flopping but proposing to effectively govern by learning from past legislative efforts. Crazy talk! I guess we can chalk this right up there with him being "too smart" to be President.

Attention NC and IN voters:

If you've been looking for information that would help you decide between Clinton and Obama. Here it is.

Do you want the candidate that will pander and say everything you want to hear? Or do you support the candidate that looks at our problems with an educated, objective eye and recognizes that quick fixes won't get us where we want to be.

Some have said that there's little difference between Clinton and Obama. I see a HUGE difference, and this issue is evidence.

Clinton will say anything (even parroting McBush) to get a vote. And, frankly, that tactic is starting to smell like last week's fish.

Aren't we already getting a gas "holiday"?

The $600 rebate I'm getting will get me through the summer and thensome. Then again, I don't drive a gas-guzzler, I plan my outings with precision, and I commute on the MARC train.

while the tax holiday makes no sense, not doing anything makes no sesne either. we might as well bear with it, there is a higher demand for oil throughout the world and prices will keep rising.

the government already subsidizes gas prices as it is, if they didnt we would be paying $8 a gallon like other developed nations.

stop driving your SUVs, take public transportation, decrease your driving, do whatever you need to do because prices are not going down and those who do not want government bail-outs on anything should not be looking for the government to artificially keep gas prices down.

1. build mnore refineries.
2. open more areas for oil extraction.
3. increase ties with friendly nations that provide the US with oil - aka, Canada, Mexico (silly Obama and Hillary with their anti-NAFTA rhetoric), Saudi Arabia.

"[McCain and Clinton] have urged Congress to suspend the 18.4 cent federal gas tax and 24.4 cent diesel tax between Memorial Day and Labor Day, a step that could cost the government about $10 billion in revenues."

Come on people, do you thing Congress will just accept that loss? You KNOW they're going to make up for it elsewhere.

Yeah, but no one expects Republicans to be fiscally responsible. Not yet. They have to complete their stalling hostile takeover and arrange for direct deposit of federal taxes into the Republican National Committee coffers, after which Saudi Arabia per contract will buy them out. While America is being settled under sword andSharia law, the Bushies will retire to Paraguay.

Hey fact-checker, I actually agree with your analysis here, except I don't think any of it's a proper "fact-check." Policy analysis is not fact. The fact that a bunch of economists say that a policy is bad does not mean that advocates of that policy are liars.

If we can find money to fund a war that is based on total fabrication. Why can`t we take a small portion of that money to pay the diffrence in the taxes? Or just go into our reserve. The oil and gas companies are netting record profites while we the people are suffering. How many government officials are profiting from these outragious prices?

This article misrepresents Clinton's proposal for funding the gas tax holiday, which couples a windfall profits tax with increased regulatory oversight of the oil companies in order to prevent them from simply raising the cost to make up for the windfall profits tax. And, for the long term, to address the problems of our dependence on oil (increased fuel efficiency, use of more renewable energy, etc.). Similar to sales tax holidays that many states and cities enact at different times of the year (e.g., to help people with their purchases needed for sending kids back to school), a tax holiday ends up helping consumers as well as businesses (through higher sales), and therefore the economy in general. But, MOST important of all, for people struggling to make ends meet NOW, any tax relief helps them, even if only for a few months. For Obama to disregard this fact and to brush off the benefit as too small to matter, simply reinforces how out of touch he is with lower income working class Americans.

More pandering from the candidates. If you spend 100 dollars a week for gas, this will save you 5, and that's assuming the local gas station passes off the entire savings to the consumer. If not, you'll be saving 2 or 3% on what you pay for gas. This is nothing but a gimmick.

Just like the "rebates" that will supposedly "stimulate the economy", a "Gas Tax Holiday" would be another in an endless series of meaningless political gestures. Such gestures make little difference in the life of Joe and Jane Average American whereas the payback for the lost revenue is usually H*ll on regular folks.

I am really sick of our politicians and their handlers playing us for fools.

Hey politicians, how sticking your silly proposals where the sun doesn't shine and start giving us honest and brutally frank assessments of where we stand and what we as a country have to do to solve our problems?

How americans respond to honesty and truth might surprise you.

Not only will McLame's gas tax recess provide very little cost relief, but it sends the wrong message. In a time of "war" and a warming earth, we don't need to encourage people to drive.

Instead, how about encouraging people to take Amtrak? It is a wonderful way to travel. Plus, Amtrak could use an injection of funds. How about encouraging people to buy more hybrids -- and encourage auto manufacturers to build more (real) hybrids with efficiency levels at least as good as the Prius? How about adequately funding our National Parks System so that people can enjoy a trip to the closest national park?

Instead of a gas tax holiday, more interstates should charge tolls. Since our tax dollars are all going to Iraq and our highways are deteriorating, we need to make some sacrifices here at home and actually pay for the services that we use -- including roads. (That is a conservative idea, by the way.)

There are so many more meaningful, long-term ways to reduce energy consumption. A gas tax holiday (aka automobile welfare) is the wrong way to go and Hillary is wrong to sign on to it.

Finally a fact check column that really is meaningful, exposing a political ploy by Hillary! I am shocked. This space usually doesn't go after Hillary, but she deserves it with this bit of pandering. The gas tax won't be passed down to motorists, or it will for a few days and then the prices will rise again to eat up all the savings. It won't do little people any good. Just the fat cat oil companies who are reaping in the profits.

Once again, Senator Obama reinforces his self-created image of being out of touch with the common man. Politics is largely about perception...and right now, when people see his face - they are reminded of that angry black man - Rev. Wright. These things are all connected - and if Obama supporters aren't realizing this in time - they will find themselves where Dean & Kerry supporters ended up.....as losers!

Wow, Obamanuts went loose again. So what is the plan proposed by Obama in that case? Outside of him opposing the plan which possibly will have some, albeit small, benefit to the public, he has not come up with his own plan to curtail the rising gas prices. How is this an attack on Hillary? I think it just highlights Obama's usually flip-flopping on the issues without any realistic plans.

The oil giants claim that their prices reflect the amount people are willing to pay for what they can supply. (Whatt hey can supply, as they don't mention, is controlled by their past cutting back on refinery capacity.)
Cutting taxes in one state means that consumers in that state get more gas at a cheaper price while consumers in other states pay more -- and, consequently, buy less.
Cutting taxes all over the nation will not cut prices paid by consumers one bit. It will only increase oil company profits.

"Wow, Obamanuts went loose again. So what is the plan proposed by Obama in that case? Outside of him opposing the plan which possibly will have some, albeit small, benefit to the public, he has not come up with his own plan to curtail the rising gas prices. How is this an attack on Hillary? I think it just highlights Obama's usually flip-flopping on the issues without any realistic plans."

Interesting comments since Clinton's plan is half baked at best. Where does Hillary plan to get the money to plug the shorfall that results from suspension of the gas tax or does she just do nothing and let the roads crumble and put the people who maintain the roads out of work.

Obama's vote in Illinois was very different. Illinois's tax on gasoline is a certain percentage, so an increase in gas price from $1 to $3 per gallon triples the tax paid per gallon. Illinois felt it did not need the additional revenue for its roads. The federal gas tax, on the contrary, is a flat 18 cents per gallon -- regardless of the price per gallon of gas. Obama's previous vote was designed to retain a (relatively) flat amount of tax per gallon. It is not a "dramatic" reversal, as you assert.

Whoa -- wait a cotton pickin' minute here.

The oil companies tell us that it's their civic duty to charge this much for gas in face of record profits, because if they didn't, the laws of supply and demand would result in over-demand and hence shortages.

If we are to believe this, if the price goes down by whatever mechanism, either we'll have gas lines, or, the more likely scenario, the oil companies will raise their prices cent for cent and that money will flow into their coffers instead of our infrastructure.

Don't be stupid like Clinton makes you out to be. This is a farce -- a scam. If we want oil prices to go down, we must GET OUT OF THIS ILLEGAL AND IMMORAL SLAUGHTER IN IRAQ. That is the single reason oil prices have skyrocketed: on the speculation of futures investors.

vrk, actually, if you read more reports online, Clinton's plan is to have the money replaced by a new tax on petroleum companies seeing as how they have the highest profits in the US at this time. And considering how many articles there have been about Obama and his ties to oil companies in IL, he probably should not have taken such a strong stance in their defense.

Ah, me. More political eroticism to join the "stimulus refund".
Who pays? Why guess who.

Good on Obama for learning from experience.

"Americans are fools to whine about gas prices all the time. Do they know that gas has always been twice as expensive in Britain, and three times as expensive in France and Germany, yet you hear far less whining there."

Actually, it's only YOU that hears far less whining there. If you were HERE you'd hear it. Fact is... the REAL beef people have with gas prices is Big Oil's profits and Big Oil's taxpayer subsidies. If Big Oil was making only modest profits, instead of record breaking income (just today... a NEW RECORD HIGH of 17 Billion in 3 months), then consumers wouldn't feel AS raped. Put an oil man in office and this is what you get. Bush isn't responsible for the high cost of gas, but he IS responsible for doing absolutely NOTHING about it.

"This article misrepresents Clinton's proposal for funding the gas tax holiday, which couples a windfall profits tax with increased regulatory oversight of the oil companies in order to prevent them from simply raising the cost to make up for the windfall profits tax"
-----HaHaHaHa andLOL. Increased Regulatory Oversight? You are kidding, right? I know you're definitely dreaming.

"For Obama to disregard this fact and to brush off the benefit as too small to matter, simply reinforces how out of touch he is with lower income working class Americans."

Man, you need to see a doctor about your sense of logic and command of information. The so-called gas holiday will amount to about a half a tank of gas, or less for some people (abt $36.00) over the three month period. And for this, the govt. will forego 10 billion in needed funds.

I know Hillary is smarter than McCain (not saying much) but now she is starting to sound like him.

"I think it just highlights Obama's usually flip-flopping on the issues without any realistic plans.
Posted by: Annoyed by Obamanuts"

The problem is you're "thinking."
Ever heard of the concept of learning from your experiences? Obama's already been through this EXACT scenario. And he's learned from it - with, amazinging, the same advice as the experts above. He's got the guts - while running for president - to tell people something they don't want to hear, risk the jaw flapping of 'flip flop' crap stirrers like yourself AND risk his run for the White House. You KNOW most politicians pander. THIS is NOT pandering. His stand is potentially harming to his campaign. Seriously... can't you even recognize when someone is taking a stand AGAINST politics as usual?

vrk, actually, if you read more reports online, Clinton's plan is to have the money replaced by a new tax on petroleum companies seeing as how they have the highest profits in the US at this time. And considering how many articles there have been about Obama and his ties to oil companies in IL, he probably should not have taken such a strong stance in their defense.

Posted by: Annoyed by Obamanuts | April 29, 2008 11:55 AM
________________________________

So you think the oil companies are going to A) eat that new tax or B) pass it on to the consumers?

If you think it's A "Annoyed by Obamanuts" then you are really out of touch!

"Just like the "rebates" that will supposedly "stimulate the economy", a "Gas Tax Holiday" would be another in an endless series of meaningless political gestures."

Hey... look how much the previous "rebates" worked. After borrowing billions from the Chinese and giving it away to "stimulate the economy," the economy is worse off than ever. And Bush, not the brightest of bulbs, just went ahead and did the exact same thing AGAIN this month. It didn't work the first time (we're worse off), it won't help the second time (we'll be even more in debt to foreign lenders) and saving two or five cents a gallon for a few months will only put the government MORE in debt. Please... REAL solutions... STOP PANDERING FOR VOTES.

Clinton was against a gas tax holiday a few years ago. Perhaps she has learned from her experience.

The gas tax holiday idea is the most inane proposal put forth yet in this campaign by any of the candidates.

Obama in 08.

McCain's decision to propose this on Earth Day of all days is appalling. And there's a fallacy to the notion that gas prices are too high - people are still buying gas. Market power drives prices. We have the choice to lower gas prices - by not buying gas. Take a bus, ride a bike, form a carpool, try walking. Insist on the development of alternative fuels. If we all *do* something instead of just complaining about it, maybe something will happen.

Spend the $10 billion the government would lose in taxs for the "tax holiday" on a few more oil refineries. Adding this capicity would add to the supply dropping the prices. I would rather pay 18-25 cents a gallon for a few days if I knew that prices would eventually drop down. I know we need alternative fuels, but right now we need to get the fuel prices lower. If I could stick my garden hose in my gas tank and fill the car up I would, but all of us know this is not going to happen for a while.

BEAT THE HIGH GAS PRICES!

A NEW BOOK SHOWS YOU HOW:

"How to Live Well Without Owning a Car" by Chris Balish.

--Save Money, Breathe Easier, and Get More Mileage Out of Life (Paperback)

The Fact Checker fails to mention this pertinent fact: Lower gas proces this summer because of a temporary suspension of the Federal tax will cause consumers to buy and burn more gas then they would if the price remained high. This increased gas usage would further exacerbate the current supply/demand imbalance leading to prices that would eventually be higher than they would have without the gas tax holiday.

And Hillary calls Barack inexperienced. His experience with this issue caused him to change his initial opinion. Hillary, on the other hand, originally opposed this idea for the very same reason. Now, she uses it as a cheap political ploy to pander to voters. I am glad he isn't playing her cynical game.

The Gas Tax is nothing, the problem we should be scrutunizing is the traders who are hyping this, who they are are they regulated, the issue here no fundamentals at all, we have being ripped of by the Oil and gas companies with the Help of Bush and Chenney and all the republicans.

LOL, imagine that, Obama, a candidate who received twice as much money from Exxon and Chevron employees for his campaign, as compared to Clinton and McCain is against touching that industry. Gasp!

Obama democrats,

Evidently this is the first time many of you have ever voted. When we get to the general election the candidate who promises the lowest taxes will win. It doesn't matter how stupid the argument is or how unrealistic it is Americans only vote for a promise of lower taxes. While Republicans and Clinton have figured this out the Democratic party is still preaching reality...which Americans don't want to hear.

This is a country of lazy FoxNews sound bite people not educated voters. The media tells us we are more interested in tax breaks, US flag pins and what church you go to than what your actual policies are...and since when have Americans ever questioned the media?

While Obama's policy is right for our country it is wrong for a presidential candidate. Welcome to politics.

I agree with Obama. But what about a imposing a temporary ceiling on what the gas suppliers can charge filling stations? That way the oil companies can't pass the buck to small station owners, and the free market should keep local gouging to a minimum.

"LOL, imagine that, Obama, a candidate who received twice as much money from Exxon and Chevron employees for his campaign, as compared to Clinton and McCain is against touching that industry. Gasp!"

Whoever this is - and I can see why you don't have the guts to own up to such an inaccurate and stupid statement - you are dead wrong. Lies is what got this country into this mess in the first place. Fortunately, most Americans are smarter than you.

Are you wearing a refinery lapel pin? Dumping cheap tax-free gas on the market may seem like good politics to the politically expedient but it is bad policy.

Bush wanted steel tariffs because he didn't think America could compete with the world. Now they are dumping valuable gasoline on the market at low prices for the worthless American dollar.

Just a silly idea: if oil companies are max out interms of production, if consumers are willing to pay $4 a gallon, why would they lower the price, since supply can't increase? If the $4 includes the tax, and it is eliminated, won't they just raise the price to level it was with the tax.

In econ we say the most inelastic pays; if taxes increase, and gets back money if it is reduced. In this case, the supply is close to perfectly inelastic, which means all the benefit goes to the producers.

Way to go Hillary...... pander, pander, pander......

Whoever this is - and I can see why you don't have the guts to own up to such an inaccurate and stupid statement - you are dead wrong. Lies is what got this country into this mess in the first place. Fortunately, most Americans are smarter than you.

Posted by: Susan | April 29, 2008 12:59 PM

Susan, I simply didn't feel like putting my name on there, before you accuse someone of being a liar, maybe you should do some research. Otherwise, you're pointing out your own ignorance.

According to data available on Open Secrets:

Chevron 2008 Donations:
Obama: $21,663
Clinton: $10,150
McCain: $10,600

Exxon 2008 Donations:
Obama: $33,550
Clinton: $24,873
McCain: $18,551

ConocoPhillips 2008 Donations:
Obama: $7,100
Clinton: $4,500
McCain: $5,650

It is a start, at least Hillary is trying to do something for us about gas prices, Obama is all talk. You would have to have a potato for a brain to not see this is just a band aid until we get a real President, like Hillary, to fix the real problem. Thank You once again small minded Obama supporters for stating the obvious the rest of us already see and we also see how your candidate offers excuses instead of solutions.

It is a start, at least Hillary is trying to do something for us about gas prices, Obama is all talk. You would have to have a potato for a brain to not see this is just a band aid until we get a real President, like Hillary, to fix the real problem. Thank You once again small minded Obama supporters for stating the obvious the rest of us already see and we also see how your candidate offers excuses instead of solutions.

Posted by: Hillary All the Way | April 29, 2008 1:26 PM

The problem with Hillary and, apparently, you is that you are willing to make the problem WORSE just so you can look like you are doing "something". Well I say no thanks to your empty gesture of good will. Give me a candidate you is smart enough to see the situation for what it is and seek a long term solution, rather than an ineffective short-term band-aid that actually leaves you, me and everyone else worse off!

It is a start, at least Hillary is trying to do something for us about gas prices, Obama is all talk. You would have to have a potato for a brain to not see this is just a band aid until we get a real President, like Hillary, to fix the real problem. Thank You once again small minded Obama supporters for stating the obvious the rest of us already see and we also see how your candidate offers excuses instead of solutions.

Posted by: Hillary All the Way | April 29, 2008 1:26 PM

And what will stop the oil companies from pushing the tax burden back on consumers through higher pricing?

For proof, please see: http://www.uticaod.com/homepage/x1637676857

CLINTON Pastor found GUILTY of CHILD MOLESTATION!!

Although I understand the desire to cut summer gasoline taxes, this would not help the economy. Let's examine this effect.

McCain and Hillary say that the federal government should eliminate gasoline and diesel taxes during the summer. An short-term elimination of the federal gasoline tax of 18.4 cents per gallon would saving the average consumer 5% on their fill-up costs and at the same time result in a lost of ~$10 billion in highway/bridge construction revenue. So for the 3-month summer driving season, the average gasoline consumer would save somewhere between $25 and $35 for the entire summer. If highway/bridge construction is to go uninterrupted, that means the federal government has to raise taxes somewhere else or borrow more money from China, Saudi Arabia or some other country to pay for the tax cut. Having a windfall tax on oil companies only means that the oil companies will raise prices to keep their margins up.

A short-term fix that causes problems long term is not what is needed. It is as simple as Economic 101, supply and demand.

Cutting taxes will cause prices to fall slightly, and more people to purchase more gasoline which drives up the price of gasoline again. It is the American desire for consumption of gasoline which mostly affects price at the pump.

Obama has the better judgement in this case.

Any holiday on the gasoline tax will hurt the all of us twice. First the money will not be there to repair our roads and will still need to be spent. Second, the price will still rise but be hidden. What a surprise when we suddenly have to pay the tax. Instead of a gradual adjustment, the econimic hardship wil be dramatic.

Do not let our oil dependence be manipulated to continue. No false hopes or lies. Give it to straight.

Ok, so Obama tells the truth and McCain and Clinton tell you what you want to hear in order to gain votes.

Thisis a disgraceful proposal. A day or two of not paying the 18 cent federal gas tax which won't help one iota when the gas is about to be $4.00 a gallon with no real end to this rise in price in sight for the next 365 days a year. What are we going to do about maintaining the roads and bridges that this 18 cents goes to fund???? We already experiencing disasters from a current failure to maintain major roads and bridges throughout this country so now we will enjoy a few cents off the gas (which incidentally will not change the price of gas at the pump enough for us to recognize that the 18 cents have been deducted at all). This is another chump change idea just like the stupid "economic stimulus package" that most assuredly won't stimulate anything but further economic decline because we are continuing to ignore the real causes of the decline, astronomical gas, oil and utility prices, lost jobs and income, skyrocketing healthcare costs, tax cuts to the wealthy, government subsidies to the wealthy, government giveaways to defense contractors associated with Iraq and Afghanistan, excessive taxes on middle and low income taxpayers and other numerous government giveaways to corporate interests.

Seems like someone learned from his experience to make the right decision. And sounds like someone else is playing GOPper politics, right before her appearance on Fox News.

I hate to say it becuase I am not a fan of over regulation, but the only way to effectively lower and stablize gas prices is to regulate the industry. Our government must play the middle-man and negotiate prices for the crude and then resell it to the oil companies with the taxes already built into the price. It is the only way to remove the ambiguity and speculative nature of oil prices in this country.

With the Clintons and McCain agreeing, it's more and more evident that if Hillary wins the Democratic nomination, the winner in November will be. . . the Bush family.

R. Holley wrote: "If we can find money to fund a war that is based on total fabrication...why can`t we take a small portion of that money to pay the difference in the taxes?"

The point is that we are NOT PAYING for the war...our grandkid will pay for it, with interest. There is NO LEFTOVER MONEY in some pot somewhere. Bush's tax cuts and the costs of the war(s) made certain of that. And if we suspend the gas tax, it will only increase the deficit and the debt.

Moreover, consumers will not benefit, either. The price of gas is driven by supply and demand. If you suspend the tax, the price will drop, demand will increase, and the total price will rebound to where it was with the tax in place.

Bottom line: consumers pay about the same; the oil companies get more; and the transportation trust fund (which pays for road improvements nationwide) gets less.

We need help to pay for the gas bill, why not take a tax holiday now? The way I look at the situation, we are deeper into the recession, the gas price will do down within five months, but we need a break now to pay for the bill at the moment to tie us over. This just prove that Clinton knows the economy and is in touch with the public while Obama is only a theorist living in a dream!

Johnny Cheng,

Deuimjyu, ni bu xig teng.

We'd be better off raising the Federal Gas Tax to $1.84/gal and giving 100% instant rebates for trucks.

The overage could be put to use in rebuilding infrastructure and it would give people driving those gas guzzling SUVs and trucks something to think about.

But then it is just a dream because our "representatives" in Congress don't have the balls to do the thing that would be best fopr the country in the long run.

Let's do the number. Assume you need 20 gal to fill-up, you will only save $3.68 per fill-up. Assume, you need 10 fill-up per month, that accounts only less than $40. What can $40 buy these days? "Gasline tax holiday" is a useless political gesture.

We need help to pay for the gas bill, why not take a tax holiday now? The way I look at the situation, we are deeper into the recession, the gas price will do down within five months, but we need a break now to pay for the bill at the moment to tie us over. This just prove that Clinton knows the economy and is in touch with the public while Obama is only a theorist living in a dream!

Posted by: johnycheng | April 29, 2008 4:24 PM

We also need help to pay our infrastructure bill. Who is going to pay that? ohh yeah you will through increased taxes in other areas...or we will borrow it and have even more debt to payback a few years from now.

If decreasing taxes is the answer to everything why not cut all of our taxes to nothing and fund everything through foreign loans? Just think of how popular these politicians will be for a few days before our country falls into total collapse.

Almost never is the easiest solution the best solution.

It seems that this is one of the few instances where Obama's experience at the state level outweighs Clinton and McCain. According to the article, Obama supported the gas tax holiday in Illinois, it didn't work, and he's developed a policy position because of the experience.

McCain and Clinton are out-of-touch on this one ... not because of how much money they make, but because neither has had to deal with this issue at a state level, where a lot more grass-roots, everyday problems are confronted.

As usual, Dobbs confuses the issues rather than clarifies it. Clinton proposes a tax holiday, paid for by levying windfall profits taxes on the corporations. So the 'cost' will be taken out of profits that the corporations have already gotten. (Anybody see BP's profit statement today?)
Obama refuses any short-term relief in favor of long-term relief. He is, of course, correct that a short-term fix will not solve long-term problems. But that is clear to everybody. What he effectively does is bury the issue in rhetoric.
Please note that, like Clinton, he wants to levy windfall profit taxes, but not to cover a tax holiday; he wants to do so to help people with their 'energy bills.'
That, of course, is mixing apples and oranges. The cost of gas is a critical variable in an economy that runs on motor vehicles, but Obama has nothing in his proposals that addresses the problem of how motorists will afford gas at all -- not short-term, not long-term.
Clinton, on the other hand, proposes to prevent manipulation of prices (although it is not clear how).
In short, Clinton offers three proposals, both short and long term, to address what is clearly a problem -- the high cost of gas and diesel fuel -- a tax holiday (short term), a tax on windfall profits (short term), and oversight of gas prices (long-term).
Obama offers a little rhetoric (short-term solutions are, well, so short term), one concrete proposal (windfall profits, exactly like Clinton), a vague promise to discuss things in the future (with oil companies), and a redirection of windfall profits not to benefit motorists (by covering the cost of a gas holiday) but to help people pay for 'energy,' a short-term solution, since there can only be one tax on windfall profits.
If one is going to discuss a proposal, then one needs to discuss the whole proposal.
Two more pinocchios for Dobbs.

Now this is refreshing politics! I am so proud to be an American right now I could kiss you all. To see my fellow Americans actually debating and analyzing an issue and the candidate's position on said issue, e.g., near and dear to our pocketbooks. This is front page news...come on main stream media you owe us! You just might raise the standards and save the political arena. I'm trying to teach my 8 yr. old about campaigning and politics and I have to change the channel to skip the bashing. Hillary's expressions reminds him of the mean lady next door.

At the very least, allow us the opportunity to unite around this topic. Front and center, please!

This is just one more example of Obama's poor judgment as well as the Post's for once again supporting his views. Yes, gas tax relief would mean that those taxes would need to be made up but it's ironic that gas taxes, like those on food and other commodities, have a disproportionate impact on society's poorest, yet Obama, and apparently The Post, oppose this relief.

Perhaps some of what relief at the gas pumps will cost could, when it has to be made up, be done so through repeal of some of the Bush tax cuts with higher income taxes on people with annual incomes over $250,000.00 as Mrs. Clinton has proposed.

As much as it hurts, and it does!!! I must agree with Obama on this one. What are you going to do after the "holiday" is over and the price of gas jumps 19 cents overnight? Blame somebody, right? I would not want it to be me.

Perloff's analysis says a 9 to 12 cent drop...and Clinton proposes to fund the lost revenue with a tax on oil companies.

The fact checker seemed to leave out the last piece when talking about the impact of lost revenues. The firms will be able to pass only a part of a profits tax on to consumers.

has anybody else noticed that Hillary, Bush & McCain agree on many things...they all voted for the War for one. how do they propose making up for the lost revenue needed to pay for our crippled infrastructure? pure "t" politics. also HRC's proposal to tap the Strategic Reserve...what will it cost to replace that fuel down the road? only Obama is basing his view on the real world.

Susan, what she also didn't tell you is that the corporate companies didn't contribute to Obama. Individuals who work in those companies have contributed. The company can not exert pressure on Obama because he is not beholden to them.

Instead of Mr Bush asking the federal reserve to print up all this refund money, he should have asked the oil companies to give us a month supply of petro free. How stupid of me!!! " we are the go between." Clever Mr. Bush. Now be honest Mr. Bush did you think of this little scheme all by yourself ?

People trying to survive financially, whether they be low income working folks or simply retirees trying to live on a fixed income WANT and NEED any kind of tax relief, even if the rest of you well-off Obama liberals think that its not enough money to worry about. ARROGANCE and ELITISM is alive and well with Obama and his non-thinking Obamabots.

Rumor has it (more then a rumor) Clinton will get out in June. It is all the insiders are talking about. It is over there is no more need to discuss

The bottom line is that God specifically designated America as the place that could use as much oil as we like at a price we like, so anyone who tries to stop us hates America.

And if God doesn't put more oil in the ground so we can get oil back to a price we like, then God is one of those America-haters.

Ergo, our America-hating God-given American right to use cheap oil regardless of what it actually costs is a sign that God loves America almost as much as he hates it.

Now if I can figure out a way to incorporate Reverend Wright and a flag lapel pin into this post, I can be a reporter for the Washington Post.

We need to keep Obama out of the White house with his flip flopping ways.

Perhaps we could call it the Charge It To Your Children Act (CITYCA). That is what we would be doing... charging more debt to our children so we could do irresponsible things now.

A third party will form if the general election is McCain vs. Clinton. It would have to. Congress and the White House have been so irresponsible for so long with our money, with the voters complicit.

At some point a third party is a must, made up primarily of the under-40 set.

MY FELLOW "BITTER", STUPID, WORKING CLASS PEOPLE :-)

If you think like Barack Obama, that WORKING CLASS PEOPLE are just a bunch of "BITTER"!, STUPID, PEASANTS, Cash COWS!, and CANNON FODDER. :-(

You Might Be An Idiot! :-)

If you think Barack Obama with little or no experience would be better than Hillary Clinton with 35 years experience.

You Might Be An Idiot! :-)

If you think that Obama with no experience can fix an economy on the verge of collapse better than Hillary Clinton. Whose ;-) husband (Bill Clinton) led the greatest economic expansion, and prosperity in American history.

You Might Be An Idiot! :-)

If you think that Obama with no experience fighting for universal health care can get it for you better than Hillary Clinton. Who anticipated this current health care crisis back in 1993, and fought a pitched battle against overwhelming odds to get universal health care for all the American people.

You Might Be An Idiot! :-)

If you think that Obama with no experience can manage, and get us out of two wars better than Hillary Clinton. Whose ;-) husband (Bill Clinton) went to war only when he was convinced that he absolutely had to. Then completed the mission in record time against a nuclear power. AND DID NOT LOSE THE LIFE OF A SINGLE AMERICAN SOLDIER. NOT ONE!

You Might Be An Idiot! :-)

If you think that Obama with no experience saving the environment is better than Hillary Clinton. Whose ;-) husband (Bill Clinton) left office with the greatest amount of environmental cleanup, and protections in American history.

You Might Be An Idiot! :-)

If you think that Obama with little or no education experience is better than Hillary Clinton. Whose ;-) husband (Bill Clinton) made higher education affordable for every American. And created higher job demand and starting salary's than they had ever been before or since.

You Might Be An Idiot! :-)

If you think that Obama with no experience will be better than Hillary Clinton who spent 8 years at the right hand of President Bill Clinton. Who is already on record as one of the greatest Presidents in American history.

You Might Be An Idiot! :-)

If you think that you can change the way Washington works with pretty speeches from Obama, rather than with the experience, and political expertise of two master politicians ON YOUR SIDE like Hillary and Bill Clinton..

You Might Be An Idiot! :-)

If you think all those Republicans voting for Obama in the Democratic primaries, and caucuses are doing so because they think he is a stronger Democratic candidate than Hillary Clinton. :-)

Best regards

jacksmith... Working Class :-)

p.s. You Might Be An Idiot! :-)

If you don't know that the huge amounts of money funding the Obama campaign to try and defeat Hillary Clinton is coming in from the insurance, and medical industry, that has been ripping you off, and killing you and your children. And denying you, and your loved ones the life saving medical care you needed. All just so they can make more huge immoral profits for them-selves off of your suffering...

You see, back in 1993 Hillary Clinton had the audacity, and nerve to try and get quality, affordable universal health care for everyone to prevent the suffering and needless deaths of hundreds of thousands of you each year. :-)

Approx. 100,000 of you die each year from medical accidents from a rush to profit by the insurance, and medical industry. Another 120,000 of you die each year from treatable illness that people in other developed countries don't die from. And I could go on, and on...

OBAMA AIDE: "WORKING-CLASS VOTERS NOT KEY FOR DEMOCRATS" :o

DEBATE! DEBATE!! DEBATE!!!...

It means your a liar when your Hillary Clinton, under sniper fire in Bosnia. Hillary Clinton is just trying to pander for votes because she needs a desperate win in Indiana. What's even more laughable is her new ad in Indian. Hillary Clinton is stating that she grew up in IL. I thought she was from Scranton, P.A.? Thats real pandering there. After all She not a senator from any of those states but New York inwhich she never lived until her run for Senate. Hillary Clinton is so transparent it's a wonder why her supporters can't see through her. Please Indiana and North Carolina, please take her out of this race.

FLASH FLASH

HILLARY TO DROP OUT IN JUNE. IT IS ALREADY BEEN DECIDED INSIDERS HAVE CONFIRMED.

Our bridges are falling apart and we want to take money away earmarked for that?

Our environment is falling apart and we want to encourage people to buy more oil?

We need to suck it up now and get our government to invest in the future - stop thinking "me", think "them" - as in the future generations.

As usual, the Republicans always lower the gas prices before the election, and Hillarrhea, being an honorary Republican what with being such a great friend of Uncle Joe Lieberman and acting like such a little Republican as of late , is backing it too.

Yes, and in the meantime 300,000 highway construction workers will get laid off because there is no money going into the highway fund that funds the summer construction projects, just when we need the jobs the most! Nice pandering McBush and Hillary!

As a middle class family who has been supported by a semi that we own, the high cost of fuel is destroying our income. We have no choice but to pay the high prices or stop working and lose everything we have worked for the last 37 years. All we want is to be able to make a living. The prices will hurt everyone in the end because everything is delivered by a truck driver who is going to have to pass his costs on to someone else. Who needs a vacation from the high costs, we need a way to survive

A gas tax moratoriam only hurts the public. It has no effect on the oil companies and their gargantuan profits. It only affects long-term federal highway and bridge construction projects.

it's one thing for McCain to come up with that nonsense. He has already admitted that doesn't understand economics. I thought though, that Clinton was smarter than that.

This gas tax holiday strikes me as a silly idea that does nothing significantly beneficial for the consumer, does not encourage reduction of gas usage, and panders to the Republican anti-tax mantra. I have never seen a reason for the Republican party to support any tax - when times are good, they want to cut taxes, when times are bad, they want to cut taxes to stimulate the economy. Shame on you, Hillary, for playing this game.

I would really like to know where these Clintonites see Obama as flip flopping on this issue. He has already been thru this similar situation and it didnt work...all he is using is his experience...you know the issue your candidate is always saying she has more of...what it is ok for Hillary to use her experience on issues but not Barack? Get a life. Quit backing a dead horse and Hillary is just that.

The Fact Checker's economist-commentators are correct, but fail to observe one important matter. If the tax stops, demand will increase. So, the demand-increase will raise prices much higher than before the tax-stoppage -- likely higher than the amount of the stopped tax.

Gas and oil are high because the value of the American dollar has gone to hell.

Why can't people realise this? Everybody is stuck with the ever declining dollar and now we are seeing the effects of nervous investors with American dollars investing in gold and oil making prices skyrocket.

I laugh when i hear about oil shortages and such. Yeah right there's plenty of oil to last hundreds of years. It's the American dollar that's taking a dive and now we must spend much more of it to buy a barrel of oil. Are you getiing it yet????

All the debt and mass printing of money is finally starting to kick us in the ass. Too bad us american citizens are too ignorant too care or look into more. Maybe they'll quit BS about oil shortages and such when gas is 10 bucks a gallon.

The weak value of the dollar and the Iraq War are causing the oil spike. Do some research.

I'm also tired of hearing about how high gas is in Germany, France or Britain so we shouldn't complain.We're not those countries. I live in America and expect a certain standard only the fools we elect can't deliver.

If you like high gas prices go live over there.

People trying to survive financially, whether they be low income working folks or simply retirees trying to live on a fixed income WANT and NEED any kind of tax relief, even if the rest of you well-off Obama liberals think that its not enough money to worry about. ARROGANCE and ELITISM is alive and well with Obama and his non-thinking Obamabots.

Posted by: | April 29, 2008 7:29 PM

Do they need a $0.19/gallon short term fix that they will have to pay for through other taxes and declining infrastructure or do they need a real strategy to bring their energy costs back down to $1.50/gallon? The only thing worse than a tax freeze is an Oil Company profit tax that we will all just end up paying for at the pump. The poorest of American society is already taking the bus.

Clinton isn't giving solutions she's giving sound bites.

I would welcome any relief at this point..
I know this would help even just for the summer. I agree with this as well as many of my neighbors and friends who are being hit very hard by the price of gas right now.. Even a little savings while they figure out what to do..

Come on! These economists from the elite universities are out of touch with the reality. What do they know about what the common folks are going through?

P.S. They probably have latte too, which makes their view on economics even more irrelevant.

Are you kidding? Piss away 10 billion needed for important projects, put people out of work so you can have $35.00. Are you just nuts or that selfish and short sighted? In the end you will also be one of the losers. Plus most of the relief will go to the oil companies you get almost nothing. It is interesting that the public is so stupid. In fact they actually depend on how stupid the public is or they would not even say such a ridiculous thing. They get so used to lying to the public and them eating it up they don't even care anymore. Confront them with the lie and the spin another lie. If you believe any of this you are in fact not smart enough to even be voting, I am sorry for being so blunt.

"I would welcome any relief at this point..
I know this would help even just for the summer. I agree with this as well as many of my neighbors and friends who are being hit very hard by the price of gas right now.. Even a little savings while they figure out what to do..

Hillary has certainly found her voting base. Pander to people too stupid to even know what they are being screwed.

You know the truth, I hope Obama keeps telling it like it is even if he loses. If the public rejects him then screw them. He can go off and write a book and do what ever he wants and the hell with them. they were too stupid to know a good thing when they saw it. Jefferson was right.

When Thomas Jefferson said that "people get the government they deserve," it was more than just a clever turn of phrase, it is the truth.

When I read yesterday's account of the debate over what to do about rising gasoline prices, I really was astounded by the pandering-though I sometimes wonder why one would be astounded in this era where getting elected is far more important than taking a principled position. On this issue, the scorecard is clear: Sens. Clinton and McCain failed miserably and Sen. Obama took the right stand.

http://www.youpolls.com/details.asp?pid=2312

.

ITS THE DOLLAR STUPID

NO ITS THE DEFICIT CAUSING THE STEEP DOLLAR DEVAULATION STUPID

http://www.youpolls.com/details.asp?pid=2312

Posted by: Frank, Austin TX | April 30, 2008 12:54 PM

Americans have spoken. We are idiots! I think if you took a poll most Americans would be in favor of getting rid of all taxes...even after the economy collapses and people start shooting each other on whats left of the streets for water.

Thank god the founding fathers aren't around to see this or they would have never proposed a democracy.

This federal gas tax moratorium debate proves two things:

1. Sen. Obama has the ability to learn from experience and change his position accordingly (in response to the negative economic consequences of the state gas tax moratorium in Illinois).

2. Sen. Clinton will do anything to get elected even when it has negative consequences for one of her biggest bases, public sector employees, who will suffer from the decline in public revenues as a result of a federal gas tax moratorium, and even if it means siding with the notoriously anti-government Republicans.

It's time to wake up and smell the coffee.

Simply a bad idea that SOUNDS really good to us because of our pain at the pumps. Find ONE economist who says its a good idea. You will be hard pressed.

We don't need TAX relief. Taxes are our money to invest in the ways we need, such as roads and bridges and other infrastructure. We need PROFIT relief. This is our money to take back from shareholders, so we can invest in conservation and renewable energy, instead of CEO salaries and yachts and private islands. We don't get anything out of the profit they make on us. They don't even invest in new refineries and other bottlenecks that have raised gasoline prices unnecessarily. The only way toward a sane energy policy is to assert public control over what is a vital national security resource (so we're told) and to nationalize the oil companies. If it's such an important resource, why are we allowing profiteering? Why are we protecting corporations with our military? Nationalization would allow the government to charge prices that would cover production costs, as well as investment in infrastructure and renewable energy sources, while saving money. Drilling for new oil and gas is not the answer. The only remaining places to drill for new oil and gas are in extremely environmentally sensitive areas and in areas that deprive indigenous people of their livelihoods. This is not acceptable and we should not be spending money on "defense" to take this oil out of the ground. Obviously, Republican solutions like "tax relief" can only make matters worse. We have a diminishing inventory of fossil fuels (mostly in the Middle East), and very little left elsewhere that can't be taken out of the ground except at great environmental and human cost. We need to use this resource judiciously to transition to renewable energy at the earliest possible date. We don't need to raise taxes provided we can use existing money spent at the gas pump for the real work of building a sustainable economy. Let's get real and solve this problem as if we really were a real democracy (oh...we're not?).

From an economic standpoint, not a political one, people supporting this measure are short-sighted, and maybe a little selfish. As much as I could use another $30 in my pocket, I'd rather sacrifice a dinner or two at Applebee's this summer than have to get new tires on my car because the roads are crumbling or watch another massive bridge collapse. Kudos to Senator Obama for being the voice of reason in this debate. Hope the rest of the country listens.

That so many of you will discard the counsel of economists just to support your political favorite shows just how stupid and corrupt the American society is, so pliant and susceptible to pandering lies. And these politicians, Hillary in particular, bank on such stupidity.

I am hopeful that there are wiser people out there.

The problem with Clinton's proposal is that the windfall tax will take a totally different bill to be passed, which wouldn't happen before November, so the holiday wouldn't happen either.

My husband is an engineer with our state DOT and he and all his co-workers agree that the proposed gas tax cut for the summer is a bad idea. Funding is already short across the country for much needed maintenance and repairs. Ask those who lost family members in the I35 bridge collapse last summer in MN if a savings of $30 or so would have been worth it. The gas companies would not pass these savings on to their customers and the prices would slowly (if not quickly) rise to make up the difference. We both agree with all the intelligent posts above stating the same views. Sen. Obama has learned from his past experience of doing something that didn't work and is acting accordingly. Don't we want a president who learns from his/her mistakes?? Has anyone heard Sen. Clinton say that she made a mistake voting to authorize war in Iraq and has learned from her mistake? Did anyone see the NBC nightly news tonight, showing a 2-3 yr. old boy being pulled from the rubble of a building? Five more American soldiers died today as well as countless Iraqui men, women and children. Do not forget that Sen. Clinton voted for this war, which is another reason why our economy is in such dire straits. Why do we not hear this splashed all over the news, along with her "obliterate Iran" comment. Is this not more crucial than Obama's pastor? But I digress.....

Capitol Hill insiders say the battle for congressional superdelegates is over, and one Senate supporter of Barack Obama is hinting strongly that he has prevailed over Hillary Rodham Clinton.

While more than 80 Democrats in the House and Senate have yet to state their preferences in the race for the Democratic nomination, sources said Tuesday that most of them have already made up their minds and have told the campaigns where they stand.

Maybe if we greedy, spoiled Americans would back off the throttle, sell the oversized gas sucking trucks and SUVs that we shuffle the snot nosed kids to soccer practice in, and learn to use fuel wisely, then the demand would drop and prices would drop.

But as far as I see, everyone is complaining but very few are doing anything to bring the problem to an end. Still driving huge SUV's, muscle cars and passing on the highways at 90 miles an hour.

Americans are greedy, spoiled, lazy and fat. They want everything but very few are willing to make any sacrifices to get what they want.

And before you attack me, I am an American, but I am doing everything I can to cut down on my use, so at least I can say I am not part of the problem.

A lot of you won't like what I state here, but the truth of the matter is: REALITY BITES!

Barack Obama caught in crooked money laundering scheme

'Smoking gun' prompts Andy Martin to say Obama should withdraw as presidential candidate

http://www.pr-inside.com/smoking-gun-prompts-andy-martin-to-r559376.htm

EXCERPTS

(NEW YORK)(April 27, 2008) The disclosure today in the Los Angeles Times that Barack Obama laundered money through a law firm to conceal the source of his income while an Illinois state senator is the 'smoking gun' that is going to doom his candidacy.
www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-killerspin27apr27

The Times details how Obama was still 'of counsel' to his former law firm, but that he was not providing any services to that entity. Then Obama made a deal with Blackwell, and wanted to conceal that Blackwell was supporting him. So Obama 'laundered' the 'legal fees' by running them through the law firm and then issuing a list of the law firm's clients-none of which had anything to do with Obama--to disguise the Blackwell money in a laundry list of hundreds of unrelated 'clients.'

This was a classic case of money laundering and business fraud. Obama wanted to conceal the large sum he was receiving from Blackwell, so he concealed that Blackwell was the source of his income by pretending he was providing services to the law firm's other clients.

Utter fraud. 'Barry O' ain't stupid, he's slicky and tricky, and he's a ticking time bomb for the Democratic Party.

Obama's 'law firm' was also guilty of professional misconduct, because the lawyers knew that Obama had not provided services through the law firm, and was merely using the firm to obscure the fact that the major source of his personal income was one client on whose behalf Obama was later to advocate (there may have been earlier informal advocacy than the senate letter which has surfaced).

Since the law firm had no relationship with Blackwell, running Obama's fees through the firm was false and fraudulent.

Since Obama had nothing to do with the law firm's other clients, using a list of hundreds of unrelated clients to obscure that only one of those "clients" was paying him money was federal criminal mail fraud as well as a corruption of the ethics rules in Illinois.

the advocates of a "gas tax holiday" are exaggerating the benefits

Fact check! Where have any of the advocates actually claimed that the entire reduction would end up in consumer's pockets?

"his models showed that a suspension of the 18.4-cent federal tax on gasoline would likely result in a temporary 9- to 12-cent reduction in the cost of a gallon of gas to the consumer."

Doesn't this mean that there is a significant benefit to the consumer from a moratorium?

It looks like you started with a pre-conceived conclusion and checked only the facts that supported it.

Perhaps shifting the gas tax on consumers to a tax on winfall profits of the oil companies is a bad idea. But it looks like that is exactly what the moratorium would do.

"LOL, imagine that, Obama, a candidate who received twice as much money from Exxon and Chevron employees for his campaign, as compared to Clinton and McCain is against touching that industry. Gasp!"

You're using misleading information.

First of all, while Obama may have taken slightly more money than Clinton from those three oil companies, most of the donations were well below the minimum, and come from lower-to-mid-level employees, not executives.

Second, Clinton has accepted more money overall from the energy industry (oil & gas)

Third (and most importantly), she's accepted SIX TIMES more money from registered lobbyists than Obama, and more money from that source than any candidate, D or R.

Who do you think comes knocking at the White House door when a special interest wants something? Not Marissa Jackson, the Accountant for Chevron Corp. who donated $250 to Obama's campaign.

It's the lobbyists who've donated $850,000 to Clinton, not including however much these lobbyists are bundling for her.

It's really quite obvious after reading many of these posts that those who want to save $30 this summer are going to be for the Clinton McCain tax break irregardless the consequences to 300,000 to 400,000 Hwy workers losing their jobs for the summer, not being able to pay their mortgages therefore losing their homes. And of course, while those highway workers are sitting home the highways are deteriorating and bridges becoming less safe.

But what's more important? Well of course the answer is ME. Why should I worry about those highway workers? That's not my problem. Why should I worry about the condition of the highways and bridges? Heck, I won't be driving those highways anyway. And just think, with a $30 I'll save this summer I should be able buy an additional 10 gallons of fuel and at 20 miles a gallon I should be able to drive a whole 200 extra miles this summer.

I wonder if these are the same people who sit at draw bridges with the bridge up, knowing it'll be at least 5 or to 10 minutes before the bridge closes again but just sit with their engines idling and burning fuel?

I wonder if it is of any interest to Indy voters that Hillary was on the board of Wal-Mart for six years? Wal-Mart is the largest union-busting behemoth in the world. She sat through years of speeches with quotes like "Unions are the biggest blood sucking leeches in the world." Hillary is for working class folks? Ya right. Look it up. Also hypocritical is her admonishment of the Chinese. Wal-Mart is the largest importer of Chinese goods in the world. I find it odd that Hillary could on the one hand, serve on the board of Wal-Mart for six years, importing Chinese products, keeping unions out, then turn around and garner support from Unions, working class folk and then give speeches on the evils of China. THAT is the height of hypocrisy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=znPwgIgy8Hg Hillary being praised for her "legal" work, in other words, representing Wal-Mart against unions by Sam Walten.

http://www.hrw.org/campaigns/walmart/video.htm Wal-Mart training video conveying dislike for unions.

It looks like Obama is experienced after all. What is most encouraging about this is that Obama appears to have learned from his experience with a gas tax holiday as a state legislator and does not want to repeat the mistake as a Senator\President.

How refreshing!

I also have to point out that a state gas tax holiday is actually more likely to provide some relief than a national one. Our refineries are at capacity. The price of oil is set by supply and demand. The national gax tax holiday is not going to magicly increase the supply of gas to the U.S. and therefore the price is going to remain the same. It will just mean bigger profits for oil companies and less for government revenue. Obama is right to opposed this goofy idea.

...to BIG GOVERNMENT and continue taxing the Hell out of everything under the sun.

Our refineries are at capacity.
Posted by: Lisa8 | May 1, 2008 3:05 PM

- Our refineries are at 85% of capacity and our gasoline inventories were at 15 year highs now they are still well above historical averages

The price of oil is set by supply and demand.

Posted by: Lisa8 | May 1, 2008 3:05 PM

- We currently have the exact same supply/demand dynamics now at $115 per barrel as we did at $50 per barrel.

The national gax tax holiday is not going to magicly increase the supply of gas to the U.S. and therefore the price is going to remain the same.

Posted by: Lisa8 | May 1, 2008 3:05 PM

- Since we don't have a gasoline supply issue this really isn't the point of the tax break.

It will just mean bigger profits for oil companies and less for government revenue. Obama is right to opposed this goofy idea.

Posted by: Lisa8 | May 1, 2008 3:05 PM

This is true!

Here are the facts.
US refineries are losing lots of money right now. If you don't believe me check out Valero's earnings. They are a refining company and because of high input costs (crude) and low product value (gasoline) they had one of the worst quarters in their history. It may seem to you that gasoline is expensive but if you built a refinery today and processed crude you would lose $3.00/barrel. This is why most US refineries are running at 85%, crude is too expensive to justify processing it since we have plenty of gasoline inventory that isn't being sold.

Companies that produce and sell crude (not gasoline) are making record earnings. These include ExxonMobil, BP, Shell and Chevron. If you look into their earnings statements you will see that they all did awful in their US refining and marketing (downstream) earnings but made billions in crude sales (upstream).

Over 1,000 gas stations in the US go bankrupt every year. Over 90% of US gas stations are owned and operated by independent American business men and women, not the major oil companies. They make $0.95 on each cup of coffee they sell and $0.02 on each gallon of gasoline. When you add in labor, rent and franchise fees that means they lose $0.08 on every gallon of gasoline they sell. Also because of the higher cost of gasoline each time you use your credit card at the pump Visa and Mastercard take even more since they get 2% of every transaction...which is helping their record earnings. Even worse for the station owners is they often don't have the line of credit to purchase full tankers of gasoline which now cost them 3x more than they did at this time last year. This means they can't hold inventory and can't profit on increasing prices, which at this time of year typically make up for the negative margins in the winter months.

Not one supply/demand fundamental justifies our current price for crude. Using historical models the price should be at most $65/barrel.

Over $18 billion left the stock and bond market and went into commodities...just last month. Currently hundreds of billions of dollars are flowing into commodities markets helping prices to go through the roof.

This is an energy bubble and the candidate who regulates commodity investments in Wall Street will solve this problem. The tax break scheme is the worst ideas proposed yet by any candidate and will do nothing except hurt our economy, as we fall further into debt, which will continue to hurt the value of the dollar, which will push more money out of the financial markets and into commodities markets, which will raise crude prices even higher, which will push oil company profits up but kill the US refining and retail industries.

"It's economics, stupid." -Bill Clinton

A pointed attack against Bush Sr.'s economic policies of the late 80's, an attack that allowed him to beat the incumbent presidential nominee.

However, it seems that recently the Clinton campaign has decided to throw economics under that proverbial, relentless, bus. The same bus that has recently claimed so many Obama supporters.
For Clinton, a candidate who's whole platform is based on creating 'working policies' for the working class, it has come down to pandering for votes. It's my hope that the American public understands the economical implications of such a policy. A policy that takes away nearly $9 Billion in revenue from a Government facing $9 Trillion in debt. Cutting taxes is obviously not the road to a national surplus. Depleting highway funds by $9 billion appears to be the road to another year of deficit spending, an un-paved road at that.

I commend the Obama campaign for standing up for what is economically appropriate, and not sinking to the Clinton-McCain level. A decrease in taxes by $.18 cents a galloon will have very little impact in the short-run, but in the long run will prove to be counterproductive.

With that being said, it appears that the economy will be the political talking point of the summer. With almost certain stagflation looming on the forefront of every American's mind, the candidate that can most appropriately address these issues in the general election will prove to be very formidable. It seems that McCain, regardless of how un-realistic his proposals actually are, may be winning over important demographics for the 2008 election.

...to BIG GOVERNMENT and continue taxing the Hell out of everything under the sun.

Posted by: say yes | May 1, 2008 4:48 PM

You either control your spending or you increase your taxes. The McCain/Clinton idea is to increase spending and cut taxes.

They know that they can't touch Big Oil profits that are sitting in off shore subsidiaries.

Its a big fat lie and empty promise to get more votes.

If you have a problem with taxes elect the guy who is going to actually control gov't spending. Unless you enjoy seeing lower gov't tax revenue and more deficit that has to be funded by the Middle East and China.

Dear Southeasterner
You are correct ABOUT THE PAST. I am 58, white, female and have voted for Democrats since I was first eligible to vote, so don't accuse me of being naive. I have had my heart broken many times. Your cynical post is exactly why Obama's message is CHANGE! You said:
"This is a country of lazy FoxNews sound bite people not educated voters. The media tells us we are more interested in tax breaks, US flag pins and what church you go to than what your actual policies are...and since when have Americans ever questioned the media?
While Obama's policy is right for our country it is wrong for a presidential candidate. Welcome to politics.
Posted by: Southeasterner | April 29, 2008 12:42 PM "

Americans can be fooled but we can also learn. We are tired of being duped. We remember Willy Horton, Harry and Louise and Swift Boat AND we know we were duped then. The reason Obama is so inspiring is that his movement is based on ignoring the distractions and remembering what we share in common- not what divides us. Voters can get their news and info from a variety of sources so MSM and Fox News no longer control our thoughts. Voters put Bush in office, twice, and they know they got exactly the opposite of what they wanted. We are no longer as gullible as Hillary and McCain think we are. Why not vote hope? What have you got to loose? If Hillary and McCain will pander with a gas tax holiday, how can you trust them on anything? Talk to some young people. Then join us and get to work. WE control the ending. Stop just watching and commenting. Get involved again. YES WE CAN!

I'm so ashamed for America. Everyday I cringe when I see the people that support a racist, anti-American candidate like Barack Obama.

Funny thing is, they are all enthralled with his race. It's the pundits, whose legs tingle, the kids who have no clue why, the women who faint, the white men who need to assert their penises and the blacks who vote their mirror.

It's so sad to see what is happening to these people who have no clue what is really wrong with this country. They don't care! They are willing to let the Pied Piper of Racism lead them right off the cliff, no questions asked. I mean, has this chameleon told you anything of substance about the issues? Of course not. The only plans he has have been lifted from Hillaryclinton.com.

He doesn't need to talk to you about issues because , deep down inside, you have that Barack fantasy. That is where all his followers come together. They see themselves sleeping with him. It's what moves them all, male and female. Chris Matthews and Gloria Borger. Keith Olbermann and Campbell Brown!!! Orgasms for Obama!!!!