Worst

jlc
you still suck

more of the same from this gas bag
blah blah blah
you sound like a petulant child
allways looking to put a negative spin on EVERYTHING the skins do

you should just write about the ravens, redsux and all the crappy music you listen to

"Anyone who tries to tell you they can judge a draft immediately is full on bunk. It'll be a couple of years - or at least one - before we can really start to see who hits home runs and who struck out." JLC listen to your own words regarding the draft, the coach and the team. Otherwise, you're full of "bunk."

Okay, J Low. I'll take the opposite tack. You can't convince me that in the next few years, none of the receivers in this draft was worth a first round pick.

jlc, you are unblievable

If you guys don't like Jason, stay the hell off the blog. He busts his ass getting information (not always 100% correct - but it never is in his line of work) and is very diligent about posting updates. Skins fans are very lucky to have him. Boo on all you naysayers - go elsewhere.

Kiper rated the skins draft a B+

Kiper graded the 'Skins draft a B+, which was the 2nd highest grade of all teams (behind Chiefs, tied with Browns and Cowgirls).

no dicks please,

wipe the jlc brown stuff off your face

Skins might have a top 5 offense this year thus making the defense better

I don't dislike JLC. I just disagree with his assessment. Why draft a defensive lineman/offensive lineman if they aren't any better than what you already have? There is little doubt that they got two receivers and a punter who are better than what they already have. Which two linemen could they have gotten who are demonstrably better than or could replace two of their linemen in the next couple years?

Maybe the Skins don't go with 4 wides, 2 tight end sets, but when is the last time Moss and ARE were both healthy for the entire season in the same year? Those guys are always banged up, so I don't blame the Skins at all for taking receivers/tight end with their second round picks. Even if they don't play much this year, we should be set at those two positions for the next few years. Next year, we can address more attention to the DL and OL.

Just some round up of reviews by other sources.

Kiper - Skins B+
USA Today - Skins B
SI - after the Kelley pick "The Redskins continue their terrific draft by picking up another prospect that carried a first round grade for most of the season."

I've been backing JLC a lot, but the doom and gloom is getting old.

Jlc you are indeed allowed to lookt at the glass half empty. I will look at it half full. All during the draft, the analyst rave about how the best teams stick with THEIR board, and therefore at times draft for the future. It has become popular to mention that it takes a WR about 3 years to become the player they are projected to be. If that is the case, 3 years from now both Moss and ARE will be over 30. Cooley will be near 30 and commanding a larger part of the cap. Picking these pass catchers allow the skins to have 3 young players to grow and develop with Campbell. 3 years from now when this draft can be fully appreciated, I hope the faith the skins have placed on their scouting proves correct and Thomas, Davis, Kelly will be the pass catching core of Zorns W2W offense.

Folks, there is no rational way one can be thrilled with what the Skins did. If they had drafted three d-lineman or o-lineman, that same excess would be different because of the number of positions at those spots.

Look at the best case scenario: Cooley stays at a pro Bowl level for the next 3+ years. Moss and Randle El remain effective starters. That would mean that the three rookie receivers could do no more than be role players.

One receiver, ok. Two, hmmm. but three??? JLC is right, the owner is obsessed with WR's (he also coveted Donte Stallworth in the draft) and finally got what he wanted.

Kiper gave the Redskins a B+.

Mel Kiper, who has dedicated his life to knowing the draft, and ALL things draft related, and is considered the FORE-MOST expert on things of a draft nature.

Had the Redskins taken Thomas at 21, people would have said they reached. Had they taken Merling at 21, people would have said how can they take a guy who didn't work out??

They were in a lose-lose situation with some people, which is why its nice to have the opinion of Kiper, as an outside source.

Jasno, I love you like a fat kid loves cake but, dude, take it easy. Most of the draft gurus are giving the skins a positive grade and I tend to agree. I'd like to have seen some more OL but keep in mind that while our starters are aging, we have Heyer, Alexander and now Rinehart as backups. that's 3 youngsters already in the mix.

With Santana's constant hamstring issues and Randle El's so-so productivity, WR depth is a need (At least until Mix ascends to Jerry Rice-like greatness). With Dallas and NY's loaded secondaries, we need to put as many stud receivers on the field as possible.

As you said, time will tell but right now the sky is not falling.

It's amazing to see the article start off with a dislcaimer about how you can't predict drafts, and then JC proceeds to rip apart what amounts to a very solid draft by the Skins. So many statements in this post that are hypocritical or just plain wrong (in my opinion of course!).

1) Joe Gibbs held a pre-draft minicamp even though we had a HOF game in 2004...this statement was made as if it was a golden move. We finished 5-11 that year, right? Clearly it didn't help.

2) Getting WRs is horrible this early in the draft, simply because "no one else did it?" How many times have you blasted the Skins for getting WR free agents and wasting money? Now they go out and draft 2 of the top 3 WRs and somehow, it's a bad move? Moss is always injured, Randel El is sporadic at best (and sucks at punt returns)...WR was our most pressing need!! Our offense, which requires multiple weapons, now has WR weapons other than the oft-double teamed (and injured) Moss, and Randel El.

3) Why the obsession with defensive line? WR is much more in need. Carter is a beast and under 30. We have youth starting and contributing. Yeah, it'd be nice to have another beast DE, but there wasn't one available...certainly not at pick 51.

4) Obviously, offensive line depth is great, but we had a solid line last year that was scotch-taped together. Yeah, they're not all 25, but it's not as pressing a need to use a 2nd round pick on someone who will sit the bench for 2-3 years. BTW, the Northern Iowa lineman we got was ranked as the best lineman to come out of D-II in 15 years, based on some blocking % ranking system. So, we got a beast with a low pick.

5) The Colts have won 1 SB with the best skilled/student QB of all time in his 8 year career. Somehow that makes their front office God? Draft what you need, not what the Colts' front office thinks is good. BTW, the Colts have had several years of 2 pass-catching TEs, along with the Patriots. So, maybe Fred Davis isn't that bad a pick.

6) Why the b!tching about the playbook?Everyone raved about Saunders' 700 page playbook, which proved entirely ineffective. Who cares if the playbook is scaled down? It has nothing to do with Zorn's lack of credibility as a coach...it has to do with the fact that we're in a new offense and Zorn needs to see the basics of what this team can do. You don't throw the Bible at a new priest-to-be and say, "Memorize this by July and you're in." Start with the basics!

7) No, my name is not Dan Snyder, Vinny Cerato or anyone employed/associated with the Skins! Just a diehard fan (who admittidly may have too much Kool-Aid in his blood) who is happy with our draft and is looking forward to an offense that uses our skill players by giving them the ball and doesn't try to outsmart opponents by picking imaginary spots on the field where no defender will be.

At least we don't have the play the NFC East on the road in the first month of the season. Oh, wait...

Both Bozwell and Jason appear to make a stong case that some linemen (both offensive and defensive)picked higher than they were eventually would have been useful. Also, the Redskins dodged a Danny bullet by failing to obtain Johnson.

REPOST

I'm looking forward to the Skins/Iggles game this year. You'll line up 8 WRs, we'll line up 6 undersized DEs, and we'll see how things go. Maybe the teams are planning some sort of player swap; we could use a WR or two and maybe one of our tweeners could end up as a stopgap OL for you.

As an outsider, I'm ambivalent about the Skins 2008 draft.

Good

I would have picked Limas Sweed over Malcolm Kelley, but if both picks turn out to be successful, not only would these 2 WRs fill an immediate need, they could also be the transition from Santana Moss/ARE to the next generation of Skins WR. OL pickup was also good because it definitely fills a need and if one (or more) of the 3 DBs sticks with the team, that's a good thing as well

Indifferent

The punter pickup may prove to be a really good choice, but I would have gone for another OL or tried to deal this pick and the Brennan pick for a higher selection in hopes Joe Bugel could coach up a prospect.

Odd/Bad

I don't understand the Fred Davis pick. Skins just paid Chris Cooley a ton of $s, Todd Yoder (and Glen Koslowski) seem to be capable backups, and Mike Sellers (remember him?) could even fill in a bit here. Even if Fred Davis turns out to be a great player, short of a trade, I don't see how this significantly helps the Skins

Guess we'll see how things play out in 2008/2009

Adam

Posted by: EaglesFanAdam | April 28, 2008 8:40 AM

The West Coast Offense requires 2 TE sets, and the 'Skins made an upgrade from Yoder.

We can assume that only 1 of the 2 WRs will pan out to be a starter. The other is trade bait.

They got a stud punter, a versatile O-lineman, a nickel back, two hard-hitting safeties who will play special teams, and a competent 3rd-string QB.

Compare that to previous drafts. Instead of comparing this draft to previous drafts, JLC complains how the draft could have been better.

i was very surprised at the receiver picks in the second round, but considering the health we've had at the receiver position for the past couple years, i'm fine with them picking up 2 guys. you might as well get good depth at one position if you can. lord knows, we haven't had much for any other ones.. ;p

Get'm jlc. Getting rid of the #1 for extra #2's... I agree to give My Cousin Vinny his due for that one. But to make your first three picks pass catchers? c'mon now...I couldn't agree more with jlc.

Not enough footballs for:
Moss
Randle El
Cooley
Portis
Betts
White
Davis and Kelly

Here's what I wanna know,,, if Duane Brown was available, would they have taken him over Davis... or even White?

Redskins | K. Mitchell signs with team
Sun, 27 Apr 2008 22:59:35 -0700

Josh Buchanan, of NFLDraftBible.com, reports the Washington Redskins have signed undrafted rookie free-agent S Kevin T. Mitchell (University of Illinois). Terms of the deal were not disclosed.

This guy is only saying that we didn't address major needs we have to fill, and he's right. regardless of how kiper rates our draft, we still didn't address what we needed to. Who cares if mel kiper rates your draft a B+ if we still have no d-lineman to contend in our ever improving division? Right now we have 6 WR's making big money and 2 tight tends, unless cooley moves to more of a FB roll. the move to trade down was brilliant, the picks we made considering our roster were not. the 6'7 DE from miami was available and we completely whiffed.

More god awful stuff from Jasno.

The Post's Skins coverage is a joke.

For the record, I'm happy with the picks that were made for the OL. The cat from Northern Iowa, and this Kerry Brown, from Appalachian State.

I think Rinehart can slide in at G, right now.

For the last few years all you've heard is not enough weapons, to easy to shut down, etc. etc. Now they FINALLY get more weapons and still there is blind bashing. Utterly pathetic that a reporter and a paper can't act like grown ups. F--king joke!!

The bottom line is this: in the draft, do you go for value or need?

Why do you reach down and select a DE projected in the 3rd round when you can get a first-round quality TE?

The draft is not the only way to fill needs.

Even if Fred Davis turns out to be a great player, short of a trade, I don't see how this significantly helps the Skins

Adam

Posted by: EaglesFanAdam | April 28, 2008 8:40 AM

Doesn't it allow Jim Zorn to draw up plays that he never could have without two legitimate tight ends? Doesn't it create some Red Zone nightmares for a defensive coach?

This guy is always whining about something. I'm sorry and what team did Jason work for? Go cover the ravens

I think no matter what gets posted here, there will be a lot of complaining.

Pathetic.

We are FANS, and like it or not, we don't know as much as we think we know.

Personally, I'm pretty darn happy with this draft.

All you whiners need to get a life.

Receivers are reknowed for not reaching their full potential until their third year of pro ball. What's Santana's and ARE's age and contract looking like in three years? If you ask me, it looks like their phasing out the dwarfs for more west coast offense-friendly players. Could the front office be taking a page out of Stan Kasten's "plan"?

New coach, new system. When has that ever worked for us in the first year? I'm sensing a couple of rebuilding years for a team fresh out of the playoffs.

Adam, lets say for example a team like the Patriots drafted a TE with first round pick in 2 out of 3 years, even using a first and a third to move up to select the particular TE that they were targeting, would that get questioned?

If Cooley goes down, then all the Redskins would have had would be Yoder, and Koz. Which would essentially eliminate using the tight end in this offense.

Yahoo sports:

Washington Redskins
Picks: WR Devin Thomas, TE Fred Davis, WR Malcolm Kelly, OL Chad Rinehart, DB Justin Tryon, P Durant Brooks, DB Kareem Moore, QB Colt Brennan, DL Rob Jackson, DB Chris Horton
Positives: Thomas, Davis, Kelly, Brooks
Negative: Defensive end not addressed until the seventh round.
Bottom line:A. Ten overall picks with lots of potential from top to bottom. The two wideouts slipped a little and could all end up providing great value. Thomas and Kelly could develop into quality big targets, and an AFC scout told Yahoo! Sports in February that Davis was the best overall talent at tight end in this draft. The punter need was addressed with the best one the college game had to offer in Brooks. Brennan is an intriguing pick late in the sixth round. A lot of potential starters in this draft.

I agree with the concerns along the lines but the skins offense has not looked explosive in a long long time and I love moss but he hasnt had a good season since 05; so despite the hate i like what they did in the draft. They needed depth at WR there and they got it. Hate or like time will tell...

The only way to draft successfully is to draft good players.

I think Baltimore raised more eyebrows than the Skins for taking a 1-AA QB who operated in a modified-spread offense with the expectation that he'll be the starter as soon as this year.

This year's draft was very weak on immediate starters. The Skins were not going to find a 2008 starter at #21 or anywhere else. So they smartly drafted the best players on their board throughout the draft.

And taking two WRs in the second round was genius -- the trade out of 21 (where they may have taken a WR anyhow) allowed them to get a two-fer at a position notorious for being difficult to scout. Any draft move that increases the team's chances of finding a quality player is a win in my book.

They also added a big, fast TE that can take pressure off Cooley in the red-zone (how soon we forget that our only effective red-zone play last year was Cooley on an 8-yard option hitch); depth to the OL with a corn-fed ultra-versatile man-imal; added speed to the secondary with a DB who will compete for the nickle-back and be Smooty's man-crush; added much needed competition to the punter position ("Frosty - shanking punts since 2006"); and added competition for the special teams spots (buh-buy James Thrash). All in all, a very good job.

So they weren't able to address the DL. Nobody expected them to address every single position of need. But they still have options there -- undrafted FA, roster cuts, trade.

JLC -- stop masking the hating as "giving you the facts."

This blog is a great example of why JLC's coverage of the Skins is such a laughingstock. I'm glad there are some Debbie Downer's out there who get off on it, but the rest of us Redskins fans would be happier if JLC came out of the closet and simply began covering the Ravens. What a joke.

As a somewhat outsider I would say that the draft was pretty good for Redskins, perhaps dramatically more so in contrast to past years (see this depressing view from last year for example).

http://sports.espn.go.com/chat/sportsnation/story?id=2854030

I think that the questions Jasno raises are real ones, but perhaps you guys are reacting more to his somewhat embittered tone than the facts at hand. I would have said 1 receiver was plenty, and I don't think a 2nd receiver that doesn't crack the starting line up is very compelling 'trade bait' as SC puts it. The lines are getting weaker and older in an era where pass rush appears to be getting more important (having or stopping), but as some have said it may not be at the panic stage there quite yet and there are other avenues to find players.

I think it is good that the Redskins have taken a somewhat contrarian approach. Time will tell of course.

So my take would be pretty good overall, a somewhat odd portfolio of players, but if they have scouted well they will at least add some depth in a couple key places and get 2 starters, or maybe 3 with punter.

I agree with JLC on some things. Some things I dont. I think for one thing the stud of the draft might be Chad Rinehart. and much needed. As for the wide recievers and TE. Thomas is a good pick, Kelly good pick, Davis concerns me. And not because hes not good , oh hes good , maybe great, but not needed by this team. A team does not need 2 good or great TE. That means a lot of money spent at TE. When we need a lot of money spent at both lines. Colt Brennen thats a...ah..aa.aa I dont know, WOW! He cant even play in mini camp, hes injured. Are they gonna pay before they see him hit the field? Good luck with this class of picks . I think as far as players I rate this draft B+, as far as need D+.

Even if Fred Davis turns out to be a great player, short of a trade, I don't see how this significantly helps the Skins

Adam

Posted by: EaglesFanAdam | April 28, 2008 8:40 AM

Doesn't it allow Jim Zorn to draw up plays that he never could have without two legitimate tight ends? Doesn't it create some Red Zone nightmares for a defensive coach?

Posted by: Repost response to a Repost | April 28, 2008 9:13 AM

Except that Todd Yoder is a legit NFL TE. Fred Davis may turn out to be better (he also might not, by the way), but finding/grooming a replacement for Phillip Daniels (who everyone acknowledges is on his last legs) or getting another OL to feed into an aging OL corps make more sense to me.

Adam

Being deep at WR could be good not just because you have depth. Zorn could shuffle guys in and out to keep guys fresh and make the game a real track meet. The league has already figured out that using two running backs is a good idea, why not multiple WRs and TEs?

JLC,

You have got to stop this. Go cover another team or sport. You clearly have an agenda against the front office because they have not retained some of your favorite sources on the roster or coaching staff. I understand having coaches and players that talk to you makes your job easier, but that has nothing to do with whether or not that person should stay with this organization. You can not separate the too. You take it personally. It is completely unprofessional. Please stop.

JLC is a hater...it's getting old! go work for the ravens

After all we watched with our own eyes last year, these things we know.

A. The Redskins looked inept offensively in the passing game for a good part of the season. Because either Gibbs/Saunders couldnt figure it out or the players werent getting it done, or a little bit of both. We were so one dimensional, 3rd and 8, its going to Cooley, god help us if it was 3rd 15. Moss had issues catching balls, and Campbell had issues throwing low balls. For whatever reason, Collins came in and was able to resurrect the passing game, until the Seahawk game.

I believe the problem was both the coaching and the smallish receivers. I love Moss and Randle El, but I'd love them more if they were 6'2".

If Campbell is your QB, which he is, and Zorn is your coach, which he is, and the WCO is what you are running,which it is, you better have big receivers and 2 capable TE's to do thy bidding.

The first day of the draft, was a resounding A+. You basically got all the tools necessary for Zorn to succeed. Snyder and Cerrato had to protect their decision on Zorn, how do you do that? Get him his players to make the WCO run. He has them all. There is no reason why we can't have a top 5-10 offense next year.

"Snyder watched the private workouts of players at the top of the board." - the MOST damning sentence in the entire post.

Snyder considers the Redskins his own private fantasy football team and you morons are supporting him and his decisions? My god.

Just look at what parcels did with the dolphins.. mostly all OL, DE's and DT's.. this team needs youth and guys who can pressure on the DL desperately.. they've needed this for years now and keep ignoring it.. they may have picked up some nice players in this draft that will help JC and the offense, which is good... but the players they wanted always got picked right before they came up and forced them to yet drop again and pick for value.. i think they should have stayed put, picked merling (parcel picked him!).. got their receiver with # 2 and OL (whick they did) with pic 3.. it was nice they traded down, but it didn't pan out like they thought it would.. they should go get jason taylor now..

Here's what I wanna know,,, if Duane Brown was available, would they have taken him over Davis... or even White?

Posted by: | April 28, 2008 9:00 AM

Mystery poster...you are an idiot. Everything you said is completely undermined by the fact that we didn't draft anyone named White. We drafted a Thomas. But hey, small details right. You are dumb. Go away.

You know you make it sound like this team is heading for the first overall pick. I am firm believer in taking best availible and not reaching(falcons, jaguars, Lions) for a need. To be honest their are very few if any OL or DL who could have moved any of the starters out of the line up. The skins need depth in the secondary not starters and it looks to me like they got what they needed. Overall I like your articles but I disagree with you on this.

I am a die hard Redskin fan and I think JLC keeps it real. There nothing wrong with what he is saying. Its just hard to be a Redskin fan and know they screw up every year.

Except that Todd Yoder is a legit NFL TE

Adam,

36 catches, 4 touchdowns in 7 seasons, is Legit?? Really?

Yoder is a good blocker, and can catch the occasional pass. Lets not make him out to be something he is not.

Nothing will ever really change until the owner and front office become stable. JLC may be negative butr he's probably right. Let's hope he's wrong.

EVERY other media outlet is giving the Skins a A or B and praising them for the job they did. This short jealous little ---- still is nothing but doom and gloom!! Sad

JLC may be negative butr he's probably right.

Really? Please quantify how he is probably right.

Did they announce the undrafted FA's the signed yet?

I thought this was a pretty helpful and informative post from JLC. I know he tends to play the same note a lot but I thought it was appropriate to ask if there had been some serious grade inflation at WR thanks to the Danny's obsession with it and Vinny's need to polish that apple.

That said, I think the draft was a breath of fresh air for this franchise. I love going for best player available, and I think if this weren't the first time the skins actually had more than 6 picks and the opportunity to do BPA we would be able to appreciate this draft a whole lot more. If you keep to this strategy you'll be fine in the long run.

I do believe football teams should be built from the lines back, but I don't mind the two WR move bc probably only one of them will wind up being any good. I'd love it to be both, but based on history that's not that likely. So by trading down we get 2 for the price of one more or less. As for the TE, I watched a lot of pac 10 games and he stands out in film as a dominant player. His workout stats aren't that impressive but he was a beast in games.

Adam, lets say for example a team like the Patriots drafted a TE with first round pick in 2 out of 3 years, even using a first and a third to move up to select the particular TE that they were targeting, would that get questioned?

If Cooley goes down, then all the Redskins would have had would be Yoder, and Koz. Which would essentially eliminate using the tight end in this offense.

Posted by: Greg | April 28, 2008 9:19 AM

Greg,

Don't follow the Pats very closely, but I'd wonder a bit about that, just as I'm wondering why the hell Phily keeps drafting undersized, pass rushing DEs even after it goes out in the free agent market and signs (wait for it...) an undersized, pass rushing DE to a sizable free agent contract.

While it would be great to have an All Pro backing up an All Pro, salary cap limitations make that a near impossibility. I'd have preferred Calais Campbell, Jeremy Zuttah (utility OL), or maybe even Mike Pollak (C).

Guess we'll see what happens...

Adam

RE: JLC covering the Ravens....um, no.

It's a good thing that JLC is not a 'Skins homer. Journalistic integrity requires that a beat reporter cannot be a fan of the team that he writes about.

B. Outside of WR, I thought the biggest need was at DE and S. Although I wouldve liked to address DE, reaching for Calais and Groves wouldve been a mistake. Calais is lazy and took plenty of plays off, Groves took a step backwards from 2006/07. That said, they still need to address the DE position over the summer. Doughty is marginal at best, he needs to be our back-up not starter. Drafting Tyron will help the secondary and maybe he can surprise us all and start at corner, allowing Springs to move to SS, while the lower rated S we drafted gain more experience. And when Rogers comes back, we will be that much better.

The offensive line was hurt last year, but we have to catch some breaks. Jansen, if nothing else has to be fresh. Thomas should be fine too. The left side is good and Rabach is solid. We drafted a big guy who has some versatility.

whiner,
Jason Taylor is 33 years old. Dolphins said they want a 1st round pick for him. No Way!

JLC is right - I didn't really like this draft. 1 WR in the second round was probably a decent choice, but we really needed a stud defensive lineman of some sort, and that basically got ignored. The Danny and his whipping boy just don't understand the value of the guys in the trenches. Those two are all flash and no substance, and anyone who thinks The Danny knows anything more about pro football than the rest of us amateurs is fooling themselves. He never even played high school football, for goodness sake.

The TE from USC is a good player, but considering we are set at starter, it seems like a reach given how badly the team needs to develop the next crop of starting O and D linemen.

The punter in the sixth round round was a little strange. When can teams not find a decent punter via free agency, and didn't we just resign Derrick Frost?

We now have way too many "pass catchers", and I guess Anthony Mix isn't going to get his chance after all.

Oh, well, maybe The Danny will sell the team. We can dream, can't we?

36 catches, 4 touchdowns in 7 seasons, is Legit?? Really?

Yoder is a good blocker, and can catch the occasional pass. Lets not make him out to be something he is not.

Posted by: Greg | April 28, 2008 9:28 AM

He's a legit, backup NFL TE. That's all I'm saying. Could you do better? Probably. Do you have more pressing needs elsewhere? Most everyone here thinks so.

Adam

If the Skins had taken Calais Campbell or Quentin Groves instead of Fred Davis, I think this whole draft would be viewed differently and most Skins fans would be panning it as the best draft in years. Still, I think this was a good but not great draft for the Skins.

'Skins deserve major kudos for grabbing that punter. Frost averaged 41 yards last year and was 32nd in the league. The new dude averaged 45+ and would have been around 8th in the league.

There are an average of six punts per game, so this is a pickup of 24 yards per game.

Adam, If Cooley went down with an injury, that would basically eliminate the TE from the offence. Not to mention that the WC Offense utilizes 2 tight ends. It doesn't do much good to have a offense needing 2 TE's, and only having one guy who can be an asset.

While it was odd to have Vinny go all Matt Millen on us in the 2nd round with all the WR/TE picks, it was still a sound strategy. Yes we need OL depth, but we're also returning all 5 starters. We have Heyer, the kid we drafted in the 3rd round, plus we always pluck one or two from the undrafted free agent/June 1 cut pile. On defense, I still don't see the dire circumstances that JLC seems to push. We got 20+ sacks from the DE last year, we seem to have decent depth at LB and at safety Doughty seems solid enough to get us thru 16 games.

I'm a JLC fan, love that he keeps us posted (no pun intended) year round and has a pretty good pulse of the team, but his tone has gotten increasingly bitter/negative since the coaching search.

DE C. Wilson is the wild card. He had 4 sacks in the last 2 games last year. Plus 1 in the playoffs.

I'm also having a hard time listening to the "why get two WRs?!?!?!" crowd. The last time I checked the Redskins have been needing WR help since Monk and Clark left, save for a couple of nice seasons from Coles and later Moss. Moss has been an injury risk for most of his career and ARE showed that he's not that effective with Moss out of the lineup. And after Moss and ARE, they're best option (Mix) has like 3 catches in the NFL.

I'm always highly critical of the Redskins picks, but I thought they had an outstanding draft. Even if Davis was overkill, there was not a D-Lineman available there that would not have been a reach.

If you look at the needs coming into the draft:

1) WR Help
2) Pass rusher
3) Offensive Line depth
4) Secondary depth
5) Developmental QB
6) Someone to challenge Frost

they basically hit on each except one.

Be critical when needed. Don't be critical just to be critical. It's getting annoying and is pushing me away from reading.

Jason, while I was not thrilled that our first three picks were all offensive "weapons" and that we did not draft a DE until the bitter end, your negativity never STOPS. Mel Kiper and Ron Jaworski, who actually study players gave the Skins a "Thumbs Up" on this draft. Both picked the Skins as their "winners." So where do you get the crap about "raised eyebrows around the league"?

When can teams not find a decent punter via free agency, and didn't we just resign Derrick Frost?

Posted by: 'Skins Fan | April 28, 2008 9:36 AM

Derrick Frost is the type of punter you can get via free agency. If you want a good one, you need to draft him.

And, yes, we resigned Frost. To a one year contract with no bonus. And, by the way, no one else offered Frost a contract. He's at the bottom of the league.

None of these receivers will be worth a dime if we don't have young offensive linemen to keep Jason Campbell or Colt Brennan upright over the next 3-4 years.

Everyone keeps talking about Defensive end....Why does nobody talk about Chris Wilson? He had 4 sacks last year in a very limited role!

"If the deck is stacked towards receivers, and that's what the owner is most enamored with - those are the players he keeps swinging and missing on in the trade front - well, how do you think the draft going to unfold?"

That's why JLa correctly predicted the Skins picks. Oh wait...

Nothing will change until the Post staff comes to their senses and reasigns JLC to a job he is worthy of like covering dog racing in Tulsa.

It is amazing this dope still has a job. National media and draft experts are all on the side of this draft beeing good to very good and filling needs the skins had.

Oh wait...Danny was mean to Jason once so he needs to lead skins nation into thinking it was a terrible draft. We are tired of his agenda!

JLC,

You seem to be on the wrong side of the analysts with your rather negative assessment on this weekend's draft. The Skins draft has been largely lauded by the experts.

Your comments increasely seem anti-Redskin. Is this what we have to expect from the WashingtonPost? It's like you have a gripe against the organization. It's ironic that the only negative comments on the Redskins draft in the media this morning are coming from their beat reporter.

Most of us that read your column are fans. Which means we want to see the Redskins do well. We are not asking for a cheerleader. But give the team a break now and then. Why don't you report what the analysts are saying? It's largely positive.

For everyone whinning about the picks do you understand that we can not score points on offense, we had like two touchdowns from the WR position last year. I would have loved to get better on the D-Line, but if you can not score points it does not matter how good you D-Line is you will still loose. We have averaged like 16 points a game for the last 4 years so AS can take that 700 page playbook and shove it up his A$$. The defense ranked 8th last season not to shabby, we did not loose games last year because of Defense we lost because we could not score.

It seems to me that, with 11 OL/DL picks in the first 20, the boat had already sailed on getting an immediate starter at OL/DL; there was a run on the bank at those positions... and you know who loses when you get to the bank late.
That's a stark contrast to last year, where only 7 OL/DL picks were made in the entire first round, along with 7 WR/TEs -- that's why there were so many WRs left at the beginning of the second round. And so, 11 of the 20 picks before the skins took Kelly were WR/TE.
I don't know these guys from Adam, and I would've liked to see a DL/OL/CB picked high. But I can see the logic of their picks, and that's about all you can ask for.

So where do you get the crap about "raised eyebrows around the league"?

Posted by: Lisa | April 28, 2008 9:43 AM

Jasno, insider that he is, has a carefully cultivated group of Redskins haters "around the league" so that he can always attribute his hate to someone else.

I gotta say that I'm warming up more and more to this draft. Like JLa, I would have loved at least 4 guys on both sides of the line, but this draft just didn't pan out like that. The run on T's in the first round was ridiculous and I think that a couple of teams really reached for a lineman. I think that this could actually be a draft for the future. As some have pointed out, our WR wasn't exactly striking fear into the hearts of anyone's secondary and a great #2 tight end will be great in the red-zone-a real weakness for us. Hopefully we can pick up some gem undrafted linemen that will be ready to go when our old guys give out in the next year or so.

Brilliant work Jason! I could not have written it better myself.

Can we give Jason Reid a blog as well so those of us who don't want to read negative nancy all the time have something. JLC is the most negative person about all things Redskins. I'd love to hear his analysis of the Ravens - I'm sure JLC thinks Flacco is the next Peyton Manning. Can we send him somewhere to cover girls lacross or something?

JLC - I have defended you a lot, and I think rightly so. You do a good job of reminding us fans of things we would like to forget. I find your theory of a "conspiracy" to rate receivers higher a little specious, but I can follow the dots that you lay out and see where you are coming from.

This is the first draft that we get to lay directly at VinnyDAN's feet. This is all on him/them, with no Coach Gibbs/Spurrier/Marty/Norv to blame. Zorn is VinnyDAN's creature, and even if he signed off on someone, they take the hit. Same with Blache.

I don't have much opinion about not taking OL and DL in the later rounds. A lot of the guys I wanted are undrafted, so not taking them with picks was vindicated. Most of the DEs in later rounds are like the guys we have, tweeners with pass rushing skills.

My thoughts (cause everyone really needs to know this) on the draft:

Devin Thomas (WR) - Great combination of need and value - no issues at all with the pick. I might have taken Jenkins at 21, but it was worth the gamble on losing Merling to trade down, and Thomas is real value at a real need at 34.

Fred Davis (TE) - seems like the value is there, but not the need. It was a depth pick, which is something you can defend when you are picking high. I don't love it, would not have made it, but can defend it. That said, we will have to follow the careers of some guys who had value here AND filled a need at OL, DT and DL.

Malcolm Kelly (WR) - The victory of value over need. It should mean that we won't have the same worries about Santana's hamstrings and ARE's limitations, and allow ARE to be more varied in his uses. I do think that depth at WR has been a bigger issue in recent years then JLC thinks, and while it is a dependent position, being able to plug a real receiver in when (not if) Moss goes down does benefit the QB and the running game.

Chad Rinehart (OG) - Love his size and the text on him. Definite need, can play two or three positions on the line. Can't argue with the pick. Need and, I hope, value.

Justin Tryon (CB) - Again, need and value. Not a perfect prospect, but who is at that point.

Durant Brooks (P) - Sigh. I don't like Frosty, but I don't like drafting kickers either. Clearly he was a value pick in terms of how he was rated and where he was picked, but would not have made the pick. The 2nd best punter in the draft was available as an UDFA, and this pick could have been used to develop a LB, CB, S, OL or DL, all of whom can make the team on the scout team or special teams.

Kareem Moore (S) - Need and value. Good pick.

Colt Brennan (QB) - Need yes. Value yes. Do I think it will work out? No. But it is the 6th round, a developmental pick for a developmental position. Don't love it, but not a huge problem for me. The 6th round is where you take fliers on QBs.

Rob Jackson (DE) - Need- YES, value, who knows. He seems like one of those tweeners that would have been available as an UDFA. At this point in the draft, why not.

Christopher Horton (S) - Need and Value - I like this kid a lot, although his bio reads a lot like Doughtery (sic). A safety can make the team on specials and develop. Decent size and is aggressive. Sounds like a guy who at least can make the team covering returns.

Would I have preferred them to take a more complete DE in the 2nd round rather than Kelly or Davis? Yes. But I am not quite as down on it as JLC.

Sorry, that should be all I can ask for... you can clearly ask for something else entirely...

Everyone keeps talking about Defensive end....Why does nobody talk about Chris Wilson? He had 4 sacks last year in a very limited role!

Posted by: Uncle Spence | April 28, 2008 9:43 AM

Looks like a great pass rusher, but at 245-250 LBs, would seem to be a liability against the run.

Philip Daniels is the DE run stopper, but he's getting way up there in years and miles.

Adam

Really, who wasn't scratching their heads watching the Skins in the second round? That was bizarre. JLC might be a little harsh in his assessment, but he's right about a lot of it. I had never really thought about Snyder's obsession with WRs.

Yoder is a good blocker, and can catch the occasional pass. Lets not make him out to be something he is not.

Posted by: Greg | April 28, 2008 9:28 AM

I will never forget Yoder putting Dawkins down, and out of the game, against Philly early in the season last year. I hope there's a spot for him on the team.

The favorable draft evaluations being touted relied almost exclusively on a simple cost-benefit analysis based on who went when. They hardly addressed what the team needs were and whether they were addressed or should have been, as Jason had. A self-appointed goon squad in here is just all we need at the present moment, too. When this team has been middle-of-the-pack for oh so long now, how exactly do you ignore what they do? You'd think they'd been to Super Bowls all along...

Durant Brooks (P) - Sigh. I don't like Frosty, but I don't like drafting kickers either. Clearly he was a value pick in terms of how he was rated and where he was picked, but would not have made the pick. The 2nd best punter in the draft was available as an UDFA, and this pick could have been used to develop a LB, CB, S, OL or DL, all of whom can make the team on the scout team or special teams.

Posted by: RedBee | April 28, 2008 9:48 AM

Bee--

1. Brooks was the only punter on the 'Skins board. They didn't have a "second highest."

2. As for UDFA, they are eligible to sign with 31 other teams. 'Skins couldn't even get Henderson from MD to sign with them. UDFA is a real crapshoot.

3. Frost is the 32nd ranked punter in the NFL. This is a position in major need of an upgrade.

Hay jva,

How many TD's did the WR's have last year? OK enough said, I will say it again you can not win if you can not score points.

Philip Daniels is the DE run stopper, but he's getting way up there in years and miles.

Adam

Posted by: EaglesFanAdam | April 28, 2008 9:49 AM

You're right, but other than Merling, that type of player was long gone by #20. And he was gone by the time the skins picked.

Who here thinks that a better day one draft would be Merling in the first and Kelly in the second? Maybe, but I'm not confident enough about that to put money on it... or type a half-page screed on organizational incompetence.

JLC - you really do SUCK! Not because I disagree with you (I agree with everything you said about the draft strategy), but because you don't know anything about football. Please explain to me how it is possible to have 6 eligible receivers on the field when you empty the backfield! It is not possible! 5 linemen + 1 QB = 6 guys. That leaves just 5 eligible receivers.

And how come ESPN beats you to every breaking redskins story???????

Hmm, interesting opinion from JLC. It does seem that the Redskins could have "diversified their draft portfolio" so to speak.

Although, to be blunt, JLC's opinion - pretty much like mine - means squat.

He's a reporter. That's all. Not a football expert.

I wish the reporters in America one day would realize what their job is and what it isn't.

Report the news; don't make it.

Because frankly, too many reporters think they if only they ran the world, everything would be just so much better.

you all know that i pretty much look for any excuse to bash JLC, but he did make several valid points.

The Thomas pick was solid. I also think getting Kelly was a no-brainer - we were enamoured with him and its true that moss can't stay healthy. ARE is a #3 guy. Realistically, in 1-2 years, we were going to need two new WRs for our #1 and #2 receiver slots - it takes receivers a while to develop so i view this as a great move.

The one thing I don't like is the davis pick - yeah he was undoubtably a steal there... but you can find great TEs in the 4th round. Getting Campbell would have been stupid since he is more suited for a 3-4 defense, but we should have gone after a CB, S, or DT there.

JLC is on point that this was a stoopid move. That being said, i like that we will likely not have to worry about the skill positions on offense for years to come.

In Rinehart, Heyer, and Alexander, we have solid backups and future potential starters for our O-line.

Our defensive backfield is set. Next year in the draft, we can very likely use ALL our draft picks on backup OL, starting DL, and maybe a LB.

Message to JLC:

You need to get laid, man !
Get off that pessimistic mood...how long since you had a GOOD one ?

I think the Skins did pretty decent this weekend...you can only do so much when your highest pick is #21...and for once, we have a bunch of good prospects...no wonder Jason Campbell called coach Zorn to thank him for all the new weapons...and yes, we still need a DL...but all in all we solved a bunch of needs...HAIL !

The second round receiver picks were all about all those times inside the red zone where the Skins settled for field goals for the lack of big, athletic targets.

Remember the losses against the Cowboys and Giants? I would have killed for another big target aside from Cooley to find (they even caught to Mike Sellers).

Remember all the talk about maybe using Sean (RIP) in red zone?

Now the Skins have two big targets, two real field stretchers, and two 'can't put a linebacker on him' TE's. The offense could be creating the matchup problems it needs to support JCampbell.

Of course, I would also invite people to go back and look at JLC's take on last year's inability to get D Lineman, and the team finished 8th in the NFL in defense (after losing Sean)!

I would also note that the Skins in the last game of the season set Dallas's rushing futility record (-7 in a game), with that AWFUL (sic) D-Line.

I hope everyone has their "-7" signs for the 'Girls game.

not sure what people hope to accomplish by constantly ripping on JLC. would you be happy if he didn't blog? do you think you can convince him that dan snyder is good for the team?

it's clear his blog is largely opinion/column not fact/reporting, which i think is great. he probably tends to fit facts (hearing coaches question the grades given to WRs) but you can decide for yourself if the coach providing that assessment should be ignored or not. I like hearing that stuff.

there seems to be some people who are offended by anything negative said about the team... as a longtime die hard fan i think it's our right and obligation to demand the best from the franchise. if that means questioning the way the team is run and hopefully causing some change, i think we are being loyal, not disloyal.

Another great outcome in this draft:

We didn't trade away a single pick from next year's draft to move up and "steal" a guy with questionable legs.

This board is such an interesting example of the Danny's attempt to harass Jason into ceasing his appropriately data-driven criticism of this team. I mean, who could really argue with Jason's centralm premise that until the front office structure changes, this team will continue to be terrible for the next decade, just like the past decade.

Here's some evidence of the Danny's concerted attempt to harass Jason off the beat:

1) These crazy posts attacking Jason personally, even though he has been more right about the Redskins over the past five years than virtually anyone I know.

2) The recent complaint to the Sports section editors over Jason's suggestion that the Dann'y businesses haven't been doing well recently (obviously true).

3) The concerted effort to label Jason as anti-Italian (supposedly orginating with the an Italian American organization but with the Danny and Vinny's fingerprints all over it) because of the recent Vinny naming contest. (See Howell's column yesterday on the Op Ed page).

Redskins - this is pathetic. Who are these morons who buy your tickets to enable this type of pathetic behavior?

No doubt that as individual picks, this draft was great. We got fantastic value, especially out of guys like Thomas and Kelly. It's tough to argue with that.

Having said that, I'm still disappointed with the overall draft, and the lack of addressing the offensive and defensive lines. One guard isn't what I consider addressing a line that has every starter over the age of 30, and a 7th round comp pick certainly isn't what I call addressing the defensive line.

Yes, the 2nd rounders were great value. Yes, we should be set for years to come at the WR/TE position. But to me, this draft is evidence of how backwards Snyder and Cerrato view the way to build a football team. They'd rather have their "weapons" set before they build their "core" (meaning offensive/defensive line). I simply don't agree with that. Maybe our "gems" will eventually turn into consistent starters (Alexander, Heyer). Who knows.

And anyone can go back and forth with the arguments. Some say we needed the receivers and TE because Moss and ARE struggle to stay healthy. I can say we need legit o-line prospects for the same reason (Jansen, Thomas). Some will say that Jansen and Thomas are great talents that have a very legit shot of getting and staying healthy, therefore we don't need their replacements right away. Again, the same exact thing can be said of Moss and ARE. In the end, both these positions were needs, and our FO decided that "weapons" are more important than the trenches. Not something I, and apparently JLC, agree with.

And I'm still confused as to how we can pretty much completely ignore the defensive line in the draft. We had a group of overachievers last year, and we've done nothing to improve them.

In the end, we definitely got talent in this draft. Can't argue that. I was hoping for it to be more well-rounded, but overall this was a change of pace for the skins, and was a solid stepping stone for the future.

people seem to be obsessed with this "6 receivers" issue and i don't get it. you have to have depth... how many games have skins receivers missed over the last few years? you'll be lucky if it really is a problem finding time for all these picks.

not to mention the fact that like it or not a lot of picks don't work out, even for the best teams. you hope for the best but prepare for reality.

"But, once again, the Redskins raised eyebrows around the league with their approach. Maybe they'll end up being brave iconoclasts - smarter than everyone else; defying conventional wisdom - but here's an examination of why they are being questioned for taking three pass catchers with their top three picks at a time when even they admit there are also pressing needs at OT, DT, DE, C/G, S, CB, OLB, FB, QB."

Who exactly is "everyone else," J-dumb? Every real expert has praised the Skins for trading down and snagging 3 guys in the 2nd round all with 1st rd grades, including probably the 2 best WRs in the draft on most boards, which was a huge position of need.
You were wrong on every prediction you made, then had the nerve to say of the Kareem Nichols pick that "I got one right". You made a ton of predictions, all wrong btw, but I don't remember that post where you predicted they'd take Nichols. VC has far more credibility to me than you, a poor reporter with an obvious chip on his shoulder for DS, VC, and all other things Redskin. Get over yourself and realize your place is to report news, and nothing more.

not sure what people hope to accomplish by constantly ripping on JLC.

Posted by: in defense | April 28, 2008 10:00 AM

What do you hope to accomplish by kissing his a$$?

Day One of this draft still sucks. WR-TE-WR.

Day Two, whoop de doo. Nothing happened on day two to impress me or make up for the shabingus of day one. I mean, it's really terrific to have added a bunch of "just a guy" type players. Really, really terrific. I'm sure a couple of these schlubs will be contributors, and that will be awesome. But today, I'm nonplussed.

Also, and others have made similar comments, with all the trades down we made, shouldn't we have wound up with, like fifteen picks? I'm not really strong with the maths, but it seems like we subtracted by addition. Something like that.

Maybe something else is going to happen... maybe a big trade will surprise us and suddenly we'll have a pass rush. Maybe... *sigh*

Go Zorn. Hail Skins. And etc.

-Nate in the PDX

to me, the only questionable pick was Fred Davis. Even using two TE sets, the focus will be to get the ball to the WR's and Cooley. A second TE when Calias Campbell was there was shocking to me. We could have gotten a competent backup much later on and fill a glaring need a DE. That said, I love all the other picks, Frost sucks and if this guy can average a 5-10 yard improvement is huge in field position. The DB's all seem to be solid backups and depth that we needed, we wouldn't be giving our third QB reps this offseason anyway, its a new playbook the only QB's getting reps are JC and TC. The WR's!!!!! are you kidding me? we got the two best guys on most everybody's board and we needed help bad, we have had poor WR's for years. I know you don't know if they'll be great yet or not but they are certainly upgrades over the street crew we had previously behind Moss and ARE, and hopefully we can slide ARE back in the slot where he belongs. I thought it was a great draft with one weird pick.

I dont mind the two WR picks, but that TE pick was JUST STUPID. Ceratto is a fool and once again shows how ignorant he is. We have one of the best TE's in the entire NFL and we blow a high pick when we have so many pressing needs. Gollum you stink.

also, we need a DE, Jason Taylor is available, anybody think the Danny won't go get him?

there seems to be some people who are offended by anything negative said about the team

I disagree. I think that some of us are sick of hearing NOTHING BUT NEGATIVITY, on this blog. He states you can't judge a draft immediately, then continues to do the very think he stated that you CANNOT do.

Hey Nate if that is really you, what good does a DE do a team that can not score?

I agree with In Defense. Redskins fans LOVE to drink the Kool-Aid. That's why many of us are happy with just making the playoffs year after year. When you look at what the Giants did last year, they won with a young, fast defensive line. Football games are won in the trenches. You win by knocking down the other quarterback, and protecting your own. Look at what happened to the Patriots against the pressure of the Giants D-linemen, despite having an All World Quarterback and Wide Receiver combo, they lost.

Our offensive line is good, but old and injury prone. I only hope that JCampbell has time to throw the ball to the 6 receivers we plan on sending out there.

I'm ok with this draft. We ought to thank STL for taking Avery instead of Thomas... things would look a lot different if we took Kelly at #34.

Taking Davis at #48 is the big question, but having 2 good pass-catching TEs is a fine. Davis will push Cooley to be even better. Plus, both will line up on short yardage plays, along with Kelly and Thomas, giving skins a height advantage. NE had 2 good TEs (Stevens and Watson), both 1st rounders, before Stevens left for SEA. It worked extremely well for Brady.

ARE or Moss may be traded at some point. At any rate, I think the Skins are finally strong and deep at 2 positions (TE/WR) that will create match-up problems for opposing teams. Can Zorn and Campbell deliver? That's the question.

Getting the punter was a good pick. I love Rinehart, and the CB, Tryon, is a gamer (although he has a mouth that rivals Smoot's). Low-round safeties are good picks for depth -- one may pan-out to challenge Doughty. That's fine.

All-in-all, not perfect but there's little to complain about. 3 #2s is a good haul -- affordable potentially top-line players. If the OL and DL studs were not there in the second round, what can you do? Look back at prior drafts: a lot of high picks don't pan-out. Got to take players you like, regardless of need and position. The question is, is our scouting dept any good?

JLC is the worst!!

Nate in the PDX,

Exactly which dude should the Redskins have picked that would suddenly have given us a pass rush? All the serious game changers were gone when the Redskins picked.

And exactly who should they have picked on the second day who wasn't a "just a guy" player? It's the second day of the draft.

Great assessment JLC. Soo many needs and these baffoons continue to be obsessed with WR. Again, two picks...enough. Get some interior help. It was just a stupid, stupid pick. Gollum at his best.

SMC, here is your big chance. How would you have done this draft? You obviously work in the football industry, so expound upon us some of your vast knowledge.

Last I checked the Redskins have a top 10 defense and an offense that is full of overpriced skill players that can't get in the end zone. This team routinely scores 17 or less points a game. So what's the big deal about drafting pass catchers. How many TD's have Moss and Randel El scored in the last 2 years?

Why should anyone be surprised by the Redskins picks in the draft? This team has no plan! No GM equals, no plan. They have gapping needs at both offensive and defensive lines and they instead of spending their first three picks addressing those needs, they select three pass cathers. When will the team understand that without a solid line, it doesn't make a difference how gifted your WR's are.

Another great outcome in this draft:

We didn't trade away a single pick from next year's draft to move up and "steal" a guy with questionable legs.

Posted by: | April 28, 2008 10:02 AM

And another:

We didn't trade multiple picks for Chad Johnson!!!!

The standard among the haters, includ Hate in the PDX, seems to the that we have to solve all our problems in one draft. And if we don't solve them all, then the front office are "idiots" (at best).

Well, that would be fine if we had 18 picks in the first three rounds. We had three picks in the first three rounds, and we got three first round talents. That was a windfall.

Next year, we'll solve more problems in the draft. And more still in the following year.

Just look at what parcels did with the dolphins..

Who cares? We have more playoff wins in the last decade than he does

Hey Esteban,

Tell me who of the O-Line prospects you would have picked that would have started this year? Do not just post what we should have done back it up with some knowledge if you have any. The O-Line played pretty good last year and guess what we averaged 16 points a game.

The best predictor of future behavior is past behavior.

Discuss.

Malcolm Kelly was hands down the best receiver in this draft and will turn into a solid player. The only reason he drops is because he runs 40 time that doesn't blow anyone away. News flash - measurables are bunk. If you're a football player you're a football player and will succeed at the next level. I would've been happy selecting him at #21 but getting him, Thomas and Davis was just icing on the cake.

Granted I would've picked Calais Campbell, (Miami players always become good pro's and this guy is no differesnt) over Fred Davis but Davis is still a beast and will create major mismatches in the passing game.

Maybe the Chad Johnson thing is not over?? 2 WR's in the 2nd round. Trade Moss from Chad Johnson and next years 2nd rounder?? Its a reach, but maybe something to think about.

When will the team understand that without a solid line, it doesn't make a difference how gifted your WR's are.

Posted by: Esteban | April 28, 2008 10:19 AM

When will you understand that if your pee-wee receivers can't get open, it doesn't matter how long the QB has to throw the ball?

So... how many more PPG are we going to score this fall, now that we have these new WRs and TE? Make your predictions now...

I reserve the right to be unimpressed with this draft. But I have been clearly in the minority up here, saying D line and O line and even secondary should have been a priority over WR... so obviously I have been out of synch with the front office for months now (shocker).

Really glad to see so much happiness/positivity over the draft (honest!), especially in the wake of the comedy of errors coaching search. Sorry I'm not on board with it, but I have "trust issues" with this front office.

I sincerely hope the result of all this -- the new coaching staff, FA inactivity, draft, UDFAs -- is a better team this fall than we had last fall. We shall see.

-Nate in the PDX

Lets all be honest... We're arent going to win the Superbowl next year.

New Coach
New system

A playoff berth would be a great outcome. We addressed our skill postions for WCO.

Next season, land a free agent OL or DL and draft linemen and linebackers in next years draft.

Exactly which dude should the Redskins have picked that would suddenly have given us a pass rush? All the serious game changers were gone when the Redskins picked.

Posted by: | April 28, 2008 10:14 AM

I'll chime in here, if you don't mind. There were two moves that could've been made.

(1) We could've kept the #21 pick, and drafted Merling. We still would have gotten Kelly at 51. We would've had to sacrifice Davis (not a huge loss, IMO), and probably could have found a serviceable 2nd TE later in the draft. I'm not faulting the skins for trading back, I thought it was the right move, but this certainly was an option.

(2) We could've taken Calais Campbell instead of Davis at 48. Campbell didn't perform well (with measurables) at the combine, and thus had his stock drop. He's had a 1st round grade all year, and only fell after his poor workouts. We all praise the Kelly pick for picking a 1st-round talent who fell b/c of poor 40 times and a questionable attitude. How exactly is Campbell any different? And you can't say that TE was a greater need than DE, because it's not.

That 2nd scenario is the most puzzling to me. TE wasn't even on our radar, but somehow after the draft we "needed" a 2nd TE because Yoder isn't good enough to run the 2TE sets, and Cooley has all of a sudden become "expensive."

I'm cautiously optimistic about this draft. Here is what Clark Judge on CBS Sportsline says about the skins draft:

"8. Nobody did better in the second round than Washington. At the 21st spot, the Redskins were weighing defensive end Phillip Merling vs. Devin Thomas. Then Atlanta called. The Redskins traded out, moving down to the 34th spot, yet still found Thomas. So they chose him with one of Atlanta's two second-round picks and tight end Fred Davis with the other. Smart."

Now looking at it that way...I wouldn't have been blown away that the skins picked Thomas with the 21st. I would have rather had Merling but knowing Dan the man I knew we would have gotten a receiver. Because of this deal we basically got Fred Davis for free. I would have rather gotten Calais Campbell with the 48th and then grabbed Fred Davis with the 51st if he was still there, but hey I don't run this thing.

Drafting the punter was a great call. Yes I said it. Frost is average at best. And we all know that the first 6-8 games of the year we are going to have a good amount of three and outs, because it always takes at least one year to get used to a system. So field position will be huge and I just don't trust good ol' Frosty with his knack of shanking punts at the worst times. He has gotten better...but he's average at best. This kid is going to be top 7 or 8 in the league his first year.

The Offensive Lineman we took is going to be a great guard and can play tackle like he did in college...should someone go down. I think we got a good corner at the time we took him, even though he is small, but he has speed not to get beat.

We just have to hope we don't get too banged up on the defensive line because as it is we are already thin and average to below average there compared to the rest of the league. Let's see if our linebackers and secondary can make up for it...again.

Tell me who of the O-Line prospects you would have picked that would have started this year? Do not just post what we should have done back it up with some knowledge if you have any. The O-Line played pretty good last year and guess what we averaged 16 points a game.

Posted by: kmdp4 | April 28, 2008 10:24 AM

Who of these receivers is going to start this year? How about Davis? My guess is none of them. This draft was for the future, not for immediate dividends. The FO decided that WR and TE were more of a need for the future than O-line or D-line. Not very smart IMO.

Doesn't it worry you as fans that Snyder was locked onto Ocho Stinko in January so much so that he mentioned him in coaching interviews? And that he obsessed over him right up until draft day?

Skins fans owe a debt of gratitude to the Bengals. I do have some concerns about taking three pass catchers, but will wait and see on that.

But it is completely nuts the way ownership and the FO obsessed over Ocho Stinko. Same old same old

I agree it would have been nice to get help at DL but Groves and Campbell both fit more in a 3-4 defense. At DT after Dorsey, Ellis, and Balmer their are no DT worth drafting over players like Kelly or Davis. I am happy to see them at least drafting players instead of going out and trading for players on the downside of their career or signing overpriced free agents. I hope this is a sign of things changing.

I guess what concerns me most is that I thought bolstering the pass rush was a very big deal for this team this offseason, and that we could have found SOMEONE in one of the early rounds who plays on the D line and could join the rotation and provide some push upfield... acknowledging that all the apparent D line studs were gone by the time we were on the clock with #21... but then nothing. We hear nothing about D line until well into day two, with our ninth pick, in the seventh round.

Again, the fact that I was this out of synch with the front office is no surprise...

Not saying we could have solved our pass rush problems in this draft given the hand we were dealt, just that it's April 28 and we haven't done anything that will definitely improve our pass rush for this fall. Or maybe I missed something.

-Nate in the PDX

So... how many more PPG are we going to score this fall, now that we have these new WRs and TE? Make your predictions now...

Posted by: | April 28, 2008 10:27 AM

How many are you predicting, Nate, with all your negativity?

Last year the 'Skins averaged 20.9 points per game, tied for 18th in the league. Four more points per game would have raised them to ninth -- right between the Browns and the Steelers. New England was first with 36.8 and the Cowboys were second with 28.4.

psps-

I would put money on one or both of those receivers starting this season.

I'm sorry, but JLC has cleary gotten sick of this beat. I'm just tired of every article being completely negative. It's entirely possible everything he says could come true, but it's also possible we could finally have the really great offense we've been craving for. JLC's favorite team the Ravens reached on Flacco, and they still don't have the WR core to be a stellar offense. Whether or not you agree with the WR picks, you can't argue the value we got with those picks.

1. This is a not an article (news), or a column (opinion), but a BLOG. It's a this-is-what-I'm-thinking-at-the-moment piece. If you don't like it, so what?
2. Name one owner in the last 30 years who has been successful by meddling in the draft. Fans always love flashy positions like WR and QB, and undervalue the guys doing the real work. If you aren't trouble by reading that Snyder was actually at the workouts, you aren't thinking too clearly.
3. WRs don't pan out about 50% of the time -- you just can't tell. Plus, it takes 3 years for most of them to be ready to start (with a few notable exceptions -- the most prominent of which was one of hte last players drafted 2 years ago -- so don't get your hopes up too high for either of these guys to help much this year. Or next.
4. Zorn is going over JC's mechanics. I hope he has a drill for throwing long while going down underneath a 260 pound DE.
5. The people happiest about the draft are probably the Giants' defensive line. Although it may be the Eagles' defensive line. Or maybe Dallas' guys. Their offensive lines are probably pretty pleased too.

Section 104 - - Well Said! The only thing I would add is to take a look at how long it took our receivers to score at touchdown last year. Cooley was the only reliable weapon in the red zone. We kicked way too many field goals last year. I envision a scenario where Santana and ARE and Thomas run defenses all over the field. Then in the red zone, here comes the big package.

Washington Redskins - OG Kerry Brown, OT Shannon Boatman, OT Devin Clark, S Kevin Mitchell, CB Matterral Richardson, DL Dorian Smith, C Kyle DeVan

From:

http://potencial.wordpress.com/2008/04/27/udfa-tracker/

The one thing that gives me pause was listening to The Owner on radio this past Friday (or someday over the weekend?) about the "product" (i.e., the draft board) that does (did) the picking ... so that part of Jasno's read makes sense to me ... if you fiddle on the board at the end of the process to move guys up a position, then the results should be expected.

Also, he (The Owner) said something about how they got the "character issue guys" off the board. On that, I say BS. The reason Fred Davis was available when we got him -- even if he graded as best TE in the draft -- was because of "character issues." [I don't know his full story ... someone can fill us in ... but many sites dropped him to something like the #4 TE based on his maturity and rep.

On the idea of getting three receivers in a row, esp. if they really only want or need one receiver, I am AOK with that. Receivers are the biggest crap shoot in the draft ... if you want one, pick three and hope for the best.

My ultimate judgments about this draft, i.e., whether it gets my A grade, is on >5 of the 10 make the roster. If they do, I give it an A. If not, it gets a C. Less than 3 gets a C minus. I also am a little concern about how much the character-dar got loosened in post-Gibbs year one. If any one of the picks doesn't make the roster based on an off-field screwup (as opposed to actual talent), then I give it a C minus regardless.

Finally, I totally agree with Jasno's take on how the head coachabingus has way over-extended Zorn. Something had to give. Sounds like the something will turn out to be the playbook.

The FO decided that WR and TE were more of a need for the future than O-line or D-line. Not very smart IMO.

Posted by: psps23 | April 28, 2008 10:32 AM

Agree to disagree. Great to get JC his receivers of the future. They need to work together and build timing. The sooner they start, the better. Not much timing to build between JC and the right guard.

And, yeah, at least one of those receivers will be a starter in the first game this year, pushing ARE to #3 where he was signed to play.

Psps,

Merling is not a rusher he is a run stopping DE, Campbell is a 3-4 DE who is about as strong as my 10 year old daughter. One of the WR's will be starting day one and as soon as Moss or ARE get hurt the other will be starting.

Here's the deal: the front office went out and got a bunch of "playmakers" for this offense. They have no excuses next year. It's Snyder's GM, coach, draft, and organization. We will soon see if he has learned something in his decade in the NFL, or if it's more of the same tomfoolery and hijinks.

My money's on the latter, but it's not like I'm all of a sudden going to stop watching or going to games. After all, I've been a fan of the maroon and black and gold since I was a wee little lad.

Thomas will start this year and ARE will go back to the slot where he is the highest paid player in the league. Everyone bashes the fact we didn't go OLine, but we did, we took a guard/tackle to add to our stable of solid backups, Fabini, Wade, Heyer, and Alexander. We have great depth on the Oline and if Thomas and Jansen stay healthy, we have one of the best Olines in the league, a backup center can be found anywhere. Now with all our weapons we have helped JC, our Oline (now pinning your ears back with legit threats outside) and CP cause they can't stack the box on him, I'm tired of our 16 points a game and hope the defense holds, lets open it up and put some pressure on people, obviously that's what Zorn wants to do and now we have the weapons to do it. Plus, we can get a vet DE or DT after the June 1st cuts, there was nobody there that was a sure thing on the Dline and we needed the WR's. Free Agency proved there were no good WR's out there.

One more thing: The Skins rather inadvertently showed their great confidence in their own selections by drafting a new punter. They must figure that they're going to need him. Maybe there will be so much work that they'll keep Frost as well.

Please sign a name to your comments, anonymous friend at 10:36am. You're participating in the conversation, and you ought to be using a name. It's more fun that way.

In 2007 we scored 20.9 PPG, tied for 18th in the league.

I predict we will score 20 PPG in 2008, a reduction of .9 PPG. While our punting will be better, our placekicking will decline, to the tune of approximately one missed extra point a week.

Predictions are awesome.

-Nate in the PDX

skinfanman, I'm with you on 100% of your posts today. Also, thanks for the UDFA link!

NFL | D. Smith does limited work at Pro Day - from www.KFFL.com
Sun, 16 Mar 2008 12:42:26 -0700

J.J. Pesavento, of Next Level Scouting, reports Oregon State DL Dorian Smith measured a height of 6-foot-1 1/2 and a weight of 264 pounds at his Pro Day. He measured a 30 1/2-inch vertical jump, a 9-foot-2 broad jump and ran the 40-yard dash in 4.87 seconds.

Skins had a good draft. YOu can't address all the needs all the time. They got great value int he WR picks and have set up the offense fro quite some time. Our defense was decent last year, if our offense can be just a little more productive then we will be alright. Maybe we can sign Marcus Dixon as a UFA?

Welcome to DC draft picks, here a little somethign to help you get acquanted with the neighbor hood.

http://www.straycompass.com/article_page.php?recordID=14

Although there were some questionable decisions, I liked the draft overall. I actually like the two wide receivers we got in the 2nd round. They were first round talent at 2nd round value and that position has been a problem for us for so unbelievably long. You figure they won't resign S. Moss when his contract is up. So, it will be M. Kelly, D. Thomas and Randel El. They will be 6'4, 6'2 and 5'10, respectively. Not bad. The TE selection is questionable. I know we need a younger TE to complement and backup Cooly. Todd Yoder is old and they other guy we drafted in the 7th round last year has been hurt. And, I know Davis was a first round grade that fell into the 2nd round, but we just should have addressed the TE later in the draft and focused more on a blocking TE. I don't know why we selected a punter in the 5th round after we just resigned Derrick Frost. I like the OG pick from Northern Iowa in the 3rd. I don't mind the QB pick to groom a 3rd stringer. I don't mind the two safety picks, but we should have picked safeties earlier in the draft. I don't like CB pick. The guy is too small and not fast enough. So, if little old me was going to grade, I would have to give the draft a C+. But, I'll give them credit that they stuck to their board. When you reach for a need, that is when you make bad picks. I would have liked some more offensive lineman, LBs and CBs, but I am glad we are done trying to find a WR every freaking year. Also, why is everyone freaking out of the Dline. We just drafted two solid guys a couple of years ago and Andre Carter is still young and Chris Wilson is coming along well. D. Evans can play in his spot to stop the run, too.

Both Brennan and Davis have had character issues in the past. Brennan's issues were serious, Davis's issues (tardiness, sleeping in meetings, etc.) seem more like the issues of a homesick 19 year old than a real character flaw. By all accounts, Davis has put that stuff behind him. Brennan, also, has paid his dues to society and seems to have matured. I'd give them both the benefit of the doubt at this point.