I wish both Clintons would just go away.
As members of the trilateral commission which is communist we don't need them in
America.
What a shame trash such as these people have risen to prominence in this country.
They need to go and live in Cuba or some other communist country.

I just cant wait for Senator Clinton to be elected President. Bill was a fab prez. And i am sure Hillary will be just as good if not better.
When a smart woman gets going, you cant stop her.
Republicans know that, thats why they are constantly slurring her. Will they ever learn we dont want more of the trash. 6 yrs of dubya has been hell.

CLINTON/WARNER 08

look, love bush or detest him, how can anyone respect the guy after what he allowed to happen and to be said about max cleland? this alone speaks volumes about how he feels for veterans and soldiers. give me a break. all isn't fair in politics. the guy is mean spirited and petulant.
in the debates with kerry, he couldn't remember making a mistake in four years. this is quite a man.
i'm ready for alittle humility back in the executive branch and mrs. clinton suits me fine. she has proven she can reach out to both sides of the aisle.

Yes - Hillary WILL be our next president. And the results of all these polls over the last 12 years show one thing - that no matter how hard the haters tried to bring her (and Bill) down, they NEVER succeeded.

You go Girl!

David Brooks,the NY Times's house conservative. Conservative, yeah, right. RINO ALERT.
But here's a blast from the past:
Tina Brown Is becoming entwined in the growing controversy over the book by John Connolly she is planning publish that, is filled with sexual slurs and gossip involving those who challenged the Clinton machine, including Kenneth Starr. Connolly has been spending the cash advanced to him by Talk to explore the personal backgrounds of Clinton scandal insiders. Best-selling author and syndicated columnist Ann Coulter, who comes under the Connolly microscope, said that she was "harassed" after Connolly brought in a private investigator to dig into her background. 'The guy began a program of harassment by calling me at home 6 times a day until I changed my number, sending me flowers, and hiring a private investigator to look into my personal life. I have a copy of the letter his PI sent to an ex-boyfriend of mine, stating that he was hired by John Connolly to look into me.' According to the Washington Post, Disney may be backing off that new book by John Connolly that allegedly digs into the sex lives of Clinton's critics.
Run, Hillary, Run

Even David Brooks,the NY Times's house conservative, says Hillary is smart, respected and well liked by her staff and Senate colleagues, and that "smart people generally do smart things." With Bill as part of a White House twofer, how could we do better?

--"There was no evidence that it ever happened"
--"There was no trial,and it certainly was not sexual harrassment"
--Paula Jones could identify Clinton by certain "distinguishing characteristics" in his "genital area." President Bill Clinton has sent an $850,000 cheque to Paula Jones agreed in the settlement of her sexual harassment case against him. Had the case gone to trial, Clinton could have been compelled to have himself examined and photographed to shed light on that particular claim. Oh,btw,lost his license to practice law in Arkansas and before the Supreme Court.
----------------------------------Here's my favorite line:"Fundamentalists are all about character attacks"--
Yes folks that's right Liberals have never, never, ever used character attacks on a political opponent. Juanita Broaddrick, whom about 80 percent of Americans believed when she accused President Clinton of raping her (how do you like that poll?), is being audited by the Internal Revenue Service . . . Indeed, the IRS' random audit selection process has led to audits of an impressive array of citizens inconvenient to the administration. These include: Elizabeth Ward Gracen (Clinton conquest who helpfully admitted that Clinton did not rape her); Billy Dale (fired in travel office imbroglio); Bill O'Reilly (Clinton critic on Fox News channel); Kent Masterson Brown (brought lawsuit compelling Hillary's health care task force to reveal members); Paula Jones (wrecked Clinton presidency). Paula Jones got her audit letter from the IRS not long after she beat Clinton in the Supreme Court . . . Clinton's IRS has also audited almost every conservative organization you can name. Among them are: National Review, The American Spectator, The Christian Coalition, Citizens for a Sound Economy, Oliver North's Freedom Alliance, The Heritage Foundation, The National Rifle Association, The Western Journalism Center, The National Center for Public Policy Research, Fortress America and Citizens Against Government Waste.
But remember:"Fundamentalists are all about character attacks."
In the words of Marc Rich,"Pardon me."

I have to respond to this one becaue this is a case of someone who cannot think for themselves. This person obviously believes everything that the right says.

"A public servant who drops his draws in front of a state worker in a hotel room"

This was investigated before Clinton ever ran for president. This is a character attack. There was no evidence that it ever happened.

"then propositions an intern the first day he met her, then lies to a grand jury during a sexual harrassment trial."

There was no trial, and it certainly was not sexual harrassment. Ken Starr was supposed to look into the White Water affair. When he couldn't find anything, he kept pressing. Clinton was never completely asked about what happened with Monica. The deposer beat around the bush -- refusing to ask a straitforward question. A few sentences from the deposition taken out of context, and we have a public opinion winner. Clinton was unbeatable, and the republican's couldn't handle it. Clinton was called by the Bush admin before he threw his name in the hat to advise him about the character attacks that they would use if he decided to run.

Fundamentalists are all about character attacks. Bush is a fundamentalist, make no mistake about it. A good portion of America has shown a disability to think for themselves and believe the junk that the repubs throw out about people. If I had to put a face on the repblican party, I say Pat Robertson.

Funny how the Democrats think Condi is a Bush puppet when Condi is the reason why the Bush Adminstration has changed from being aggressive and more tuned toward diplomacy. Can anyone tell why the Time magazine cover of a Stetson Cowboy hat was used to show the end of Cowboy Diplomacy? Powell undermined President Bush, and was not part of the power team. Now that Condi is equal to or maybe more powerful than Cheney, someone thinks Dick can get rid of her? That is a Dem joke, right? Dick Cheney is never going to undermine Condi and keep his job. In fact, if President Bush wanted to get rid of Cheney, he would do it and make Condi his Vice Prez.
Condi has the president in her pocket, so I think President Bush is listening to Condi more than the Democrats dare give her credit for. It is easy to call someone a puppet, but the Dems have zero evidence to back up their claim.

RapidRoy, as an AFRICAN AMERICAN FEMALE, I can tell you for sure that if Condi and Hillary were competing against one another for the White House, Hillary would get my vote without a doubt...in my opinion Condi is simply Bush in brown except she's very intelligent...unfortunately she's unable and/or unwilling to make and independent decision on any issue unlike Powell who made decisions based upon principle. All of her decisions are made based upon keeping in line with Bush's agenda...kill and let be killed without questioning...

the gift that keeps giving- as a hard core conservative I don't know what is more exciting for 2008? John Kerry, Howard Dean, Billary, John Edwards or maybe the reverend jesse- I can't wait!

The fact that all of them have a lenghty track record that the non- washington post media won't ignore is even better- don't forget Christopher Reeves would have been walking if it wasn't for republicans- spoken like a true sick trial lawyer who hopes to find enough dumb people for the jury system - what a joke - he needs to focus on his wifes weight

Dear Concerned Citizen, there is zero evidence of VP Cheney going after Condi. For one thing, President Bush stands by her completely and gives Condi full credit on every diplomatic plan today (a softened tone rather than shoot-from-the-hip).

Cillizza mentioned the Gallup polls, so let's look at the most recent (June 26-29, 2006) showing some interesting numbers:
Acceptability as the 2008 presidential nomination
John Edwards 71%
Hillary 69%
Gore 68%
John Kerry 59%

Un-Acceptable is also interesting:
Edwards 25%
Hillary 29%
Gore 31%
Kerry 40%

It would appear as if Kerry is seen as a tired old has-been who failed to defeat Bush in 2004. If the Dems go with him, he will be another Adlai Steveson (a two time loser).

"because if you think for one minute these guys aren't doing it for the money your an idiot"--
Captain Renault: I'm shocked, shocked to find that gambling is going on in here!-http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Casablanca_(movie)# Captain_Louis_Renault---
Yeah, right, they are doing it for the little man---http://abcnews.go.com/Entertainment/wireStory?id=1809029

--"news from extreamest who thinly disguise their point of view as news with no room for a different view" --
Well how about 'a "rigid and blind" defense'
Lets go to the videotape from an "objective news source" -- http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2005/01/10/national/main665727.shtml

This is the first time I've done this, but I felt compelled to answer the last comment. "Clinton certified a moron by a well known doctor". What is wrong with us, this was a great country and now we get our news from extreamest who thinly disguise their point of view as news with no room for a different view. Americans watch this one sided view liberal or conservative with no room for opposing thoughts so that perhaps we can make up our own minds.
Listen, Clinton cheated on his wife not the American public. Bush may or may not be loyal to Laura, but he is cheating all of us. How can you justify not supporting stem cell research yet when asked how many Iraq's have died say "oh about 30,000". This president is a former coke head and alcoholic, who was a C student in Yale, and has failed at every job he has held. He is ruining this country. We are leaving our children a mess. And frankly, Anne Coulter, OReily all of them, would be preaching liberal dogma if that was the party in power, because if you think for one minute these guys aren't doing it for the money your an idiot.

Lets compare and contrast Professor Anita Hill with the "Free Lisa Myers" button:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/special/clinton/stories/media022099.htm

GW is the first Prez to be called stupid even before he won the Republican nomination in 2000 by the so called mainstream media. We have forgotten that President William Jefferson Blythe Clinton was certified a moron by a well known doctor:
http://www.tribuneindia.com/1999/99sep04/world.htm#8

*****THUS HAS NOT BEEN EDTED FOR SPELLING AND OR GRAMMATICAL ERRORS****

THE BLACK YALIE ASSUMES NO RESPONSIBILITY FOR YOUR DISCONTENT OF THIS ENTRIES CONTENT

Joe voter...Sorry for the grammatical mistakes, but I'm typing on a BlackBerry and sometimes I am rushing. But I'll make sure all syntax will be doubled checked. I know there are "rich" people in Harlem, but not on 118th and 2nd Ave. Now please tell me you live in Harlem or come to Harlem often, because there's a place called Jefferson Housing Projects (Jeff) that has tons of people that are millionaires and would welcome you and your opinions on our block anyday of the week. Now on 148th and St. Nick and the 150th's there are quite a few black elite that reside there, and even many white people are starting to buy there. In face one of my poli-sci (forgive the spelling) prof's is buying a Brownstone in Harlem this fall. But I would like to see him and you on 118th. I'd pay actually to see you guys mingle w/ the well to do's on my block!

KCID (read it backwards)

To Nor'Easter, thnx for sticking up for me ( I think) if all you can do is hang me up on spelling and gram errors, then it must really be slim pickens....at Yale we have a writing center that picks through our papers for errors as such. But Joe Voter is Joe Voter. I do not plan on p*ssing away any opportunity afforded to me and I do plan on attending Yale Law School (YLS) in the fall of '08. Currently, I am rehabbing(sp) my knee and taking it easy. Blowing out your tire does suck but it could be worse....I could be at Brown or Harvrad (lol) I kid..I kid....Make no mistake, Yale is great for me but it is a weird place which takes some getting used to. In the end however, I doubt I'll be a victim of anything except a cheap shot from this "rich" kid on my team. But I do not complain (he tore his ACL versus Cornell). All I intend on doing is getting my JD and making a decent living for me and my family. Just because I truly believe there will NEVEr be a black president doesn't mean I'm going to jump on the Jesse Jackson bandwagon. I'll probably be a multi-million dollar litigator and join the Republicans (kidding Nor'Easter). But until then, I'm just a gimpy ex-corner back at Yale using my brain to get by. So take your shots at Yale, there's a reason that 10,000 people apply and 600 people get in!

Malik T.

Very well said, William Pugliese. I still believe that if George W. Bush can
"rule" with 30 something percent approval, Senator Hillary Clinton can certainly lead with that same 30 number "hating" her. That leaves a majority who will truly appreciate having a competent, experienced leader, respected around the world. These times are too perilous to have anymore so-called new guys who do "on the job training" for president. To me, George W.'s best reference was his dad, George Sr. He just "fell a whole lot further from the tree." Ruth Crocker, Garland, TX.

Very well said, William Pugliese. I still believe that if George W. Bush can
"rule" with 30 something percent approval, Senator Hillary Clinton can certainly lead with that same 30 number "hating" her. That leaves a majority who will truly appreciate having a competent, experienced leader, respected around the world. These times are too perilous to have anymore so-called new guys who do "on the job training" for president. To me, George W.'s best reference was his dad, George Sr. He just "fell a whole lot further from the tree." Ruth Crocker, Garland, TX.

Very well said, William Pugliese. I still believe that if George W. Bush can
"rule" with 30 something percent approval, Senator Hillary Clinton can certainly lead with that same 30 number "hating" her. That leaves a majority who will truly appreciate having a competent, experienced leader, respected around the world. These times are too perilous to have anymore so-called new guys who do "on the job training" for president. To me, George W.'s best reference was his dad, George Sr. He just "fell a whole lot further from the tree." Ruth Crocker, Garland, TX.

Hmmmmm! So, we are to believe the Gallup organization and the Washington Post in that their polls were conducted fairly, scientifically without any bias whatsoever? Yeah, right! Whatever! If this thread is representative of a cross-section, or slice of Americana, concerning either of the Clintons, then Hillary should just focus on staying on as a Senator and forget about chasing the Presidency, especially with Condoleeza Rice keeping everyone at bay with her decision. Regardless of party affilization, Rice would get a large part of the minority vote if she ran.

This just speaks to what we already know about the Clintons, that a large portion of the public has an intractably negative attitude regarding them but that a clear majority of the American people hold them in a favorable light. Anyone that doesn't think Hillary Rodham Clinton can win the White House doesn't know politics. Her reelection operation to date, and the groundwork she and Bill have been laying toward 2008, has been masterful. And you cannot overstate the importance of having a woman that has been through two other brusiing national campaigns and two high profile Senate elections under her belt as the Democratic nominee. Hillary Clinton is going to have the best financed, best run political appartus that any Democratic has assembled in modern times behind her. There is simply no one in the Party that can deny her the nomination. And I can only think of one Republican (John McCain) who she may not be able to beat in a general election.

People want change in America. Although the Clinton's have semi-good favorable ratings people want change. They do not want to see Bush, Clinton, Bush, Clinton. They want to see someone with strength that is not the same from these Presidents and candidates. They want to see hope something Democrats like John Edwards can bring to the table. I hope and pray Edwards wins the nomination because I know he has what it takes to win the nomination and turn around this great country.

Actually, karen, you are a sorry excuse for a woman.

please nominate Warner...PLEASE. I love Hil, but I want to win for once...besdies I prefer Warner on Penn. Ave. on policy alone.

Odd how Clinton never got a majority of the votes for president. Could never crack 50%. Yet, we are told Gallup knows 65% of the public who loves him.

A public servant who drops his draws in front of a state worker in a hotel room, then propositions an intern the first day he met her, then lies to a grand jury during a sexual harrassment trial is a lowlife. Hillary could have been president if she had dumped the bulb nose and told women everywhere don't stay with an idiot for the money or the career. She didn't, so she fled to left-wing NY and gets elected. She will never be president. She is a horrible campaigner, and can't cry when Mark Warner or John Edwards isolate her from her handlers. She is a sorry excuse for a woman.

You're right, probably about dub's reaons and his feelings about dad--I'm sure cheney was really the one doing it for the oilcos--junior has never worked for anything, he knows he'll inherit it all [and it won't be taxed!]. cheney's got to make it on his own--and he has! $90 million in war profits already!

If there's one good thing that's come out of this Administration it's the awakening of the Demo Party (oh, Joe Voter check my spelling I may not have gotten that right-get real, the guy is "STILL" attending Yale...Let's carry this passion into the upcoming election period and get stronger for '08, because Lord knows this country cannot survive another 4-8 years of GOP leadership...And to Drindl, I agree with everything that you said with the exception of one statement; in Dubya's own words he didn't get us into this WMD(has anyone found them yet??)mess to better the bottom line for oil company CEO's--at least not primarily. According to him, it was "because Saddam tried "to kill his daddy." What does that say about his concern for all the children out there who have "actually" lost their daddys, mommies, brothers and sisters to this senselessness...God Bless America--and "I" mean that...

I'm going to take a bit more space here than I normally to do, to comment on a couple of things.

Drindl - My comment on Clinton was limited to your excusing his transgression as "between him and the missus."

Sorry, but when you are President of the United States people legitimately hold you to a higher standard than a lounge lizard. What if Lewinsky had decided to blackmail him? Have you ever thought of that? That had implications for every citizen in the country. The spectacle that followed was just as unethical in its own way, as so many of the "Rule of Law" proponents stretched or ignored the law for their own vengeful political purposes.

I don't disagree with you on the differences between Clinton and Bush. One lie to save yourself and family embarrassment doesn't compare to the lies told to take a country to war. You should copyright "Rolling catastrophe!"

RMill - thanks for the personal take on Clinton. I want to clarify my comments about him not being a "leader." They were not meant to indicate that he hadn't done good work. I use a shorthand definition I saw years ago in The Post, where leaders were defined as people who have a sustained following; not just admirers. In his own way, Gingrich was more of a leader than Clinton, until he did himself in. Reagan led a movement; Clinton has admirers.

Joe Voter - Cut the Yale guy some slack. First he's still in college, and second spelling and grammar mistakes should not be used to zing a post. Although I did enjoy your riff on "Rich in Harlem."

I didn't intend for this to get strung out into a Bhoomes/Drindl spat. My point to him was meant to be that he has a golden opportunity to learn at Yale, but his comments indicated that he already had a closed mind.

There are a number of leaders in the black community (similar to the leaders in the old Segregationist community, ironic isn't it) who derive and sustain power from their followers by keeping those people in the past. The School of Victimization so to speak.

If he graduates from Yale still believing that a black man or woman (please not Condi) can't be elected President, then he will validate that old United Negro College Fund ad, "A Mind is a Terrible Thing to Waste!"

Which will be a shame, because at Yale he will have the opportunity to get the education and make connections which will allow him to do positive things in either the private or public sector that few of the rest of us could ever dream of. Few people will ever come close to the opportunities he will have, and he will squander those if he continues to buy into the victim philosophy. My favorite graphic example of that is Jesse Jackson, Sr. picketing the Baltimore Orioles offices for not hiring African-Americans while Calvin Hill (Yale Class of 1969) was a Vice President for Administrative Personnel for them, and Frank Robinson may have already been the team's manager by then. The point: Jackson wasn't selling progress; he was selling discontent, which brought attention and power to himself.

Having ACL and MCL damage myself, I feel sorry for him if it cut short an athletic career. Most likely other doors are open to him that would not have been there if he was occupied with athletics. Let's hope he sees them.

As to the "meeting," my grand Wizard (Abe Pollin) sends his regards.

No mention of Hillary buying senate votes with those presidential pardons,lying to federal investigators,getting the whitehouse travel employees fired so her pals could be hired,those missing law records,the healthcare disaster(that was more Pres.Clintons fault for giving a program that involved 7% of GDP to an incompetent person).The list of why plenty of people dislike Hillary goes on and on.If you want Republicans in the Whitehouse for another 4 years or more vote for sleazary,I mean hillary.

paul: Your comment says what I try to say and am not to good at. Thanks.

What is more important to the united states of america? a president who does not have an extra marital affair or one who actually UNDERSTANDS AND RESPECTS the U.S. Constitution? Hopefully both but between the two I take Clinton over Bush any time.

Bush does neither understand nor appreciate the fine balance build into the constitution and with the help of darth vader ( aka cheney) , rumsfeld, rice and gonzales is subverting the very system they profess to defend.

Um, to the person who talked of all of the lies that Clinton told us, what about all of the lies and laws broken by GWB, not to mention the tens of thousands of lives he has basically murdered because of this unjustified war in Iraq? Yes, Clinton was much worse for getting a hummer from an intern than GWB is for essentially killing tens of thousands of people and squandering hundreds of billions of U.S. tax payers dollars over seas while cutting domestic programs!

I love Bubba and Hillary. And in the last 6 years...has made me love them more.

Dear Mr. Black Yalie,

If you are truly a Yale student on a "full academic schlorship [sic]," perhaps you should limp over (with your bad ACL) to the remedial spelling class and review the following words and grammar rules:

privileged
scholarship

Grammar rule: Only capitalize in the middle of the sentence for proper nouns (make sure to ask the remedial center TAs how you tell a proper noun from an adjective). Unless I mistaken and you actually meant "Rich" as in Denise or Frank.

Additionally, there are likely "scores" of "rich" folks in Harlem. You see, since you have failed to define rich, and since Harlem has a population of perhaps tens or hundreds of thousands of the millions residing in New York, it is likely that at least forty of them (or two score, or scores) are indeed "rich," regardless your definition of "rich." In fact, it is likely that at least forty people in Harlem have the surname of "Rich," and thus qualify as "scores of Rich folks in Harlem."

Enjoy your time in summer school!!

Joe Voter

Black Yalie wrote:

Sure that would make me prejudiced due to the fact that I pre-judged you and or made assumptions...just like you pre-judging and assuming that I come from a privelidged background like Lani, without knowing that I used to play football for Yale (torn ACL) and am on a full academic schlorship....not too many priviledged folks from 118th and 2nd Ave (Harlem USA)!

Oh but I guess it's me crying the blues and there are scores of Rich folks in Harlem right?

We'll agree to disagree...tell me how that meeting goes...

Off-topic sort of, but for the Condi fans out there--Cheney is going after her with the long knives... and once she's gone [which should be just around election time] they'll start BOMBING IRAN. Endless war, that really is what they want. They feed on death.

>

Sue, please tell your son thanks for serving--and I commend you for raising a brave son. I hope he does not have to go back to the hellhole of Iraq. I have cousins who are career military and they are astonished at how badly they have been treated by their own country in the years since these criminals have been in power.

When I hear them talk about 'supporting the troops' I just want to vomit.

Drindll, thanks, you said it exactly right, my dad fought at the Battle of the Bulge, my husband served in the Navy, my son did two tours of the gulf in the Marines, so Bush puts the complete idiot Larry Craig in charge of Veternas affairs! He is totally incompetent and our military who have given and sacrificed so much are being totally screwed when they come home. You would be aghast to learn that some widows whose husbands died in Iraq back in 2003-2004 and so on, still have not received benefits. The country that doesn't take care of it's military men and women who have sacrificed is no better then the country they invaded, in my opinion. Bush can run around the country shooting photo opps with wounded soilders and kiss their babies,and wear his little flight jacket trying to look macho, but as far as him Cheney, Rove and the rest of these neocrates go, all they no how to do is make war, they certainly don't give a monkey's butt what happens the day after, to either side. The Rove PR machine that trys to make these guys out as patriots should be thrown in jail! I for one believe that the reason Bush hasn't reacted swiftly to the fighting in Israel, is because he wants an all out thrid world war! For him and Cheney get off on stuff like this, it's power plain and simple. Yes Israel has a right to defend itself, but this has been going on for close to 3000 years, does anyone truly believe these countries will ever live in peace?
Unfortunately, what Bush started in Iraq will continue on and our soilders and the common guy on the street in Iraq will pay the price. Iraq will soon be another terriorist state, it's close to it now and it will make Saddam look like a piker! Yet all we hear out of the Republicans mouths is "we can't cut and run", it took a very long time for people to get fed up with Vietnam, let's not let this WAR go on as long as that one did. Dead is dead, it doesn't matter if there are 50,000 casualities or 2500+, someones' husband, son, dad or wife or daughter will not be coming home. I think the best solution is to have Bush/Cheney/Rove/Rummy/Rice etc., serve two years at the military hospital changing bed pans and cleaning off the stumps of the wounded! Then they can say with a straight face "they served their country"!. Thanks

Drindll, thanks, you said it exactly right, my dad fought at the Battle of the Bulge, my husband served in the Navy, my son did two tours of the gulf in the Marines, so Bush puts the complete idiot Larry Craig in charge of Veternas affairs! He is totally incompetent and our military who have given and sacrificed so much are being totally screwed when they come home. You would be aghast to learn that some widows whose husbands died in Iraq back in 2003-2004 and so on, still have not received benefits. The country that doesn't take care of it's military men and women who have sacrificed is no better then the country they invaded, in my opinion. Bush can run around the country shooting photo opps with wounded soilders and kiss their babies,and wear his little flight jacket trying to look macho, but as far as him Cheney, Rove and the rest of these neocrates go, all they no how to do is make war, they certainly don't give a monkey's butt what happens the day after, to either side. The Rove PR machine that trys to make these guys out as patriots should be thrown in jail! I for one believe that the reason Bush hasn't reacted swiftly to the fighting in Israel, is because he wants an all out thrid world war! For him and Cheney get off on stuff like this, it's power plain and simple. Yes Israel has a right to defend itself, but this has been going on for close to 3000 years, does anyone truly believe these countries will ever live in peace?
Unfortunately, what Bush started in Iraq will continue on and our soilders and the common guy on the street in Iraq will pay the price. Iraq will soon be another terriorist state, it's close to it now and it will make Saddam look like a piker! Yet all we hear out of the Republicans mouths is "we can't cut and run", it took a very long time for people to get fed up with Vietnam, let's not let this WAR go on as long as that one did. Dead is dead, it doesn't matter if there are 50,000 casualities or 2500+, someones' husband, son, dad or wife or daughter will not be coming home. I think the best solution is to have Bush/Cheney/Rove/Rummy/Rice etc., serve two years at the military hospital changing bed pans and cleaning off the stumps of the wounded! Then they can say with a straight face "they served their country"!. Thanks

'It showed a serious lack of personal moral judgment'

Well, that may be, Nor'easter, but couldn't we then have just moved on to deal with the country's busness? No, we had to have a tax-payer financed pornapalozza. We had to have months of salacious, drooling press coverage. I [andmy kids] had to hear about things [thank you, washington post and nytimes] that were none of anybody's business. In great detail.

In short, it was a republican media feeding frenzy, the most slobberingly disgusting and juvenile thing I have ever witnessed.

And how about the 'serious lack of moral judgement' exhibited by the Boy King? Tell me again how many thousands of our kids have come home from his little venture with no arms and legs, with pieces of their faces blown off? For what? A better bottom line for oil company CEO's?

How many people died unnecessarily in Hurricana Katrina? anything Clinton ever did pales in comparison to the rolling catastrophe that is George W. bush.

It appears the Clintons have long been planning for first the husband and then the wife to occupy the Big Chair in the Oval Office. While I find Hillary acceptable on the issues, I can't help but wonder if she can overcome her baggage to achieve their familial goal of a second presidency. That doubt, given the two-term run of a mediocre Republican, is enough for me to support someone else in the Democratic primary. Al Gore, anyone? Or even Mark Warner? It just has to be someone who can win.

Sure that would make me prejudiced due to the fact that I pre-judged you and or made assumptions...just like you pre-judging and assuming that I come from a privelidged background like Lani, without knowing that I used to play football for Yale (torn ACL) and am on a full academic schlorship....not too many priviledged folks from 118th and 2nd Ave (Harlem USA)!

Oh but I guess it's me crying the blues and there are scores of Rich folks in Harlem right?

We'll agree to disagree...tell me how that meeting goes...

Malik T.
Uber Racist & Possesor of Political & Econimical Power
Yale '08

I'm not the biggest fan of Hilary, but when push comes to shove I'd probably vote for her over any Republican for this simple reason:

It will be easier to get the neocon (neo-monarchists?) out of power with an out-of-party transition than if there's just a new face with an "R" next to the name.

The Bush years have pushed the acceptable limits of Presidential overreaching to dangerous extremes. The result is damaging deficits, a more unstable middle east, American troops deployed in a no-win situation, and an overall...dare I type it?...Carter-esque "malaise".

I think it's very possible for Hillary to play off of some overall Clinton nostalgia to her success. Oh...and she's loaded.

I find the parsing of the polls interesting but what is more interesting are Hillary and Bill themselves. I believe that if Bill Clinton were allowed to run again he would win- and I think Hillary will run and she will win.

We have seen the Germans elect a woman as Chancellor and if they can do it surely we can- even if George Bush doesn't understand respect for women and rubs her shoulders.

Hillary Clinton is one of the smartest people I know. She has set out an agenda that is middle of the road- and she will present that to the public. I believe they will buy it. She will win every state that John Kerry one and will win the State of her choice for vice-president- she won't make the mistake of John Kerry and chose a running mate who can't even win their own State. I think she may chose Mark Warner of Virginia of someone like that. She understands what it takes to win.

I also predict that many moderate Republican women will go vote in secret for a woman. It is time and Hillary Clinton is the one-

I met Governor Bill Clinton in May 1991 at the national DLC convention in Cleveland. I was on the logistics committee for the event. He is a commanding presence and I knew almost immediately that this guy was running for President.

I signed on Dec. 18, 1991, the day after the filing deadline for New Hampshire and Cuomo was out. After surviving the NH primary, I knew immediately that Clinton was the going to be the nominee.

I did field in NH PA NY and of course Ohio, where I was in charge of young Dems and College coordination. The amount of young people getting involved as off the charts.

Then I met Hillary. The two of them together in a room were just overpowering. I am not gushing here, they had a chemistry and knew how to use it. In a personal one on one they could win over just about anyone. It was an impressive thing to witness.

His appeal is broad, regardless of his personal behavior. He is to Republicans what Reagan is to us Dems.

Hers is more targeted and focused and she has had to endure more scrutiny than most first ladys and US Senators because she is the GOP lightning rod.

I will make one correction- Bill Clinton could have been one of the greatest presidents. The agenda squandered by his peccidillo's left many of us with severe disappointment, regardless of how we felt about how ridiculaous it was to impeach him for adultery.

As a candidate for President, I can step back and view the pro's and con's of an HRC run and say she probably is not our best candidate.

From a personal standpoint, she remains a dynamic and intelligent person.

Polls aside, I think Hillary is faced with a number of culminating circumstances that will probably push her into running. History and opportunity will draw her in. There has been no better climate to attempt to elect a woman as President in the history of our Country. Will there be better opportunities down the road. Yes, probably. But too late for her. She is driven by her sense of history in this respect.

While things may or may not turn around as far as the mood of the public towards the GOP, right now, the opportunity is pretty ripe to take back the White House. Considering that Cuomo was Gov. of NY when he passed on his chance, she is well aware of the convergence of circumstances and that passing now will probably eliminate her chances in the future.

Checking around for polls, the majority I've seen, seem to vary very little on about 10 to 15 ??. The thing is they ask the same ? over and over again and depending on the area of the country different results will always be there. The Rasmussen one seems more accurate, since it is a running poll.

Bulldog - Nah, I'll just let you go back to the dream world of Lani Guinier, the child of privilege (and a Yalie) who wears the cloak of discrimination.

BTW - You've made some stereotype assumptions in your posts which are incorrect. That would be prejudging wouldn't it; which would make you "prejudiced." But that's impossible isn't it. Or, is it?

Istook vs. Henry in OK Governors race

Run off in OK-5 congressional

Istook reached the 50% needed to avoid a run off but Lt,. Gov. Fallin will need to go again head to head with Sen. Cornett. They will be opposed by Hunter who got 64% and avoided a run off in the Dem primary.

Poll Watch
Survey USA
7-24
Fallin 30%
Cornett 25%
Bode 24%
Calvey 9%
Morgan 6%
Roy 2%

Results
Fallin 34%
Cornett 24%
Bode 19%
Calvey 10%
Morgan 9%
Roy 3%

Called race correct- 1 pt
Called top two contenders 1 pt
Missed margin (called 5%; actual 10%)
Called Fallin total (with 4.7% margin of error; called 30% - actual 34%)
Called Cornett total (within 4.7%Margin of error ; called 25% - actual 24%)- 1 pt.

Poll Quality Score- 4.0pts
Quality Pick = 4 pts.
Survey USA avg. 3.867 pts

I am personally somewhat ambivalent about Hillary. I do not think she is anywhere near the extreme liberal that the right makes her out to be nor is she the Republican clone that some in the liberal blogosphere are claiming. But, I hope she is not the Democratic nominee because I do not believe that she can win. Nothing would motivate the Republican base like Hillary on the Democratic ticket. For all the ebb and flow of the polls Chris cited, wait and see where her negatives will be after the Rove machine gets in gear.

Nor'Easter, you must be a real looker and a great Christian to never have thought about being with another person while in a committed relationship or in your marriage...And not to act on those thoughts? You should run for "High Office." Come see me @ Chris C's Blog about Barak....I gave you something you can talk about @ the next Klan meeting...

Malik T.
You Guessed It...
Yale '08

Bill Clinton was one of America's great president's, presiding over an era of peace and prosperity, in some ways to a degree unparalleled in world history. The so-called "scandals" were just Republican attempts to waste the nation's time with trivia; they were obsessed with the power of the Oval Office rather than conducting the nation's business. That is still true. Like Tamany Hall of old, the Bush Republicans see the government simply as a source of jobs and handouts for their friends, no matter how many lives or hundreds of billions of dollars are wasted.

The nation's obsession with the Presidential penis reflects poorly on the media and the opportunistic, hypocritical, and dishonest politicians who made an issue of it, but not President Clinton himself.

The thing that worries me is the repugs really do like to get out and vote, and the jury is still out on the dems doing the same...Shrub's re-election was a testimony to that..That is why Hillary in '08 scares the hell out of me..Polls and surveys not withstanding the repugs will be out in force in Nov '06 and Nov '08, and gawd help us if we Dems sit on our hands hoping we'll win....

1) Drindl - "The man had an affair, which was nobody's business but his wife's." Can't buy that.

The reaction was pure political hypocrisy; but the fact is that you had a situation where a person in a position of power took advantage of it, no matter how morally bankrupt the underling may have been. That was a major moral misstep on Bubba's part and took it out of the personal relationship arena.

It showed a serious lack of personal moral judgment; espcially because we all knew about Gennifer Flowers and Paula Jones at the time he did this, and he went ahead and did it anyway.

The Feminists would have been howling to high heaven about sexual harassment, or worse, if it had been a Conservative President who did that.

2) Neither Bubba nor Bush are political "leaders" in the true sense. Bubba has charisma, Bush does also to a much less extent with the "good guy" image, whether it's true or not.

Once out of office they have (will in Bush's case) no significant amount of political followers to lead. They can be visible doing good works, but they are not leaders of a movement such as Reagan was.

Oh Sue in Idaho... right on the mark! However, given the choices right now I think Hillary could turn out to be very solid. Thatcher was... and the rest of the world had no problem dealing with her!

I'd like to see a poll which asks people the following question: Are you "comfortable" with George W. Bush leading your country? You could then compare that with the results of a poll asking the same question about Clinton.

Because most Americans have almost no involvement in local/state/national politics, what becomes important is having a leader who they see as competent, intelligent, and trustworthy to act FOR them. Bush is clearly not that person, but I am still unconvinced that Hillary is.

Thank god there are people in Idaho as fed up as we are in the Northeast.And as far as cheney goes, wish there was someplace even worse to send him. Hell is far too good. There is nothing I regret more than bequeathing my children the wreckage of a formerly great nation.

I find it ironic that anyone could compare Bush to Clinton, Clinton, a rhode scholar and very bright individual who's shortcomings are cheating on his wife, in comparison to Bush, a wanna be bravado who can't talk and walk at the same time! Look, our country is in a mess, the economy is a disastor, unless you are in the top 5% of income earners, or a corporate owner. Regardless of what the "White House trys to portray the middle class and poor are going down the toilet and Bush/Cheney/Rove's hands are on the handle! We have lost many lives in Iraq and Afghanistan, yet these idiots still are running around telling everyone how well things are going and now you have Cheney saying well if the middle east is a mess you need us to stay in power???? When you have a guy raised by a single mom who understands the plight of the common man, compared to someone who's Daddy has given him every job he ever had and every time he screwed up one company, well Daddy's money and influence put him in another. GWB has never had to take responsibility, or won't for anything he has ever done, and those individuals who voted for him think he is MORAL!!! The man believes "God" talks to him, he could care less about the soilders he puts in harms way, about the victims of Katrina, the middle class, and on and on. I do not want Hillary Clinton to run for President, shocked, well I'm a woman and I will tell you why. I have worked in management for many many years, and wheather you like it or not the "good ol boy" mentality prevails. With many foreign leaders to deal with on a daily basis, the fact of the matter is they won't listen to a woman, don't want to deal with a woman and especially in arab countries where women are third or fourth class citizens we would be hard pressed for a woman to even be recognized! Bush has screwed up the world,I feel that because of invading Iraq he has started a domino effect in the middle east that were going to be paying for many years to come!
The biggest problem with Washington is these idiots in office and that's on both sides of the isle believe they have a "lifetime career" when elected. After which they simply line their pockets, their families pockets, their buddies pockets and look the other way when the constitution is being violated. Hillary Clinton is no different, she simply wears a dress to do it. I would like to see Bill Clinton as the head of the U.N. his is diplomatic and smart,, and let's face it those guys need some new blood. As far as Bush goes, all he's worried about is lining his library shelves and having his bank account fattened. It's all about power and money ladies and gentlemen, the likes of Roosevelt, Kennedy, and Lincoln will never be seen again in this country because it's been sold to the highest bidder. God help my grandchildren, they are inheriting the culmunation of greed, and the trails of destruction left by one of the biggest fools in the white house in american history! Let's at least elect someone who has "read the constitution" and understands it to be more then a "piece of paper", as far as Cheney goes, may he rot in hell!Thanks fed up in Idaho

This is to whoever monitors this blog. If your posting standards do not include prohibitions against posting whole articles from other sources, rather than a brief description and a link, then they should. If the posting standards do contain such a prohibition then the vast majority of material posted by "che" should come off.

I am willing, even appreciative of the opportunity, to read through screensfull of material that anyone has written.

I resent postings that are screens long with verbatim reprints and not even on point.

Yes, maybe some people do like Clinton because they're tired of a man who manages to be incompetent and messianistic at the same time-- someone who is trying really hard to start WWIII to bring on the rapture.

' Imagine having all of the Clinton Era scandals dredged up ' --the non-existent Clinton scandals, the made-up, manufactured, non-existent Clinton scandals? The $70 million-dollar, paid for by taxpayers, republican lynch mob?

The man had an affair, which was nobody's business but his wife's. The rest of it was a lynching party started by Richard Mellon Scaife and called The Arkansas Project. It was a treasonous attempt to bring down a president. But what it did [that and a republican congress also dedicated to bringing him down] tied his hands and kept him from dealing with terrorism.

Remember Tom DeLay saying on the floor of the House that terrorism was no big deal? And so we got 9/11. That was the real Clinton scandal--the disgusting actions of the republican party.

And then there's this--
'Meanwhile we have a president who does what he believes is right and best for us'

Yokels. This country is filled with credulous, simple, brainwashed idiots. He does what's best for his rich friends, you moron. wake up.

So results don't matter to you? Is that the bottom line? Our current president claimed to be acting as the hand of God while he lied repeatedly to get us into a war of choice in which thousands of our troops and Iraqi non-combatants have died, and his excuse was and still is that he knew what was best for us because he was acting on orders from God.

Clinton lied to get himself out of trouble for having oral sex with an intern. How in the world can you suggest that the two are morally equivalent, much less that Bush has acted more honorably or laudably?

Of course the American people like Clinton. He governed well and wisely, and he never, ever pretended like God or destiny was on his side while lying to the public.

Look. I am no devotee' of Bill Clinton in the way George W. Bush's supporters so devoutly lust after his hiney. But, the simple truth here is that Bill was bigger, smarter and far better looking than Bush. And, notwithstanding this silly mythology about who would make a better drinking partner in a bar, my read is that Bill would best Bush there as well.

Most of the mythology about Bush being a "regular" guy was driven by Bush's image makers and by a compliant media. The truth is that Bush is never comfortable in settings with regular people at all. He is stiff, thinskinned, furtive and suspicious, judgemental to the point of being preachy and far too convinced of his own charm ( A facet of his personality that was thoroughly absent until he became President, which implies that "charm" is simply automatically conferred on anyone who inhabits the Oval Office.)

No. Bush is not the charmer. Bill Clinton is the charmer. Only Bill Clinton could act so disgracefully in the Oval Office and still come out with approval numbers that Bush would kill for.

Come to think of it, he is killing for higher poll numbers.

It is extremely unsettling to know all these years later that the general American public favors either Clinton. "But Bill was charismatic" is what I hear from a supporter, completely dismissing all the lies he told, throughout his campain and his presidency. It was clear on his inauguartion day what Hillary's plan was and it has nothing to do with what's best for the American people, unless of course it gives her more power.

Meanwhile we have a president who does what he believes is right and best for us, and all he gets it jeering and nitpicking about everything he says and does. Where's all the articles about Hillary misquoting Lincoln at her last speech? Why aren't you picking apart her blunders? If W had said it you'd be having a field day.

The general American public, encouraged by the so-called mainstream media, has become morally corrupt, sniveling grade school spoiled brats. Our forefathers would be ashamed.

What the polls tell us is that most don't pay attention unless there is scandal or big event. Polls viewed out of sync with current events lose relevance.

Are others besides me suffering from Billary burnout? I think Bill did an overall good job as president.... but enough with dynasties, North American Union, One World Order, globalism.... I'm looking for a fresh face who will put the U.S. citizen first. Billary, Jeb, Condi and their ilk aren't it.

http://whathappenedtomycountry.blogspot.com

I sincerely hope Hillary Clinton does not get her party's nominaton. Imagine having all of the Clinton Era scandals dredged up .Egads. Enough already

Who has helped the country and it's peoplle more as Prez ... surely not W,
Clinton feels the peoples pain and W, just doesn't care. Repubs are proud to say we won .... but who is actually winning ...surely not the American people

A simple fact - the only two anti-queer federal laws were both signed into law by none other than Billy Boy CLinton - Don't ask don't tell, and defense of marriage act.

I liked Bill - he understand being responsible on the budget unlike nimrod- could you imagine nimrod shutting down the government to balance the budget?

The idea that any american supports passing the presidency back and forth between two families eats at my soul.

Now here is the perfect ticket - Clark/Obama = yes I have abandoned Richardson -

Bobby Wightman-Cervantes
www.balancingtheisses.com

How does Bubba compare with W in the polls? Wasn't there a recent hypothetical poll that had Bubba winning big in a head to head matchup with W?

1. The word "parse" related to politics rather than grammar came into usage during the Clinton/Lewinsky affair (pun intended). I am sick of it. A little originality of thought and language would be appreciated.

2. Who cares what the Clintons' poll numbers are? They are both utterly irrelevant. Bill Clinton, as somebody famously remarked, is the best Republican president this country ever had, but he's history now. Hillary is just another pandering, power-mad politician who will do or say anything to be president. I'm sick of the pair of them, too.

Ed Cashin: You are stating my feelings all along in this discussion. The polls are quite telling through the many years.

Hillary's the greatest.