Notice how there is no money for road construction?

Isn't that what we really want?

Hello, anyone home?

If everyone here disagrees with the $150 million bond so strongly, vote against it. Take your chances at the polls. I don't think you will win as improving some of the police stations listed seems necessary and putting turf on fields to extend their use seems reasonable. But, by all means, you will have your opportunity in November. Take it.

I could support the bond if it were not for the synthetic turf proposal. We can't pay higher taxes for that when we have so many higher priorities. Our Board never prioritizes; they just pander to the loudest.

Did the sports sups think that they could throw this in with worthy projects and have it ride on their coat tails?

Considering the tragic deaths of the 2 police officers as well as the deaths at Christmas, the pontificating BOS should see mental health services as a priority and do something. Removing funding for some non-mandated school and using facilities would actually free up funds to help prevent such terrible deaths. FX has funds it is what it chooses to spend money on. Health and human srvices organizations are always begging at budget time.

My recollection is that they just voted themselves a healthy pay raise this year. Seems like a good time to introduce a proposal to roll back those raises and save some money on the bond issue. We shouldn't have to go into debt to pay the board of supervisors salary.

to resource allocation -
what about the tragic deaths of the unarmed citizens killed by armed fairfax county police officers?
perhaps the training and mental health services are needed for the police first!
the ratio isn't very good. more unarmed citizens have been killed by police in fairfax county than police have been killed in the line of duty.
would be an interesting article if the post had the guts to run it.

Let's get a few things straight...

Bonds are used to pay capital expenses, not for services.

Bonds could be used to to build a mental health center, or expand Woodburn, but not for mental health services.

If any of you have led a perfect life and never made a mistake (as a police officer did when the optomotrist was shot), then keep up this useless police bashing. Most of us deeply regret the tragedy, but we rely on our police force...they do good things and risk their lives for us every day...and we are tired of the harping. Our police officers are good people who never know when a Michael Kennedy will come out of the woodwork and kill them. We lost a long-time beloved McLean officer with Gabby's death. Please stop indicting all officers over one very tragic mistake.

I understand that bonds pay capital expenses. However, total costs to make a new facility or addition operational are not out of bond money - ie items with a useful life of less than 20 years. The school's debt service for bond projects is a separate transfer so when FCPS uses bond money there are additional impacts especially if including the cost of not using or duplicating capacity.

In case you are interested, the artifical turf will cost $10 million.

It's a safe bet that this $10 million could be used on more pressing capital improvements.

$10 million for artificial turf now is patently absurd - but just wait eight to ten years when a whole bunch of these fields have to be replaced at once. Think petroleum by-products and try to estimate what the replacement cost might be. And I don't see any evidence that the Board of Supervisors or the Park Authority is planning ahead, or even budgeting for repair costs. The warranties on these fields are full of the proverbial "fine print" so there had better be money put aside somewhere.
I guess the sups figure these fields are a great way to buy votes from the sports communities and that they'll have moved on when the fields are shot and it all hits the fan.

In case you might be somewhat interesed, following is an idea of where Connolly & the Board of Supervisors are leading us.

Our operating (not capital) budget is $3.2 billion this year. Using straight exprapolation, here is where we will be in 6 years from now:

1. An operating budget of $6.4 billion.

2. An annual cost of over $21,000 for each child in the Fairfax County school system.

3. An annual property tax of over $8,500 for a moderate (i.e., nothing fancy at all) home in Fairfax County.

I don't know about you, but I can't afford that.

And, they are asking to spend $10 million on artifical turf? Give me a break!

Jim Foster:

I'm curious how many, if any, children you had that received Fairfax County public educations? If you had the average 2 children x 13 years of education, you probably recieved more benefits than you ever paid in taxes.

You miss the point, entirely. My point is that spending and taxing is getting to the point that few of us can afford it.

In my opinion, the time has come for letting the politicians know that they are approaching the tipping point. For me, they have passed it.

Let me say it another way. What good is a school system if most parents can't afford it? It costs over $12,000 a year, now, to send a child to Fairfax County schools.

That's approaching, not qite, but getting there, what it costs to send a child to George Mason University or the University of Virginia.

The $12,000 is for operating costs. It does not include fixed costs, such as for buildings. The fixed costs come from long-term bonds. As a wake-up call, check on the bonds we vote on in November.

I have. Have you?

I'm actually not all that opposed to the bonds as they relate to police, fire and the animal shelter, although I think the "price tag" sounds a little high. I cannot help it - I remain unconvinced that synthetic turf is as great as it is cracked up to be. It doesn't really feel like grass to me and although it "tries" to behave like grass it is definitely not grass and I'm still not convinced that it will not contribute to knee and lower leg injuries, particularly in children. At least the high end stuff does drain better than it used to, which is good.

To Anne.

I agree with you. But $10 million for artificial turf is over the side in my opinion. It's just too much, way too much and I am not talking about the dollars.

For those of you who live next to a ball field that might have limited use (grass field) and no lights....what do you think will be the outcome if artificial turf is added? Longer hours and lights. Think about it!

The bottom line is this - Mr. Connolly wants to spend $10 million. He will spend it.

I say that he does not care what anyone wants.

When we vote on the bonds, can we vote yes or no on the $10 million for synthetic turf for ball fields?

As I understand, the answe is no. That's why I say that the $10 million will be spent. I don't think voters will turn down everything else just for the turf issue.

One of these days, someone in Fairfax County should think about where the money will come from to pay off these bonds, not to mention the interest on them.

Said another way, borrowing is not free.

Jim is absolutely correct about interest on these bonds. We should ask the county officials to identify how much interest is being paid on outstanding bonds. It could be a real eye opener!

I will order (from Fairfax County) a copy of their latest "Combined Annual Financial Report" (CAFR), which shows bond debt and interest payments.

You might want to check into it also. Call (703)324-3152 and ask that a copy of the CAFR be mailed to you.

Fair warning - governmental accounting reporting is not like one finds in the commercial sectior. That is, in governmental accounting, one does not find total bond debt on the "Balance Sheet". One must look elsewhere. It's there, but not on the "Balance Sheet".

In fact, in governmental accounting, it's not called a "Balance Sheet". It has another name.

Anne,
You are right about artifcial turf not being as great as alleged. Just Google "artificial turf and mrsa" or "artificial turf and high temperatures" and you'll find plenty of cause for concern. And that is just for starters. Many of us us agree we need to improve the number and quality of sports fields in Fx Co. However, once again our county leaders are rushing to embrace the "latest thing" without fore thought, planning, or fiscal responsiblity. The cost of these fields is unacceptable.

I agreed with you, Tired Voter.

I hear horror stories from some of my friends who are involved in kids' sports leagues about juggling schedules to get the games in and about disagreements with neighbors about fields and field lighting and the like. A couple folks have told me they feel deceived by campaign promises related to their kids' activities that they feel were not fulfilled. These folks tell me they do a lot of the maintenance work themselves and that the County doesn't contribute much help. I don't know if everyone involved agrees with that or not - will have to leave that to the league folks to say their opinions.

I still can't help but observe that there are some underutilized athletic facilities right under our noses. In Arlington, where I lived for many years, neighborhood adults and kids freely used athletic fields, tracks and pools at high schools when the students were not. There was a modest entry fee for pools. In Fairfax, this openness is not the case. The high schools are pretty vacant. WHY? One thing I have noticed is that they are festooned with the "keep out" variety of signage we did not encounter in Arlington. We all pay taxes for those sports facilities and, accepting that student use takes precedence and that maintenance is necessary periodically, they should be available for public use. I still swim at W-L HS in Arlington - good news, they let Fairfax residents swim there and they are nowhere near as crowded as the Fairfax County rec center pools.

I compete quite a bit in track and field events, and many of the sports we engage in as kids really do become lifetime and year round pursuits. When kids have facilities (and we had many where I grew up in NY - more than you would imagine for such high density, as we had our priorities straight), they make sports part of their lives and that is good. However, the club I belong to here, which is based here, and which has very popular youth, open, invitational and masters competitions, has to go to PG for winter meets to include all events and to Arlington for track in winter. There is NO facility in Fairfax. I laugh every time that anyone on the BOS says they want us to live, work, and play in Fairfax. I live in Fairfax, I work in DC (okay, sometimes in my in-home office), and I tend to play in PG and Arlington. I guess if your idea of "playing" is sitting in traffic and eating at boring chain restaurants, then Fairfax is your play place. (Okay, that was too harsh. I run on our trails and the fine trail connections are a big draw for me. That and a bigger yard than I could get in Arlington without buying and demolishing the house next door.)

Back on topic: I will remain suspicious of artificial turf and its effect upon young joints. I believe that sports are a major part of the wellness and you need to accomodate them. But look to see what resources you have that you may not be fully utilizing as part of determining accommodation. If HS fields are not being fully utilized, then open 'em up more. More information and insight is needed w/r/t to this particular line item for turf. It sounds excessive. Some details from the County justifying the figure would be helpful.

Besides homework and reading, what are kids supposed to do between the end of school and bed time? Athletics is one very positive alternative (of several) to alcohol, drugs, tobacco, overeating, gangs, television, the mall, boredom, etc.

$10 million, which comes to about 12 synthetic turf fields, is not nearly enough -- a drop in the bucket but an important drop. Parents will likely dig into their pockets and provide a lot of private matching money so that the County can provide more fields.

The number of kids in the County has increased very substantially. The County is building more schools and educating kids in trailers at a number of existing schools. The number of fields has not kept up.

Bring on the synthetic turf and play ball!

PS to Anne: Great idea to more fully utilize HS fields mamy of which are being converted to synthetic turf.

To:samchapp

I assume that you know it already cost over $12,000 per year per child in Fairfax County schools.

Also, if history is any guide, that will climb to over $24,000 in a few short years - 5 or 6.

Can you afford that? I can't. Yet, we seem to have our heads in the sand pretending it won't happen.

Well, stay tuned and learn the hard way.

Hopefully real estate taxes won't go up this year I am sick of fairfax county raping everyone in housing taxes and still trying to pass bounds for millions (example this november bond for 100 million after passing one the past year). Where is all the real estate tax money from the recent housing run up going? Operating costs for fairfax county has not gone up the same as real estate tax revenue.