The Fact-Checker, by Michael Dobbs

It does "seem" reasonable, but only God knows for sure.

This is simply amazing, and an attestatmment to the ignorance and shallowness of the media and American public. If Obama was a Muslim, that would be his choice and protected under the constitution. But Obama professes his Christian faith, and still the ignorant and uneducated push this "he's a muslim" stuff. Obama was 6 years old while he lived with his step-father in Indonesia!!!! How many 6 years old know or get to choose the religion they want practice?! This discussion about Obama's faith as a 6 years old is simply dumb. For those who are not going to support Obama, they will find any excuse they can from "he was a Muslim" to "he attended a radical Black Christian Church"!

Nothing personal, but during WWII, would we have elected a Japanese-American as President.

How oxymoronic? Obama is both a muslim and christian!

Fightthesmears.com

There are indeed 6 year olde brainwashed with nothing but the Koran.

You have to look at guys like Floyd Brown and realize that smearing people who don't agree with their agenda is their only way of "debate." They are evidently not clever or smart enough to carry on a conversation about the issues. So they try to scare people.

What is more worrisome is McCain's rsponse to it. It would have taken him 2 seconds to say, "I reject this kind of fear-mongering." He has said he would run a clean campaign. So why not keep it clean all around? Instead, he said something like, 'I can't control evey little thing on television.' Why did he say this? Because he is interested in winning, no matter how. This is what we don't want more of in the WH.

As so many millions of people have said, "Not this time."

It is time to kick Religion out of American Politics...this nation was founded on Freedom of Religion and Freedom FROM Religion! Religion should not be a litmus test for President. I happen to believe obama when he says that he is a Christian, but I really don't care about anyone's religious affliation, and I don't understand why it is even part of the discussion.

Ignorance is like weeds that grow in a garden. They spring-up without warning, and the only way to kill them is to smother them, with "truthfulness"!

You know what, I don't really care either way. Let me check with Oden and Zuse... Nope they don't care either. Its not what you believe but its what you do.

Jake D: You can't say 6-yr-olds are brainwashed by the Koran. What you can say is that they are taught it, and like all six year olds, they respond how their parents/caregivers/teachers want them to respond. What happens when they grow up is a different matter entirely, and one on which you are not competent to judge.

But from your remark I think we can draw the logical conclusion that if a Muslim 6-yr-old is brainwashed with the Koran, then a Christian or a Jewish 6-yr-old is brainwashed with the Bible. So that religion is a matter merely of brainwashing people.

McCain, the GOP, and conservative news media will only attempt to smear Obama in order for them to win in November. The Republicans know that they can't win on the issues because the Republican brand has been severely damaged by George W. Bush and some Republicans.

Let the dummies like Floyd Brown and Sean Hannity focus on Obama's activities as a 6 year old or who he knows of 1st, 2nd or 3rd-hand accounts, that may be controversial. Obama and level-minded Americans will focus on the issues like creating jobs in America, fixing high health care costs, fixing our Iraq War blunder, fixing the home mortgage and credit crisis, and so forth!

If 6 year olds here were taught nothing except the Bible, yes, I would call that brainwashing too.

Obama-Junkie:

It is not a "smear" to point out the fact that he was registered as "Muslim".

We are all brain washed. Even people like me who were taught to question all authority.

An example, I am just guessing here, that most people here think at least one of the following is "good": Capitalism, Democracy, the United States, and thus the enemies of these things must be "evil".

But how often do you look at how capitalism exploits the poor and middle class, the US is hated by much of the world because we intervene in their domestic affairs and our Democracy does not give equal treatment to people outside the Democratic and Republican Parties?

I am not saying those things are "evil", I tend to dislike the terms good and evil, but just saying, question everything even the tenant of questioning everything.

Stupid Republicans,

Hillary lost her race because she spent too much time and money arguing an issue "40 years ago" relating to her opponent. Now are you saying that you are going to spend your money on things happen when somebody was "6 years old"?

You should have learned some lessons from her historic loss. Save your money and use it to reinforce your images and to change your messages, stupid.

I warned you last time that borrowing some phrases from Reagan's speech will not work. Work on your own things first, stupid: "I am the one who can bring the right change"? Give me a break.

Tiger:

I'm glad you believe him, but you really can't see the relevance if he's lying about being a Muslim during a war with Islamic terrorists?

I would actually guess that Obama is lying about being anything more than a "secular humanist" like his mother was, as most politicians only go to a church because they have to win over the religion vote. The GOP started that one decades ago.

JakeD:

"Nothing personal, but during WWII, would we have elected a Japanese-American as President."

Do you mean one of the Japanese-Americans that were "relocated" to internment camps and had their constitutional rights violated? Or a Japanese-American that was fighting the Germans and Italians in the ETO?

Are you saying that Japan in WWII is equivalent to Islam in 2008? That would mean that we are at war with all of Islam, which is patently ridiculous. Or you are saying that all Muslims are terrorists, which is extremely offensive.

Jake D:

You remind me of the radical right-wing French politician, Jean-Marie Le Pen. He says perfectly outrageous, inflammatory, racist things, but in each there is some kind of a kernel of truth that enables the poor and uneducated to accept the whole of what he says.

Take your assertion that it isn't a smear to point out that Obama was registered as a Muslim. This is true. But in the context in which we are discussing this, it is a smear, which you conveniently ignore. His being registered as a Muslim by his step-father at aged 6 is being used to question whether or not we can believe him when he says he is a Christian, and furthermore, to incite poeple to make the connection between an Osama Bin Laden Muslim and our presidency. And, that perhaps he is secretly a Muslim who is intent on doing something terrible to us. It's fear, Jake D. Can't you see that? Because if people like you stopped fearing and started to think things through, you would see that it, in fact, doesn't matter about his religion or who registered him for what at aged 6. It matters on what basis he is asking us to let him take the country forward - these are called "issues of the day."

And by the way, you have no way of knowing what kind of an education a 6-yr-old Muslim is getting. You are simply not competent to say if a Muslim child is being brain-washed or not. You are just intent on making inflammatory statements.

If I might say so, Jake D: your level and type of thinking is what has been driving this country into the ground for many decades now. You really should try and expand your mind.

I do not live in fear of anything. Nor do I think that all Muslims are terrorists. A secret Muslim lying about it in order to gain the Presidency during this war, however, would be a mistake. I don't need to watch Fox News to see that.

As for the Japanese-American being elected President during WWII, I was simply making an analogous point. Even controlling for racism, let's say he was a Harvard-Law grad too, it just would not have been good idea to let that person decide whether to drop the A-bomb.

P.S. to Alex -- so you would vote for him or not based on that lie?

Nice catch and a very clear explanation. 'Obama 08

Great comments Liz...

JakeD is like a pesky nat on a hot summer day...and you showed him what its like to get hit with a flyswatter!

He's old and lonely. Making outrageous comments that provoke responses is how his guy gets his fix.

So sad...

These attacks are weak. If you can't handle that he's black or simply reject democrats by default regardless of the quality of the candidate stop being a puss about it and say so.

LOL, Yep, maybe you can get Liz to finally answer the question I asked you on the other Fact Checker thread? You really need a girl to fight for you?

JakeD:

How do you know Obama is not a secret Catholic?

He has more connections to Catholicism than Islam...

Oh, wait...that doesnt fit your/the repubs agenda

Sorry, guys, but I am busy this morning trying to make McCain exciting. If you watched The Colbert Report last night, that will be more difficult than beating the Nazis or putting a man on the moon.

What, only 3 Pinochios??? You are much too easy on this kind of toxic manure.

In this country, people would rather vote for a muslim over an atheist. I agree with another poster, religion should be taken out of american politics...unless its Scientology, those people are crazy.

JakeD:

I'll battle you anytime and any place...

Just make sure you take your medamucil and have an extra set of adult depends!

What was the mindless/lame question in which you wanted an answer?

JakeD:

I'll battle you any time and any place...

Just make sure you take your metamucil and have an extra set of depends on hand!

What was the mindless/lame question in which you wanted an answer...

This question has been answered already . . .

http://notionscapital.wordpress.com/2008/03/08/attention-white-people-this-is-rumor-control/

. . . even in Yiddish!

http://notionscapital.wordpress.com/2008/05/24/shalom-south-florida/

Jake D: Where to begin? Let's take the following statement:

"Even controlling for racism, let's say he was a Harvard-Law grad too, it just would not have been good idea to let that person decide whether to drop the A-bomb."

I'm glad you admit that you are a racist, and that in this case you have merely tried to "control for racism" in your thoughts to make a larger point, itself flawed.

You are saying that his being a Muslim excludes him from being not just a good President, but from being the President at all. So the Constitution, which says that religion is not an issue, is wrong, as I see your comments. But there's more. You say if he were (a Muslim) but also a Harvard grad, we should ignore the education - i.e., the possibility that he is smart as hell and most likely has the ability to think, reason, read and judge at the highest level of our nation's ability to educate. WHat we need to look at, according to your own words, is his religion, which is something different from our own, and therefore we should reject it on the basis of its being different, or something we might not be able to understand. I reject this.

But where is your evidence - aside from Fox News - that Obama is lying about being a Christian, and is, in actual fact, a Muslim? Because I don't care if he is a one-eyed hunchback with a hook arm and a hair-lip. I don't care what religion he is. I do, though, care if he is lying. So prodouce your evidence.

What I look at, Jake D., is what he thinks on the issues, what evidence there is that he can draw people together to accomplish his goals - and there is plenty. I see most of today's leaders streaming toward him, people who have worked with him and are in a position to make a better judgment than me on this matter.I see the whole world energized with the possibility of his presidency and of a world we can create together. I see how he has run his campaign: no drama, no fighting, and with exquisitely intelligent use of financial and human resources. And I think that we are in a lot of trouble, Jake D. - not just our country, but our world. And I think he has the biggest chance to positively impact this.
Will he make mistakes? Of course. Will he always be right? Of course not. Will there be Reverend Wrights and so on? You bet. But this does not bother me. I hope he can get thru them. What bothers me is the situation in which we find ourselves after 8 years of Bush, and how we will emerge from the debacle that has been his legacy.

I agree with Alex35332 - I think BHO is just using "religion" for political expediency and is probably more of a 'secular humanist' than anything.

On a side note - Is Fact Checker going to depend on "Fight the Smears" for its columns?

They know that if Obama becomes president they will no longer be able to make money through selling weapons of mass destruction that they are using to kill even Americans. Dont fall for their cheap lies.They are weapon tycoons.

JakeD:

Another SMACK-DOWN!!! Shoo Fly, don't bother me...

And, to the "nameless"

Yeah, fact checker should depend on it when there is documented evidence to rebut a false claim!

If you go to site, they actually have sources which can be "fact-checked"

Instead of, I heard this or somebody told me that...stop the bogus hearsay crap

The only thing that matters is that Obama is a liar.
He is lying by mere avoidance of the issue.
He's creepy.
Why wouldn't he mention that his Father was a Muslim and that he attended a Muslim School.
Now he is throwing his past and his father under the bus.
It's getting awfully crowded under the bus, don't you think?

Yep (here it is, one last time):

"Were you upset when the Democrats in the Senate minority used the filibuster?" I first asked you this after pointing out that the Democrats have been in charge of Congress for almost 18, not 6, months.

Liz:

I did not "admit" to being a racist -- try reading the hypothetical again -- for instance, I wouldn't mind voting for a pro-life Muslim and/or African-American. My "evidence" (on this thread for starters) is that Barack Hussein Obama was registered at BOTH his schools in Indonesia as "Muslim". Maybe another analogy would be helpful: are babies BAPTIZED in the Catholic Church considered "Christians"?

Seems like it is probably now fair game to go after Mccain on his wife beating and abuse. His alcoholism and drug abuse. Most recently referring to his wife in public as a cu*t. The difference is, it is all a fact and not just made up or innuendo. They want to go after Obamas wife then lets take a look at Mccains drug addicted wife. She has, if we can believe it, only been clean for a couple of years. I read the Republicans want to play dirty, as far as I am concerned let the sh*t fly. Mccain has a past that is well documented and I am sure many are not yet aware of.

I'm sure The Fact Checker will have a thread on McCain's wife soon enough.

Rumors will not work this time to undermine our Next President's Campaign Barack Obama

http://youngdemocratsforchange.com

The fact that we are even discussing this is absurd. I can't remember anything I did as a six year-old. I didn't even know what religion I was supposed to be.

We could, however, point out that Mr. McCain claimed that all was well in Iraq as he walked around without a bullet-resistant vest while claiming that the commanding general rode around in an unarmored vehicle.

Those were out-and-out LIES. There are facts surrounding his claims that can be supported by those who were there at the time.

I'm not concerned about what a six year-old did or did not know; I am very concerned about someone in his 70s LYING with a straight face.

Obama will be our Next President.
The rumors will not work

http://youngdemocratsforchange.com

Why would brown let a little issue like facts get in his way. Typical gop. They can't win on the issues and their candidate so they do it dirty - and then they wonder why our country is such a mess. Don't buy their bull. We definitely don't need another C student as president.

Republicans and John McCain read polls and hear the people and they know, to their core, they cannot win on the issues this election. It is simply impossible, 2/3 of Americans simply do not believe them or believe they are sincere but mistaken.

The only chance in hell they have is to smear Obama and scare the masses that do not think for themselves into being more afraid of Obama than they are of McCain continuing the Bush policies. So that is the route they are taking. Paint Obama as an elitist, a tax and spend liberal, a muslim, an angry black man, a secret agent, a Manchurian Candidate, an incompetent administrator, a naif, a bumbler, an out of touch arugula eater, soft on crime, a military coward, a cut and runner, whatever it takes.

Just so you all know. As a southern white male of 51, I say now that through all of that he will have my vote, because more than any other politician in my lifetime, Obama walks the talk. He is the only one that can save this country from bankruptcy and destruction, the only one that can keep us safe, and a vote for McCain is not just political suicide but literal suicide.

Look at the 5-4 Supreme Court decision to uphold habeas corpus, the right to a trial. FIVE to FOUR. The SC justices retiring or dying next term are all likely to be liberals, and if McCain appoints even one more religious conservative like Roberts or Alito or Scalia, it isn't just Roe v. Wade that will be overturned. The Constitution will be gutted, the President will then have de facto dictatorial powers as long as the poorly defined "war on terror" continues, which of course will be forever because there is no way to define the end of it and no reason to do so.

The gross profits of big oil are $1500 per year for every man, woman and child in the USA. About $7500 per family in PROFIT. Consider THAT a tax on your income to pay for this war.

The value of the dollar has dropped 50% since Bush took office. Consider THAT a tax on your income to pay for this war.

We went from a 5 trillion dollar surplus to a 3 trillion dollar deficit under Bush. About $26,500 for every man, woman and child in the USA, about $100,000 per family. Consider THAT a tax on your income to pay for this war.

McCain wants to continue the bloodshed and bankrupt the nation for some stubborn sense of honor. Screw him. We are not Spartans. Iraq has become a failed international aid program that must be terminated. It is not about terror and never was, it is about "coercive democracy". Screw that. Screw them. We've given them YEARS of chances and the handouts must stop. Let them fight their civil war, we've done all we can.

Elect Obama.

These are serious times and this election will not be decided on rumors or innuendoes. People are paying attention to what are life changing issues for many. I have faith in the American people to do the right thing. We have no choice, this country is all we have and it has fallen far and people know it. They are tired of being fooled.

+++++++++
Obama will be our Next President.
The rumors will not work

http://youngdemocratsforchange.com

Posted by: Suzanne | June 13, 2008 12:04 PM

WE HAVE A WINNER!!! The inane poster - and Fox news viewer of the day award goes to A1 for his/her fine display of irrational unsubstantiated ranting using points that could only be gleamed from the junior high lunchroom or Fox & Friends.

"The only thing that matters is that Obama is a liar.
He is lying by mere avoidance of the issue.
He's creepy.
Why wouldn't he mention that his Father was a Muslim and that he attended a Muslim School.
Now he is throwing his past and his father under the bus.
It's getting awfully crowded under the bus, don't you think?"

Posted by: Al from NJ | June 13, 2008 11:42 AM

IS OBAMA A PATRIOTIC AMERICAN who fresh out of HARVARD with his JD in constitutional law
had the options of a fast road to ease and the big bucks
made the considerable and conscious choice to TAKE A LONGER AND MORE RISKY ROAD.
to do GOOD for ALL AMERICAS (even you idiots who dont want to get it)

read the harvard law review article about his ADULT CHOICES!

not how his mommy signed him up in grade school so She would get along better with local folks. !

this is trash. he was a young child without choice!
and you know what Rehashing this can do to the too many voters who don't think things through.

SHAME ON YOU.!

Anne (and Sus-ANNE):

Barack Hussein Obama will not be sworn in as President on January 20, 2009.

JakeD;

"As for the Japanese-American being elected President during WWII, I was simply making an analogous point. Even controlling for racism, let's say he was a Harvard-Law grad too, it just would not have been good idea to let that person decide whether to drop the A-bomb."

Oh, so now you question the patriotism of Japanese-Americans, even though there were a number of them that saw combat and died for our country in WWII. That the progeny of immigrants cannot separate their genetics from their oath to uphold the Constitution of the United States.

Why did you limit it to Japanese-Americans? Because you really are a racist? Why not German-Americans or Italian-Americans? If Operation Overlord and the Soviet advance hadn't been so successful, Truman might have had to choose to drop the A-bomb on Germany.

And your analogy for baptism sucks. According to the Fact Checker, Obama was registered as a Muslim because his step-father was a Muslim. So, if your stepmother was Jewish and registered you for school as a Jew when you were a kid, then are you a Jew or a "secret" Jew, even though you call yourself Christian and go to a Christian church?

The thread topic is "Was Obama Ever a Muslim?" If you'd rather not discuss that, fine by me.

Yep:

Where did you go? What happened to "any time, any where"?

Liz:

I think that Yep needs your assistance again.

I am FAR more concerned about the "religous" teachings of Rev. Wright, Obama's self-proclaimed mentor. We've all heard the good Reverand's remarks, damning America, and professing the teachings of Dr. Cone. Take a look at Black Liberation Theology. It is a fact that Sen. Obama has the Marxist, murdering revelutionist, Che Guevara on the wall in his Chicago campaign headquarters. A MARXIST!!! Forget about religion. Does anyone know the Marxist ideology that Mr. Obama, Rev. Wright and Dr. Cone all seem to subscribe to? Take a deeper look at Sen. Obama and his mentors please!!!

Well no, lying about ones religion is of zero importance to me as again, almost every politician does it, I care only about lies that directly get people killed. I am not voting for him because I live in DC and lean more towards Green values/ social libertarianism so I am deciding between McKinny and Nader.

You're the one bringing up analogies to Japanese-Americans, Catholics. If you want to discuss the topic of the thread, then stick to the topic of the thread.

But I notice that while you say it would be fine with you not to discuss the thread topic, you choose not to post a rejoinder.

And your "evidence" that Obama is a Muslim in 2008 is that he was registered as a Muslim at a Catholic and a public school 40 years ago?

Thank you for a well reasoned, even handed take on this.

When a political campaign hangs its hat on such tiny shreds of "evidence," taken out of context, it suggests they have no positive vision of their own to offer the American electorate.

I wouldn't think it was fair to call this offensive TV ad a part of the McCain campaign -- except that he has specifically declined to repudiate it. I always used to admire Senator McCain, and I don't understand that decision.

Mccain does not seem to know what religion he is or was he just lying.

=======
http://news.aol.com/newsbloggers/2007/09/18/john-mccain-forgets-what-religion-he-is/

McCain: Overall faith what's important

Republican presidential hopeful Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., makes a campaign stop Monday Sept. 17, 2007,at the Veterans of Foreign Wars Post 7 in Lexington, S.C. (AP Photo/Mary Ann Chastain)
By Jim Davenport, Associated Press Writer | September 17, 2007

AIKEN, S.C. --Republican presidential candidate John McCain said Monday that questions over whether he identifies himself as a Baptist or an Episcopalian are not as important as his overarching faith. "The most important thing is that I am a Christian," the Arizona senator told reporters following two campaign stops in this early voting state.

The comment came after a weekend during which McCain corrected an Associated Press reporter who asked him how his Episcopalian faith plays a role in his campaign and his life. While it's well-known that McCain and his family for years have attended the North Phoenix Baptist Church in his home state of Arizona, the senator had consistently referred to himself in media reports as Episcopalian.

"It plays a role in my life. By the way, I'm not Episcopalian. I'm Baptist," McCain said Saturday. "Do I advertise my faith? Do I talk about it all the time? No."

In a June interview with McClatchy Newspapers, the senator said his wife and two of their children have been baptized in the Arizona Baptist church, but he had not. "I didn't find it necessary to do so for my spiritual needs," he said.

He told McClatchy he found the Baptist church more fulfilling than the Episcopal church, but still referred to himself as an Episcopalian.

In May, McCain's campaign identified his religion to The Associated Press as Episcopalian, but noted his four younger children are Baptists and he attends the North Phoenix Baptist Church when at home.

McCain grew up Episcopalian and attended an Episcopal high school in Alexandria, Va. On Monday, he spoke briefly about that history and about the Baptist church he now attends. Then, after saying his overall faith is what's important, he concluded: "I don't have anything else to say about that issue."

During a morning stop in Aiken, McCain spoke to about 180 veterans and other supporters at a Veteran of Foreign Wars post as part of his three-state "No Surrender" tour. He encouraged people to ask legislators to turn back efforts by Democrats to curtail the war in Iraq by limiting how long troops can serve there.

After that appearance, McCain reaffirmed his support for embryonic stem cell research, which he said has split abortion foes.

"It's very tough for those of us in the pro-life community," McCain told reporters. "I've prayed a lot about it, but I've come down on the side of support for embryonic stem cell research. It has split the pro-life community."

(This version CORRECTS SUBS last graf to correct quote.)

© Copyright 2007 Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed.
More from Boston.com

Lovely headline, guys. Every time I check into the Post, it seems that you become ever more neocon. Let's see if I can learn to play this game... "Was McCain Ever a Paedophile?" Wow! Its that easy to slur a public figure and sabotage a campaign without actually technically committing libel!

Never underestimate the ignorance of the American people. They got exactly what they deserved when they elected Bush. Perhaps McCain will be next.

Jake D:

The Answer is NO!

As I recall, you were saying the dems haven't accomplished anything since they have regained both houses of congress. (which is not true)

Factually, I pointed out that's becuase the GOP, who cried foul when dems used it primarily on judical nominees, is now using it on virtually every bill that comes up in the Senate!!!

That's why nothing is being acccomplished. (And, don't forget the presidential veto, which then requires 2/3 of congress to over turn)

The dems barely control the Senate and don't have the same numbers in the house as the gop did...that's why they can't ram legislation through...

It's obvious you have no clue about senate or congressional procedure

Are you willing to concede this point?

If not, your less intelligent than I thought...

Don't worry, all that's going to change in november!

And, NO Obama was never a Muslim...

The only evidence you can point to is document that had him "registered" as Muslim...

oh and don't forget that same document wrongly listed him as indonesian, gave the wrong name of his previous school, and made no mention of his mother...

If they couldn't even get his nationality right, how can you rely on this document as the end all to determine his religion????

Stupid is as Stupid does...

The fact of the matter is that, under normal conditions we would think the point of knowing if Barack is a Muslim, is only to then go further to use his religion as a reason to not elect him.

One thing Barack Obama is not, is an idiot.
That fact should make people feel good.

How about dealing with pertinent facts.

But I do understand these questions by default are let into the arena on the premise that, if prejudice has a vote, then your religion is on the table!

I never thought about Barack Obama's religion anymore than I thought about Bush or Clinton's religion.

When I vote, I am voting for the most intelligent person, with the ability of doing and achieving things that have been long over due!

Hey all you uninformed readers! There is no direct mention of God or Christ in the U.S. Constitution, and no religious test of any kind is allowed for any office of the United States. What makes you wiser than the Founding Fathers?

It seems reasonable that Obama may have been a Muslim because his father and stepfather were Muslims and he was raised partially in a predominantly Muslim country. He says he is Christian, attending Reverend Wright's church for 20 years until he was pressured to leave the church recently. There should be a way of checking (he should be asked specific questions and he should provide specific, not general or vague, answers) what church he attended or what his religion was before he joined the Trinity church. As pointed out, the problem may not be whether he was, in fact, registered a Muslim (even though he or his stepfather might not have been practicing Muslims) but rather the attempted cover-up and the reason for the cover-up. Ultimately, the issue is whether or not he is trustworthy. Can somebody do more serious investigating?

1. A 40-year old school record from Indonesia, that contains many errors, has 6-year-old Obama listed as a Muslim.

2. Barack Obama says that he was never a Muslim.

Why can't both of these things be true?

If this is all the evidence that can be assembled that Obama is a 'secret Muslim' (crazy JakeD's words), then the conclusion is clear: Obama is who he says he is.

Jake - maybe all reality is an illusion, or you are dreaming or hallucinating, and if you ram your head against a cinder block wall, it will pass right through. Hey - I'm just saying - you'll never know FOR SURE until you try. Also, it is it true that John McCain is a secret zombie who died while a prisoner of war and was zombified by our enemies for exactly this purpose? It's possible, and I think we should spend a lot of punditry time discussing this possibility.

Mike Lecht:

Since I don't read Yiddish, I only reviewed your first link (I did not see Obama's schooling addressed at all). It certainly did not answer the thread topic question: Was Barack Hussein Obama Ever a Muslim?

Alex:

I hope you understand that I am concerned about ALL lies, even lies about BJs from interns.

Just wondering:

That post was to dc Matthews. I didn't say I won't discuss the thread topic.

Fairfax Voter:

If we can't even agree on this one "shred" of evidence, what's the use trying to convince you? Any case before a jury is built one brick at a time. Have you reviewed the Daniel Pipes link?

Terry (and VB in case you did not know):

The words "Our Lord" are indeed found in the U.S. Constitution, referring to none other than Jesus Christ. Look right there after Article VII.

Margarita L:

Try convincing msw13 of that.

"Nothing personal, but during WWII, would we have elected a Japanese-American as President.

Posted by: JakeD | June 13, 2008 9:43 AM"

JakeD, take a good long look at your argument above and if you have half a brain you'll see that it is illogical.

Spock:

I am assuming, for the purposes of said hypothetical that "we" were of voting age in 1942. Other than that, you will have to specify what exactly is illogical.

It does not matter if it is true or not. What matters is to get the story out there so it can take on a life of it's own.

You say you are all about lies, what about when a vice president lies, says that someone is in bed with a terrorist group as a pretext to go to war and it turns out to be a lie? What about when a president says he will fire whoever leaked the secret identity of a CIA agent and then does not do it?

Listen, if you take faith seriously, it's a choice, not a word written on a document. To become a Muslim, a person has to declare himself a Muslim, just like Baptists have to accept Christ, as do Catholics, who also have to complete confirmation.

This is not only a false attack, but an attack which diminishes faith in all its forms.

The real significance is not merely the swift boating style of the Republican propagandists but the fact that 21st American culture is imbued with anti-Arab and anti-Muslim, racists sentiments--a dehumanized sentiment that causes people to fear and loath anything connected with Arabs or Muslims, much as 20th Century German culture was imbued with anti-Semitism and 19th Century America, especially in the Jim Crow South, was imbued with anti-African American racism. This is the reason propagandists like Pipes & Brown continue to circulate the "Obama is a Muslim" canard and continue to stress his middle name--Hussein, as if these have any relevance to our decision whether to elect a man who is in every sense the intellectual and moral superior of his Republican opponent.

"It is a fact that Sen. Obama has the Marxist, murdering revelutionist, Che Guevara on the wall in his Chicago campaign headquarters."

No, it's not a fact.

Margarita,

Obama wrote a book in 1995, long before he was in a presidential race, that details these early years in Indonesia (and Hawaii and Chicago, until he was ~26 years old). The impetus for the book was his election as the first black president of the Harvard Law Review. The book is an examination of race, and how it has affected him and how it affects others in America.

You comment "There should be a way of checking (he should be asked specific questions and he should provide specific, not general or vague, answers) what church he attended or what his religion was before he joined the Trinity church." - This book spends many chapters on exactly these issues.

On Amazon.com, the book is less than 9 bucks - "Dreams from my father: A story of Race and Hope".

Though not a long-time Obama supporter, I found the book fascinating, extremely well-written, and a worthwhile read even if Obama was not running for president.

Also - please consider at least the possibility that you are being misled about a 'cover-up'. There is an Indonesian School record that lists 6-year-old Obama as a Muslim. He says that he was never a Muslim. The fact that he disagrees with an old school record is NOT a cover-up. There is NO evidence that Barack has ever lied about this, or misled people about it, or denied that the record exists - he disagrees with the old school record.

The people who are being paid millions of dollars to get you to question Obama's patriotism have certainly read the book - they ignored all the information in there that clearly indicates Obama was never a Muslim ( because they aren't interested in truth, they are being paid to mislead you).

Also, Jake D - did you make it? Did your head go right through the cinder block wall? After all, - I'm just saying - you'll never know FOR SURE until you try.
Also, why are covering up that John McCain is a secret zombie who died while a prisoner of war and was zombified by our enemies for exactly this purpose? Has he ever specifically denied that he is a zombie? If not, why do you think he keeps lying about this. You do agree that if he is a zombie, that is relevant to the election, don't you?

I am no expert, but as I understand Islam one is Muslim if one's father is Muslim. Only Muslim children are given the name Hussein. Of course, one can later make the decision to become a Christian, as Obama claims to have done at Trinity Church.

Have you seen him in person? I have and that is one rumor I am inclined to believe.

++++++++++
Also, why are covering up that John McCain is a secret zombie who died while a prisoner of war and was zombified by our enemies for exactly this purpose? Has he ever specifically denied that he is a zombie? If not, why do you think he keeps lying about this. You do agree that if he is a zombie, that is relevant to the election, don't you?
Posted by: msw13 | June 13, 2008 1:57 PM

JakeD, time for the links, already... God, you do latch on something completely useless to avoid having to prop up your candidate, McCain.

msw13:

I will be happy to address all of those questions just as soon as The Fact Checker posts your "Is McCain a Zombie" thread.

Where is our smear machine? I think that when they smear Obama that we should come right back with a real zinger!! But the difference between us and them is that our zinger will be true while their's is manufactured. Lets start with the many people that were POWs with McCain who say that he was a collaberator and received much better treatment thet the others. Lets talk about him picking up his wife Cindy in a bar in Hawaii and carrying on an affair with her and then he dumped his crippled wife { she was injured in a car accident} and kids.Or maybe we should bring up his involvment in the savings and loan scandal and his connection to Keating ,who went to jail. This is a guy who's whole background is ridden with scandal.He is a phoney who believes his own hype.He has cheated all the way to the top!!

The issue is not that he was a Muslim or was raised a Muslim, the fact that he was indeed registered at his school as a Muslim is documented. The fact that he was and for some reason claims that he wasn't is the disturbing issue. Why doesn't he just set the record straight? He was raised as a Muslim and then as an adult turned to Christianity. End of story. His religion (or lack thereof) shouldn't have any bearing on his ability to preside over the country, right?
Everyone is focusing on his race or religion. No one seems to notice the fact that this guy has no track record! Nobody knows for sure who he is or what he really stands for! I mean seriously, who gets elected to a public office and then thumbs his nose at all of the people that elected him by voting "Present" on almost every issue that comes up? Obama did that during his few years of serving in public office. How does that define him as the "Candidate for Change"? Voting "Present" basically says, "I am here, but I don't want to have any effect on anything." Also, he has no military experience at all, how is he qualified to be the "Commander In Chief" of our armed forces?
People who think that the "War On Terror" should be ended because it seems unfocused and is costing American lives and massive resources should also consider the "War On Drugs" or the "War On Crime" both of which have gone on far longer and cost far more! should we stop them as well? No! Because the opposing forces will not stop, and we cannot throw up our hands in surrender!
People in other countries have always hated Americans because they are jealous of the freedoms that we have, not because we "meddle" in other countries affairs. During the beginning of World War Two they were mad at us for staying out of it because WE thought it wasn't our business! This world has been made smaller than ever by global information and communication, and by affordable high-speed travel. With the combining of global markets and the increase of global trade, our economy and the stability of our country can be directly influenced by instability in other parts of the world. Because of this, we have endeavored to assist with stabilization in those regions. More often than not, it is humanitarian aid in the form of Food and Medical supplies, but armed troops are also needed at times when human lives are at risk from those who would do evil to them. If we do not want to offend anyone, we can withdraw all of our troops and humanitarian aid back to within our borders, but then we will be villianized for NOT helping once again.
In conclusion, I would suggest that everyone stop focusing on whether a candidate was a particular Religion or a mediocre student when they were young, and try to find out what kind of a man they are right now when it is relative. There is no one who can claim that they have made no mistakes in their past! It is only important that they have learned and from them so as to not repeat them.

Amazing how we've allowed hate into our lives. It's clear that Obama received a secular upbringing - which BTW explains how he could be so tone deaf to Rev. Wright's extremism. He thinks of religion and church as a choice comprised of many factors including fellowship as well as faith, and NOT as something that defines him. That's a GOOD thing.

But the main point: Does anyone remember President Bush after 9/11 repeatedly stating how many Muslims are loyal Americans and that just being associated with Islam in some way doesn't make anyone a terrorist? I do! Let's resurrect some of THOSE videos.

The idea that Obama's being peripherally exposed to Islamic culture as a child somehow makes him unfit to hold office is patently absurd. Even if he WERE actually a practicing Muslim, it wouldn't impact his fitness for public office.

The Daniel Pipes article (linked above) contains a dozen links and can be translated into 12 languages.

Maybe fact checker should do one on McCain's apparent flip-flop on social security privatization.

Oh, I know its an issue, JakeD, not some "look into the scary black man" story, but it is important to a lot of older americans - those that don't tool around in their wife's private jet.

Martimr1:

If he's LYING about that, though, that's still not relevant to you?

The New York Times did a series of articles about this discussing the opinions of leading scholars who are and others who have studied Islam. They agreed that Obama would not have been considered Muslim. And Obama's biological father left the family when he was very young anyway. The school records you're talking about related to his stepfather, not his father. And whether other Muslims consider him Muslim is actually not important - what's at issue is whether he considered himself a Muslim and is now lying about it. His book has made clear that he never did consider himself Muslim.

'Infamous' Willie Horton ad? Only to Democrats and the mainstream media, if there's not too much redundancy there. Liberals screamed and tried to change the subject from Dukakis' callous defense of an absolutely idiotic furlough program to the familiar charges of 'racism' -as if the GOP wouldn't have attacked Dukakis if Horton had been 'white'. The public got the message - Dukakis really was soft on crime and punishment issues, and the case called into question the quality of the judges he might appoint to the federal bench. Bill Clinton also got the message. Four years after 'Willie Horton', he flew to Arkansas to supervise the execution of Ricky Ray Rector, a retarded killer - an act far more cynical than the GOP's actions re Willie Horton, but which I have yet to see referred to as an 'infamous' moment by the orthodox functionaries in the mainstream media.

Some people neecd to get over 'Willie Horton' if they are really interested in accurate journalism instead of mind-numbing liberal sock-puppetry. The ad was accurate and well within the Democratic Party's own ethical standards of campaigning. Only bleeding-heart liberals get upset about the Horton ad or call it 'infamous'. It's depressing to see how strong the corruption of journalism by partisan framing and narratives remains.

(From Daniel Pipes)

As Barack Obama's candidacy comes under increasing scrutiny, his account of his religious upbringing deserves careful attention for what it tells us about the candidate's integrity.

Obama asserted in December, "I've always been a Christian," and he has adamantly denied ever having been a Muslim. "The only connection I've had to Islam is that my grandfather on my father's side came from that country [Kenya]. But I've never practiced Islam." In February, he claimed: "I have never been a Muslim. ... other than my name and the fact that I lived in a populous Muslim country for 4 years when I was a child [Indonesia, 1967-71] I have very little connection to the Islamic religion."

"Always" and "never" leave little room for equivocation. But many biographical facts, culled mainly from the American press, suggest that, when growing up, the Democratic candidate for president both saw himself and was seen as a Muslim.

Obama's Kenyan birth father: In Islam, religion passes from the father to the child. Barack Hussein Obama, Sr. (1936-1982) was a Muslim who named his boy Barack Hussein Obama, Jr. Only Muslim children are named "Hussein".

Obama's Indonesian family: His stepfather, Lolo Soetoro, was also a Muslim. In fact, as Obama's half-sister, Maya Soetoro-Ng explained to Jodi Kantor of the New York Times: "My whole family was Muslim, and most of the people I knew were Muslim." An Indonesian publication, the Banjarmasin Post reports a former classmate, Rony Amir, recalling that "All the relatives of Barry's father were very devout Muslims."

The Catholic school: Nedra Pickler of the Associated Press reports that "documents showed he enrolled as a Muslim" while at a Catholic school during first through third grades. Kim Barker of the Chicago Tribune confirms that Obama was "listed as a Muslim on the registration form for the Catholic school." A blogger who goes by "An American Expat in Southeast Asia" found that "Barack Hussein Obama was registered under the name 'Barry Soetoro' serial number 203 and entered the Franciscan Asisi Primary School on 1 January 1968 and sat in class 1B. ... Barry's religion was listed as Islam."

The public school: Paul Watson of the Los Angeles Times learned from Indonesians familiar with Obama when he lived in Jakarta that he "was registered by his family as a Muslim at both schools he attended." Haroon Siddiqui of the Toronto Star visited the Jakarta public school Obama attended and found that "Three of his teachers have said he was enrolled as a Muslim." Although Siddiqui cautions that "With the school records missing, eaten by bugs, one has to rely on people's shifting memories," he cites only one retired teacher, Tine Hahiyari, retracting her earlier certainty about Obama's being registered as a Muslim.

Koran class: In his autobiography, Dreams of My Father, Obama relates how he got into trouble for making faces during Koranic studies, thereby revealing he was a Muslim, for Indonesian students in his day attended religious classes according to their faith. Indeed, Obama still retains knowledge from that class: Nicholas D. Kristof of the New York Times, reports that Obama "recalled the opening lines of the Arabic call to prayer, reciting them [to Kristof] with a first-rate accent."

Mosque attendance: Obama's half-sister recalled that the family attended the mosque "for big communal events." Watson learned from childhood friends that "Obama sometimes went to Friday prayers at the local mosque." Barker found that "Obama occasionally followed his stepfather to the mosque for Friday prayers." One Indonesia friend, Zulfin Adi, states that Obama "was Muslim. He went to the mosque. I remember him wearing a sarong" (a garment associated with Muslims).

Piety: Obama himself says that while living in Indonesia, a Muslim country, he "didn't practice [Islam]," implicitly acknowledging a Muslim identity. Indonesians differ in their memories of him. One, Rony Amir, describes Obama as "previously quite religious in Islam."

Obama's having been born and raised a Muslim and having left the faith to become a Christian make him neither more nor less qualified to become president of the United States. But if he was born and raised a Muslim and is now hiding that fact, this points to a major deceit, a fundamental misrepresentation about himself that has profound implications about his character and his suitability as president.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Apr. 29, 2008 update: This article builds on two prior ones on the matter of Barack Obama and Islam. First, "Was Barack Obama a Muslim?" considered the implications of his Muslim childhood; second, "Confirmed: Barack Obama Practiced Islam" responded to a critique of the first article. This third one brings the evidence together in a single place.

Good point, Mark Richard. Where is everyone now claiming that Michael Dobbs was "in the tank" for McCain?

JG:

What else would you expect from the "New York Times"? They wouldn't publish anything from conservative Muslim scholars who would consider Barack HUSSEIN Obama to have been born and raised Muslim.

Jake: if there were any evidence that he's lying, then that would matter a little bit to me. But not much. Think of it this way: in 1940 in this country, was it a character flaw in people who were 1/16 African in ancestry to "lie" and call themselves white to avoid being barred from full participation in American society? I don't think so. They were guilty of a tiny, harmless distortion of the truth that was necessary for them because of a huge injustice committed by others.

Obama has been remarkably open about his life. There's no reason to think that he's even trying to shade the truth. But if he were doing so, it would be BECAUSE of paranoid nutcases like you, Jake, and not because of any actual guilt.

LOL!!! So, if he is lying about being a secret Muslim, that shouldn't concern any "non-racist" huh? That wouldn't have any bearing whatsoever on his decisions as Commander in Chief during a war on terrorists? Maybe if we take it outside the context of this political contest. Please see my hypothetical question above re: electing a [Republican] Japanese-American during WWII.

Wow, JakeD has completely lost it.

Just to make clear, as I already posted above, if he were an OPENLY practicing Muslim, that would not impact his fitness for office with me.

Another honest question (as I said I am no Islamic scholar): do Muslims believe in reincarnation? If so, that would make "Was Obama EVER a Muslim?" even more significant.

df

"Spock:

I am assuming, for the purposes of said hypothetical that "we" were of voting age in 1942. Other than that, you will have to specify what exactly is illogical.

Posted by: JakeD | June 13, 2008 1:30 PM"

-----------------------------------------

OK JakeD, you kindergartner, you are making a comparison that doesn't add up, you are comparing a Race and Nationalism (Japanese) to an alleged religious practice (Islam).

I don't know how or why you spend so much time in this forum making these idiotic arguments. You are just making your party and others of your ilk look worse and worse every day.

Don't you know it is people like you that are helping fuel this thirst for change? People have wised up over the past 7 years and are flat out tired and insulted by these Rovian tactics, you are a dying breed my friend, at least until the pendulum swings back again.

3 Pinocchios? You should be fired. I can't even believe you would give this ad free coverage.

Mr Dobbs your bias is clear. You are a joke of a reporter and should be replaced.

What is "df"?

P.S. to Spock: I did not know that, especially since I am registered Independent.

The wapo is a joke for not banning Jake D. America continues have irresponsible lazy media. Thanks for helping lie us into war.

McCain's policies help fan the flames of radical Islam while Obama is accused of possibly being muslim when he was six.
Beautiful.....

Bush/McCain have created more radical Islamic terrorists than we can kill.

Who do you think has the most dangerous radical islamic ties?

I read just far enough in this thread to see that JakeD is infesting your comments section. He (or someone similarly afflicted and having the same user name) is the reason I quit reading comments on Think Progress. I urge all readers of comments on any site to ignore JakeD's comments. Reacting or responding to them only helps him hijack the thread.

"P.S. to Spock: I did not know that, especially since I am registered Independent.

Posted by: JakeD | June 13, 2008 3:22 PM"

-------------------------------------------
I don't recall naming your political party, just your mind-set.

Learn to read and comprehend, moron.

Julian:

Now even DEBUNKING "lies" about Obama is being "in the tank" for McCain?!

OBama will be presdent of united of state of america like or not ;)

Spock:

"You are making your party ..."

"Spock:

"You are making your party ..."

Posted by: JakeD | June 13, 2008 3:49 PM"

Yes, JakeD, which ever one that may be.

LOL!!! Show me any polling data that the Independent Party has high negatives.

Great suggestion to ignore a fanatic poster that I won't name again. I would like to point out for anyone who has misread my earlier comment that I didn't use the word "racist" anywhere.

Also, I did look up some facts about Japanese Americans during WWII, just to refresh my memory. The facts definitely don't support guilt-by-association.

http://www.marauder.org/nisei02.htm

That's fine, Martimr1, as you are under no obligation to answer simple, honest questions.

Grand Old Pharts using Religion to divide us?
I'm truly in shock.

This is about LYING, not religion.

I hate all them godless nigra muslims like Obama. They is trying to ruin America and take it away from the God fearing Christian White People.

How old was he when he went too that school. He was six years old. At that age you don't see your paper work and you have no idea what your parents are. I think it is time too stop trying to label this man as a muslim. I can guarantee that most people don't even know what it means to be a muslim. Are you aware that there are muslimms and moslims. Do you know the difference. I think we have been brain washed into thinking something about a religion that isn't so. Let's grow up America and not fall for the same old mess again.

Why should you ask this Q again and again, People should decide them self. When you born what were your religion? You got the religion from your father not mother period. Google it for Obama's parental history everything is there. As far as I remember his great grandfather converted to Islam. Moreover its Obama's wording that Rev, Wright introduces him to Christianity. Therefore nobody should doubt about his faith/religion now

Rev. Wright used to be a Muslim too.

I have gotten to the point where I check the name of the person making the comment. If it is Jake D, I don't read it.

Hm... I'm NOT JakeD, but I can post as him? I think there is a small problem with this forum...

What kind of bad muslim sends their son to catholic school. As a catholic myself I would never send my son to Catholic school they do brainwash kids with the bible.

So if anything Obama's muslim step father was trying to brainwash his son catholic I guess in hopes he would some day join a radical christian church and then create some black Legion of Doom when he becomes president.

If that is the case then Obama's step father was a diabolical genius.

Patrick:

Good point.

"...Barring fresh revelations, the Obama campaign's explanation for the "Muslim" annotation beside Barack's name in the Catholic school ledger seems reasonable. Three Pinocchios for Floyd Brown."

Not so fast Michael Dodds! How many children have you personally enrolled in a school system? I'm guessing none! School registration requires a birth certificate...not a statement of birth like the one Barry put up on his website...but an actual birth certificate that denotes religion. That would be the likely source behind the "Muslim" annotation by his name and NOT because his step father happened to be Muslim (let's not forget that his biological father was still alive at the time). Why not ask the obama campaign to put a proper end to this religion business once and for all by posting his actual birth certificate.

If a person attends a Catholic church as a child, does that make him a Catholic even though now he is a Baptist minister. Because a pit bull dog sucked on a female beagle, does that make the pit bull dog a beagle. Who ever this Floyd Brown is, needs to check his credentials and his education to make sure that he is not an Illegal Immigrant from the southern hills of Mexico. But then again, I suppose that the Republican Party is getting desperate because their candidate can only attract about three hundred folks at a time to listen to his speeches. What a pile of manure, the Republican Party has to drag around to throw at Sen. Obama. But I am waiting to see what this so called ad-man knows about the issues that are more important. I have a clear picture of Sen. Obama's past. It's Sen. McCain that I know nothing about, other than that he spent his years in North Vietnam in a cage. And that his father and grandfather were both in the military.
I don't care about the past. I care about the issues that are taking place now and that need to be met with now, so that the people of the United States can proceed to live as they have lived in the past without having to worry if they will have enough money to take care of the gasoline for the cars. If they are going to have enough left over for food, after they pay their utility bills.
Knowing full well that we are going thorugh this gas crunch at this time. President Bush decides to go joyriding to Europe and then come back to use, the gas guzzling limousines when they should be driving economy cars that don't use so much gasoline.
Give us a break!!!Park those limousines and travel by smaller light air force jets.

so if you go to catholic church for years and sign in, you can later say you were never catholic?

cripes

If you truly believe this is a "Smear" campaign, then YOU are saying that it is a bad thing to be Muslim! Otherwise, so what? Why the big deal? Who cares what religion he was reared in? In fact, what does his current religion matter? You might say growing up in a Muslim household could give someone a better perspective on why they hate us so much and help to bridge the gap in communication between us all. Why would he lie to cover it up? That is the odd thing.

Who IS this Obama? Where did he come from? What does he REALLY stand for?

Not all "Change" is for the better!

richardcolonel:

You are complaining because the President of the United States didn't fly to Europe on a smaller jet? That's really going to solve global warming?

Citizen:

Good points.

From the Koran:

3:151
We will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve, because they set up with Allah that for which He has sent down no authority, and their abode is the fire, and evil is the abode of the unjust.

8:60
And prepare against them what force you can and horses tied at the frontier, to terrorize thereby the enemy of Allah...

8:12
I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them.

Moreover Allah says of those who reject him. Because, Allah has already sentenced them to death.
------------------------------------------

Hmm... Why wouldn't he want to be associated with this "Peaceful Religion"?

FWIW: the Old Testament is pretty harsh too ; )

I encourage all Democrats to follow the example of your great leader Obama. When you get into that voting booth in November, just vote "Present"!

I have no problem if Obama was once a muslim,jew or agnostic.But it bothers me if he lied for political expediancy.

JakeD- The article says Pipes lied and Obama is telling the truth, but you keep saying it is Obama who is lying. You ability to twist the truth to suit your point of view is breathtaking.

First of all, The Fact Checker does NOT say Pipes lied. The farthest is an unsubstantiated claim that the evidence is not fairly weighed. The Fact Checker doesn't even answer the question: Was Barack HUSSEIN Obama Ever a Muslim?"

This crap, in the tradition of Karl Rove, Lee Atwater, and Roy Cohn, is aimed squarely at the dolts among us.

It doesn't take a "dolt" to realize the enormous pitfall facing America if Barack Hussein Obama is lying about this.

"I encourage all Democrats to follow the example of your great leader Obama. When you get into that voting booth in November, just vote "Present"!

Posted by: Citizen | June 13, 2008 6:06 PM"
-------------------------------------

BTW John McCain is ranked as missing more votes than anybody in the senate.

Chust a litl' tidbit for ya'

Perhaps he never has considered himself Muslim. I went to Catholic day-school u never considered myself a Catholic.

"It doesn't take a "dolt" to realize the enormous pitfall facing America if Barack Hussein Obama is lying about this.

Posted by: JakeD | June 13, 2008 7:14 PM"
------------------------------------------------
Since you seem to be so persistent on this topic why don't you lay out for us simpletons exactly what horrible consequences would befall us?

People have a right to know more about Obama. When you think about it, the only things we know about Obama are what Obama has told us in his books. He is fighting hard to fend off all questions about him and, unfortunately, so far it is working. He has told us everything he wants us to know and gets indignant when people want to know more. People have a right to know more, but he has put himself on the offensive to get people to back off.

Well, worse case scenario, a deep cover secret Muslim agent accessing the Presidency is probably nuclear detonations over American cities killing a couple hundred million. You think that's an acceptable risk?

I never said that Obama "Missed Votes". It is a verified FACT that even though he was at a voting session, rather than showing his stance on an issue, he opted to vote neither for or against it. He just voted "Present" most of the time.

So... we know that he tries to cover up details about his upbringing and during his very brief stint in public office, he refuses to stand for or against anything.

Seriously! Who IS this Obama guy really?

And how do you think he would accomplish this JakeD?

Anonymous wants to know how the President launches nukes?

JakeD, I think you have been watching 24 for too long now. Do you really believe any POTUS has the authority and the capability to redirect our nuclear missiles and then order our military to explode them over the U.S. populace?

Do you really think that any General or other military official would go along with this?

Your paranoid fantasies are wayyyyy off the map. Get a grip dude.

My fear is that McCain might "FORGET" who the enemy is and launch some missiles by mistake on us.

Hey JakeD, don't look now but there is a terrorist hiding under your bed.

Hawaiian PUNCH! WOMEN voters now supporting McCain will desert him in DROVES, once they learn all the disgusting details of how he treated his FIRST WIFE & his CHILDREN, which is even worse, by chasing after every RICH, well-heeled WOMAN he could find after returning from Vietnam!

His FIRST WIFE, CAROL, having had a serious car accident, had life-changing INJURIES WORSE than John McCain received in Vietnam as a POW-- and, HE LEFT HER!. For a Rich BEER Co. Heiress he met in a HAWAIIAN BAR, out "tomcatting", CHEATING on his wife, who waited for him on the HOMEFRONT, for him to come home from VIETNAM. WHAT A SLEAZY THING!

Seems to me, when you get MARRIED in a CHRISTIAN Church, whether Baptist OR Episcopalian, there are words in the VOW you make, about "for richer or poorer, in SICKENESS & in health, 'til death do us part."! Well, John McCain wanted a YOUNGER (25 yrs. younger) SEXY, NEW "TROPHY WIFE", & most of all, she & her FAMILY had to be super RICH & have CONNECTIONS politically, & CINDY & her DADDY fit the bill!

I wonder what kind of children's book about her "Daddy" John McCain, any of the children from his FIRST marriage would write? I'm guessing it wouldn't be as GLOWING as the 23 yr. old daughter MEGHAN's new book, to be released in September, obviously for his POLITICAL campaign!

And "Feminists" who say they'll vote for McCain, because HILLARY didn't win? WOWWY, they won't like what they learn about how John McCain REALLY treats WOMEN, when it COUNTS-- when she is his own WIFE!

So there, those of you smearing Obama. These are actual FACTS, which McCain has admitted to, while OBAMA has a traditional, "family values" lovely Marriage & two lovely children!

AtomicWarBaby: What do your facts have to do with the topic of this thread?

"Only Muslim children are given the name Hussein. " Jake the deluded.

Jake,

Hussein is an arabic name and not all arabs are muslims. If you take the time to travel to Egypt or other places on the African continent, you will find many non muslims named Hussein. I have a very good friend in Cairo who is a Coptic Christian and his name is Hussein

The fact is that if you are a muslim, then you pray 5 times a day to allah, you do not work on Friday, and you take pride in your faith.

Barack Hussein Obama takes pride in his Christian faith. How someone was registered by his stepfather 40 years ago does not mean anything. If Barack was a muslim he would have continued observing the faith when he went to Hawaii- or maybe he was a counter intelligence spook by the time he was 11 years old-

Let's fact check whether
John McCain is the Vietnamese version of the Manchurian Candidate. That would make more sense to me. After all he was a brainwashed and broken man after his six year stay at the Hanoi Hilton.

Now McSame will apparently say anything to become President. What happened to the "Maverick?"

Not this time.

Yay! Now I'm an anonymous fearmongering troll, too! Keep feeding me--I've got ludicrous answers to every one of your sensible questions!

Come on! Keep arguing with me! It's SO productive! It accomplishes SO much!

It's not as though I post here JUST to rile you up. Purely out of the goodness of my heart and the freeness of my calendar, I am here to enlighten your feeble minds with my valuable insight.

Please?

It's so dark and lonely here in Mom's basement.

Has Anonymous ever seen the movie "Wargames" where a much worse disaster was narrowly averted by an innocent teenager just trying to play a computer game?

Hmmmm, Jonas, good point. You know it is likely that McCain is a Vietnamese manchurian candidate, I mean while he was in captivity he was brainwashed enough to speak out against his fellow countrymen and soldiers. Furthermore why did he REALLY not want to leave?, perhaps he wanted his "buddies" (code for secret Vietnamese revenge freaks) to come back with him to help plot his 35 year ascent to power, I mean, he DID vote against the veteran's benefits package, doesn't that indicate that he wants to weaken the military so his vietnamese captors could eventually take over and drop napalm on the American populice?

Wow. I haven't gotten this much attention since I was the barber on "The Andy Griffith Show."

"Well, worse case scenario, a deep cover secret Muslim agent accessing the Presidency is probably nuclear detonations over American cities killing a couple hundred million. You think that's an acceptable risk?"

JakeD, how do we know for sure that you're not a secret Muslim agent posting from Indonesia with orders to pit American against American as a prelude to war?

We don't, of course. But there's plenty of evidence that could implicate you. It's a fact that you frequent comment boards and post inflammatory comments. It's a fact that you made references to Jesus Christ, who is considered by Muslims to be a prophet. It's a fact that you don't read Yiddish -- as no good Muslim would. And it's a fact that you capitalize Hussein in every reference to Barack Obama -- clearly a sign of reverence for a Muslim name.

And it's a fact that Obama was registered as a Muslim, which is, of course, sufficient evidence to suspect him of being a "secret Muslim." But I'll bet you'll come up with a bunch of reasons why all of the evidence I cite showing that you could be a secret Muslim agent intent on destroying the country is ludicrous.

"Has Anonymous ever seen the movie "Wargames" where a much worse disaster was narrowly averted by an innocent teenager just trying to play a computer game?

Posted by: JakeD | June 13, 2008 8:01 PM"
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Yes I have and I think Mathew Broderick is a secret muslim operative too.

McCain claims to be a Baptist, but he's never actually been baptized in his church.
http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/04/24/mccain-on-baptism-plans-its-a-private-thing/

WORST Scenario: is a "deep-cover" far right fundamentalist SETTLER extremist in ISRAEL secretly getting control of Israel's NUCLEAR, CHEMICAL, & BIOLOGICAL WEAPONS Program, & kiddies, they are armed to the TEETH, swimming in the best HIGH TECH, the NEWEST Weapons Arsenal, thanks in large part to Amerika's sending them BILLIONS & BILLIONS in "AID" over several DECADES! You thought 9/11 was scary, imagine the APOCOLYPTIC NIGHTMARE that ISRAELI extremists in covert working with all the crazy wingnut right-wing CHRISTIAN fundamentalist EVANGELICALS which the BUSH Regime has liberally seeded our MILITARY's & Pentagon's HIGHEST RANKS, could UNLEASH on the Middle East, in a "PRE-Emptive" Strike, which WOULD escalate beyond their control, our control, or ANYONE's control!

The NEXT World War, would then be fought with stones, over the radioactive scraps "LEFT BEHIND" thanks to Bush's "Rev. Hagee" right-wing core base!

BARACK OBAMA for President, thank you!

Actually, it was Matthew Broderick's character who nearly caused a nuclear war in the first place, by hacking into the military computer and activating what he thought was a game.

"Has Anonymous ever seen the movie "Wargames" where a much worse disaster was narrowly averted by an innocent teenager just trying to play a computer game?

Posted by: JakeD | June 13, 2008 8:01 PM"
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Ahh the mixing of fact with fiction the favorite ritual of the republicans.

You really ought to switch parties JakeD, they need your intellectual powers and you fit the mold so well.

Sorry for the off-topic unless JakeD wants to accredit this to Obama.

http://news.yahoo.c