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As all of this is aired, the main question which each of us should ask is are the politicians acting to unite us as a moral nation, or they deviding us and undermining our laws and our constitution? Honesty is always the best policy, and our current attitude of strife and division has all but destroyed the nation. Until we can view the issues with reason and respect for others rights and share with our fellow Americans and engage in honest debate to find the best course for us, we all lose, TOTALLY!

TO'' ANY ONE FROM TENN.THAT VOTES FOR
BOB CORKER IS JUST LIKE [ BUSH ] HE HAS
DONE HIS BEST TO GET THE WHOLE WORLD
FIGHTING, HE COULD NOT GET ELECTED DOG-
CATCHER IN GEORGIA' ANY-BODY THAT WOULD
PUT OUT A ADD LIKE I JUST SEEN ON T,V,
IS ABOUT AS LOW AS YOU CAN GET, IF HE
TALK ABOUT MY FAMLEY; LIKE HE DID ABOUT
FORD'S ME AND HIM WOULD GO TO THE WOOD
SHED''

McCain-- Giuliani-- Gingrich--three frontrunners--their commonality : they are all philanderers. If any of these hypocrites is nominated-- he will lose. If that is possible given that I believe the republicans plan on stealing the election and there is ample evidence that is exactly their plan-- Rep. Conyers and most democrats in Ohio know. Too bad the "press" seems to be oblivious!

Zouk

You really want to do this?

13. Bob Barr, (R-Ga)
Sponsored the anti-gay Defense of Marriage Act, saying "The flames of hedonism, the flames of narcissism, the flames of self-centered morality are licking at the very foundation of our society, the family unit." Was married three times and while married to his third and present wife was photographed licking whipped cream off of strippers at his inaugural party.

12. Robert Bauman (R-Md)(1989)
Republican congressman and anti-gay activist, was charged with having sex with a 16-year-old boy he picked up at a gay bar.

11. Dan Burton (R-Ind)(1998)
Republican Congressman who, while married, fathered a child by another woman.

10. Helen Chenoweth, Congresswoman (R-Id.). In 1998 she called (in a campaign ad) for Bill Clintons resignation saying "I beleive that personal conduct and integrity do matter". Days laters she admitted to a six-year adulterous affair with a married associate.

9. Sue Myrick,(R-NC) (
Congresswoman described herself as a "devout Christian." Committed adultery with a married man.

8. Don Sherwood,(R-Pa) (2005)Republican member of the U.S. House of Representatives. Eventually admitted to an affair with a woman 30 years younger than him, after she accused him of physical abuse and attempting to choke her.

7. Ken Calvert, Congressman (R-Ca), champion of the Christian Coalition and its "family values." In 1993 he was caught by police receiving oral sex from a prostitute and attempted to flee the scene.

6. Ed Schrock, (R-Va)(2004)
Two-term republican congressman, with a 92% approval rating from the Christian Coalition. Cosponsor of the Federal Marriage Amendment, consistently opposed gay rights. Married, with wife and kids. Withdrew his candidacy for a third term after tapes of him soliciting for gay sex were circulated.

5. Dan Crane,(R-Ill)(1983)
Married, father of six. Received a 100% "Morality Rating" from Christian Voice. Had sex with a minor working as a congressional page.

On July 20,1993, the House voted for censure Crane, the first time that censure had been imposed for sexual misconduct.

4. Ron Livingston (R-La)(1998)
On the verge of becoming Republican House speaker when his career was upended by marital infidelities.

Livingston released a statement in December 1998 saying, "I have on occasion strayed from my marriage." The disclosure came on the eve of the impeachment debate involving President Clinton's relationship with former intern Monica Lewinsky. Two days after his admission, Livingston said he would not become speaker; he resigned from the House a few months later.

3. Donald Lukens, (R-OH) (2001) Congressman, was found guilty of having sex with a minor - a girl he was accused of sleeping with since 1985 when she was 13.

2. Bob Packwood, Senator (R-Ore.) Resigned in 1995 under a threat of public senate hearings related to 10 female ex-staffers accusing him of sexual harassment.

1. Mark Foley, (R-FL)(2006)
Resigned after trying to solicit sex from male congressional pages via an instant messenger program.

BREAKING NEWS!!!

Republican Congressman Tom Reynolds is down 50-45 in a new poll from a Buffalo news channel:

http://www.wgrz.com/news/news_article.aspx?storyid=41630

Davis has large independent and elderly support, as well as a 9 point lead among women. This district has always had Democratic potential, and with Davis' personal wealth, the Foley scandal and Reynolds' appearance of a cover-up, the 26th is increasing it's blue shade every single day.

BREAKING NEWS!!!

Republican Congressman Tom Reynolds is down 50-45 in a new poll from a Buffalo news channel:

http://www.wgrz.com/news/news_article.aspx?storyid=41630

Davis has large independent and elderly support, as well as a 9 point lead among women. This district has always had Democratic potential, and with Davis' personal wealth, the Foley scandal and Reynolds' appearance of a cover-up, the 26th is increasing it's blue shade every single day.

Let me finish Denny's lines for him...

"We have a story to tell.."
...that Karl made up for us, all about scaring the voters into submission, and boy-oh-boy, is Karl ever PO'd that this Foley thing is keeping us off-message.

Sound more accurate than the official version?

BREAKING NEWS!!!

Republican Congressman Tom Reynolds is down 50-45 in a new poll from a Buffalo news channel:

http://www.wgrz.com/news/news_article.aspx?storyid=41630

Davis has large independent and elderly support, as well as a 9 point lead among women. This district has always had Democratic potential, and with Davis' personal wealth, the Foley scandal and Reynolds' appearance of a cover-up, the 26th is increasing it's blue shade every single day.

I'm beginning to think KOZ and bhoomes are not real, they are fake rednecks Chris invented to keep us all fomenting at the mouth.

Their intensely ignorant philosophy is downright provocative, almost a cliche in its simple-mindedness.

Hey, its easier for me to believe they are a comical construct than admitting these people are real, that they go out and vote and that they simply hate us, because we rightfully criticize their failed political idols.

And boy, howdy, do they ever hate Democrats, and always with much more passion than they love America.

Surely they can not be real?

This from George Will's column (whom I normally detest for his extreme verbosity); it captures the context well without his usual weakness for $10 words.
"Hastert: "We have a story to tell, and the Democrats have -- in my view have -- put this thing forward to try to block us from telling the story. They're trying to put us on defense."

It is difficult to read that as other than an accusation: He seems to be not just confessing a coverup but also complaining that the coverup was undone by bad manners. Were it not for Democrats' unsportsmanlike conduct in putting "this thing" forward, it would not be known and would not be disrupting Republicans' storytelling.

Their story, of late, has been that theirs is the lonely burden of defending all that is wholesome. But the problem with claiming to have cornered the market on virtue is that people will get snippy when they spot vice in your ranks. This is one awkward aspect of what is supposed to have been the happy fusion between, but which involves unresolved tensions between, two flavors of conservatism -- Western and Southern."

That one bit "...defending all that is wholesome. But the problem with claiming to have cornered the market on virtue is that people will get snippy when they spot vice in your ranks" says it all. If any more 'vice' emerges the D's will capture both the House AND the Senate.

Somewhere I read the Dems for in power for 48 years and got corrupt and were punished for it in 1994. And in the same article there was a mention of Rep's being in power for only 12 years and have gotten corrupt!!! Well, well, well how interesting is that stat. Rep's are faster than Dem's in sleaziness!! Apparently W. was asking where is a George Washington, and Thomas Jefferson,... in that part of the world called Iraq (Woodward's book). Let me ask this, do we have one half of the calibre of a Tip O 'Neil , out there in the democratic party who can take this country forward and put this misery to bed. Newt started this disaster and we have had so many of these then which ironically included Newt himself, I cannot believe we keep falling for this bologna. Sorry, sorry state of affairs in the most advanced country on this planet!

When W. got elected by the supremes in 2000, my first thought was to get far away from the US Of A. Unfortunately, one cannot get up and go when family is involved. Then when W. was sleeping 9/11 occured. He says he does not want to comment on "comments" made by others such as the sleaze Clinton. At least sleaze was paying attention, in spite of everything. He had the solid staff, and he was actually governing the country. Now look, W. and co. have this spin thing going for them. And guess what some americans are still buying his "stuff". Even this latest disaster (Foley), listen to or read what Newt has to say. This abuse of english language needs to stop. Supposedly W. looked very honest to americans in 2000 and 2004. Folks you would too if you are not doing anything but "BSing" about size of Russia and China. What a joke! Republican or Democrat, I will take a sleaze over ignorant, incompetant, immoral, and lying bunch of power hungry turds. Their only job is to spread wealth to their cronies, and I am sure there will be some pay off's some where (look at Cheney's severance package from Haliburton in advance). They are abusing our intelligence with spin and more spin. I hope all Americans wake up and say enough!
Thanks

Beren- Well written!

I can't understand KOZ's "So what! The Democrats did this!" attitude. Is it ok for Republicans to do something vile, because at one time, somewhere, a Democrat has done something viler?

All should be held to the same standard. This time, the Republicans failed that standard.

Guess you haven't been reading all those Abramoff emails to Karl and Karl's executive assistant, KOZ.

kingofzouk,

'stomping on it and eradicating it' doesn't really seem the best description of how the Republicans handled this affair, does it? Seems more like 'sweeping it under the carpet and hoping it wouldn't start to smell until after November' to me. Many _Republicans_ have criticized Hastert and the House leadership over this. I mean even Michelle Malkin has criticized them for it. And can we really say, in the era of Abramoff and DeLay, that Republicans are somehow free of corruption???

I have never understood why anyone who cares about decent government would think that you could diminish the importance of one scandal by showing that someone on the other side of the aisle did something similar once before. Some of you have listed historical examples of wrongdoing by Democrats. Er, in the case of those scandals, you did think there should be accountability, right? So, consistently, you should think that about this situation too, right? And if people covered up for Democrats, they should face consequences, right? So if people covered up for Republicans, the consequences should be the same, shouldn't they?

We do our country a disservice when we fail to criticize wrongdoing by members of our own parties. Frankly, partisanship (on both sides of the aisle) is one of the main enablers of corruption in government.

Thanks,
Beren

"Fordham said one staffer he spoke with remains employed by a senior House Republican leader, but he declined to identify the person.

"Rather than trying to shift the blame on me, those who are employed by these House leaders should acknowledge what they know about their action or inaction in response to the information they knew about Mr. Foley prior to 2005," Fordham said."

According to KOZ ("Dems ignore or protect corruption while Rs stomp on it and eradicate it. you can look it up, as they say") these admissons of guilt over a LACK of eradication happened this past Friday. Golly, why isn't it in the newspaper? Why can't I "look it up?"

Sorry, KOZ, the news is moving faster than you can pontificate. Oh, and Fordham is an obvious Democratic plant, right?

My main point was that Dems ignore or protect corruption while Rs stomp on it and eradicate it. you can look it up, as they say.

Actually, and I know the facts are always painful for you:

Rep. Barney Frank (D-Mass.)
In response to a story in the Aug. 25, 1989, Washington Times, Frank confirmed that he hired Steve Gobie, a male prostitute, in 1985 to live with and work for him in his D.C. apartment. But Frank, who is gay, said he fired Gobie in 1987 when he learned he was using the apartment to run a prostitution service. The Boston Globe, among others, called on Frank to resign, but he refused. On July 19, 1990, the ethics committee recommended Frank be reprimanded because he "reflected discredit upon the House" by using his congressional office to fix 33 of Gobie's parking tickets. Attempts to expel or censure Frank failed; instead the House voted 408-18 to reprimand him. The fury in Washington was not shared in Frank's district, where he won reelection in 1990 with 66 percent of the vote, and has won by larger margins ever since.

This from the WaPo so it is mostly factual, not creative as you tend to be with your facts.

now you see why we don't care much for emperors (your view of yourself). When they are wrong, what redress does anyone have. but you haven't been coronated yet.

do honest and decent guys fix tickets for others using their perogotive? can you find me someone who will do this for me? When will you realize that you don't have all the answers and get over yourself. It seems like you really have very few answers that I have observed.

KOZ -- If you're trying to prove that Congress has been full of sick SOBs for a long time - some of whom were Democrats - you're preaching to the choir. You might want to note, however, that you only picked out Democrats to list when Republicans are listed in the article you cite. Also, you're comparing ALLEGATIONS of sexual abuse (in most of your cites above) with a situation where Foley doesn't deny what he did. Somehow, that seems like apples and oranges to me. Moreover, it's ultimately besides the point. Democrats DID grow corrupt in controlling Congress for 48 years. I don't dispute that for a second. But clearly Republicans have only taken 12 years to follow the same pattern. Dems were already punished in '94 for their failings. It strikes me that this Foley situation is just ANOTHER example of why Republicans need to be cleaned out too.

KOZ, I do not know about several of the incidents you mention. I do know about Brock Adams, Ted Kennedy, and Wayne Hays. These men, and I could care less if Democratic returned them to office or not, are not people I would vote for. Most of the people who are participants on this forum, I am sure, feel exactly the same way. But, with reference to Barney Frank, you do need to be corrected. The boyfriend of Bany Frank was someone who simply lived in his home. Without Mr. Franks knowledge, and this was proven in the investigation, that person established a male escort service that was actually a front for a male prositiution ring. That person also, and without Mr. Frnaks knowledge or permission, took a few telephone calls concerning that business at Mr. Franks home. The business was not run out of Barnwy Feansk apartment! Barney Frank didn't know about it. And, when he did find out about it, he was the person who turned the guy over to the police and demanded an investigation and end tom the prositution ring. Barney Frank was an honest and decent man and in that instance, did exactly what I am expecting of the Republican leadership right now. Hw can you people live with yourselves? You took the service of John Kerry in Vietnam and twisted it into something dirty and poerverted and, now, you people can take a man who does right and twist it into an accusation of wrong doing? Rot in hell!

Judge - did you say evidence. Or were you really talking about innuendo and wishfull thinking by desperate Dems trying to talk about anything but real issues? can you please display the hard evidence? the Dem standard for evidence has been quite slack of late as I'm sure you are aware. Just saying it doesn't make it so.

BTW - stock market at new high. Tax receipts at record levels. Hmmmm. Let me find a way to put a stop to this right away. I know - elect Dems.

KOZ: Any evidence of a coverup by the Speaker of the House in any of those cases? Didn't think so. Try scrolling up before posting information that has already been rendered irrelevant.

Elect Dems and you can expect more of the same. remember:

Whitewater
Cattlegate
Nannygate
Helicoptergate
Travelgate
Gennifer Flowersgate
Filegate
Vince Fostergate
I wonder where those Whitewater billing records came fromgate
Paula Jonesgate
Federal Building campaign phone callgate
Lincoln bedroomgate
White House coffeegate
Donations from convicted drug and weapons dealersgate
Buddhist Templegate
Web Hubbell hush moneygate
Lippogate
Chinese commiegate - Clinton was practically endorsed by red China Update!
Let's blame Kenneth Starrgate
Zippergate/interngate - the Lewinsky affair itself
Perjury and jobs for Lewinskygate - the aftermath
Willeygate
Web Hubbell prison phone callgate
Selling Military Technology to the Chinese Commiesgate
Coverup for our Russian Comrades as Wellgate
Wag-the-Dog-gate
Jaunita Broaddrick gate
PBS-gate
Email-gate
Vandalgate
Lootergate
Pardongate

note to self - One real scandal can be blown out of proportion when there aren't many to go around. consider using the Dem model and having a different scandal every week. then you won't have to do anything about it.

10. Sen. Daniel Inouye. The 82-year-old Hawaii Democrat was accused in the 1990s by numerous women of sexual harassment. Democrats cast doubt on the allegations and the Senate Ethics Committee dropped its investigation.

9. Former Rep. Gus Savage. The Illinois Democrat was accused of fondling a Peace Corps volunteer in 1989 while on a trip to Africa. The House Ethics Committee decided against disciplinary action in 1990.

8. Rep. Barney Frank. The outspoken Massachusetts Democrat hired a male prostitute who ran a prostitution service from Frank's residence in the 1980s. Only two Democrats in the House of Representatives voted to censure him in 1990.

7. Former Sen. Brock Adams. The late Washington Democrat was forced to stop campaigning after numerous accusations of drugging, assault and rape, the first surfacing in 1988.

6. Former Rep. Fred Richmond. This New York Democrat was arrested in 1978 for soliciting sex from a 16-year-old. He remained in Congress and won re-election--before eventually resigning in 1982 after pleading guilty to tax evasion and drug possession.

5. Former Rep. John Young. The late Texas Democrat increased the salary of a staffer after she gave in to his sexual advances. The congressman won re-election in 1976 but lost two years later.

4. Former Rep. Wayne Hays. The late Ohio Democrat hired an unqualified secretary reportedly for sexual acts. Although he resigned from Congress, the Democratic House leadership stalled in removing him from the Administration Committee in 1976.

3. Former Rep. Gerry Studds. He was censured for sexual relationship with underage male page in 1983. Massachusetts voters returned him to office for six more terms.

2. Former Rep. Mel Reynolds. The Illinois Democrat was convicted of 12 counts of sexual assault with a 16-year-old. President Bill Clinton pardoned him before leaving office.

1. Sen. Teddy Kennedy. The liberal Massachusetts senator testified in defense of nephew accused of rape, invoking his family history to win over the jury in 1991.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/special/clinton/congress.htm

Note the number of Dems and the actions that were taken. now note the universal approbriation leveled at foley. See the difference.

If the protection of our children isn't the utmost "family value", then I don't know what is.

Sigh, Bhoomes, you are still talking about partisanship when the children are the issue.

BlueDog, you're an interesting sort...

and bhoomes

'but I suspect she may be a real nice person who cares about animals and others the same as me.'

Thank you. you really do seem like a decent guy. I may disagree with you because I believe you are misled, but you have a heart.

what Foley did is tasteless and he did the honorable thing in resigning and deserves to take his medecine.

But a pedophile? A perv, maybe but thats stretching it a bit I think. The one good thing about the dems holding on to all these stories and launching them all at once is that they're effectively knocking themselves out.

but it is nice to see you get your hopes up ('00, '02, '04....)

Now we get to the crux of it, taxes. Yeah, that's the hot issue today. Hmmm, let's see, low taxes? Yes, which means inadequate funding for enforcement of FDA guidelines, Customs inspections, transportation laws, and virtually NO enforcement of mine safety laws, anti-pollution laws, the list goes on and on. Inadequate funding to provide troops in Iraq/Afghanistan proper armor. Inadequate funding to help national parks recover from devestating natural disasters Inadequate funding for FEMA to help recover from Katrina, inadequate funding for No Children Left Behind. This is YOUR doing by insisting that the GOP is doing the right thing by cutting taxes for the rich, sticking it to the middle class, and ignoring everyone else. My view of the world is based on 10 years of Military servce (USAF), 10 years of Law Enforcement, 10 years of running a small business, all traditional GOP supporters, and this group of chickenhawk NeoCoNazies violates everything those groups stand for, Protect and Serve, Fairplay, Honesty, Integrity. I, and others like me, kept the country safe by bleeding for our country, and now, when we voice our dissatisfaction with the ineptitude of the GOP we're just called bleeding hearts, regardless of what we really are. You do not seem inclined to find out anything about us, just call us names and be done with it, apparently the best you can do, just like your "leaders". I'd love to stay and chat for the rest of the day, but I have to go now. Gotta go watch the GOP self-immolate. Drop us a line when you have something of substance to say.

Where has our Country gone? A President who misled us into a Useless war, who gave Haliburton billions of tax payers money, the contracts were not enough for them, now there is at least ten and a half billion dollars missing, no oversite, accoutability, no investigations, nothing except Bush and Cheney's croonies are again being taken care of via tax payers money, Gee what a surpise. And then the brave men and women who put there lives on the line,over 20,000 who have lost body parts of all sorts. May God bless you all. Now the first lady is at a fund raiser for Tom Reynolds who happens to be one of several Congressmen in the Republican leadership who covered up for this PEDOPHILE. Lord where does the insanity stop. J Filutze

Where has our Country gone? A President who misled us into a Useless war, who gave Haliburton billions of tax payers money, the contracts were not enough for them, now there is at least ten and a half billion dollars missing, no oversite, accoutability, no investigations, nothing except Bush and Cheney's croonies are again being taken care of via tax payers money, Gee what a surpise. And then the brave men and women who put there lives on the line,over 20,000 who have lost body parts of all sorts. May God bless you all. Now the first lady is at a fund raiser for Tom Reynolds who happens to be one of several Congressmen in the Republican leadership who covered up for this PEDOPHILE. Lord where does the insanity stop. J Filutze

I give you credit for spinning things BLUEDOG. Who ins't for protecting the pages from Congressman with less than noble thoughts. With our Republican leadership, we have kept taxes low(not low enough for me)and passed the Patriot Act over dems objections to protect the country. Now I know you probably upset with us because we didn't promise Osama full constitutional rights and didn't close down GITMO. But we have kept the country safe through our policies. If you dems regain the House and prevent common sense legislation for our security and we then suffer another horrendous attack, It WILL BE THE END OF YOUR PARTY. Now I believe you guys love and want to protect the country as much as us but your misguided viewpoint of the world will prevent you from doing that. See your not evil just dumb.

Bluedog, bhoomes, all - I am as guilty of it as the next person, but there really isn't any call for a lot of the negative stuff except to answer it in kind. My memory is long enough to know that it was the Democrats that started this and the divide people into voter blocks nonsense that Karl Rove, more recently, has used so well. What is happening right now is the RNC is dumping huge amounts of money into negative campaign ads and the Democrats (and others) are letting them know that two can play this game. So, expect this election to be so dirty, so vile, reveal so much disgusting garbage and do so much harm to politician's that they will think three or four times in the future about going negative. At least that's my hope.

And bhoomes, the reason I am a Democrat today is because of "globalization". Some readers are correct, I did used to work in intelligence, and I saw just how much damage was being done by outsourcing and the various guest worker programs. It has gotten much much worse. I wonder how many people realize that Indian H1-B engineers stole the complete plans and design for the B2 bomber, for our latest underwater missile system (necessary because an earlier theft of submarine design has led the Russian's and Chinese to build submarines that can outrun our fastest torpedo's), the stole the plans for our latest shoulder launched multipurpose missile, and more. And none of this even addresses what the Chinese have been up to. It's insane. The FBI is simply buried in espionage investigations. There are reportedly more than 1,800 already this year. And these are just cases of military espionage. No one can imagine the number of cases of industrial spying and theft. It's as if we opened up the store and invited the world in, with no one watching, and the entire world is stealing everything off the shelves and is in the process of unbolting the cash register and stealing it, too. I do not think we can "fix" those programs, they have got to be done away with. They pose the single gravest danger to this country we have faced since the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor. The Bush Administration and their corporate allies only see short term gains and believe they can somehow manage this mess. Well, they cannot, it is getting worse, and their incompetence is placing this country's very future existence in jeapardy. THAT is first and formost why I am a Democrat.

The No FEAR Act was signed by Bush in May 2002 and stands for Notification and Federal Employee Antidiscrimination and Retaliation Act, requiring federal agencies to be accountable for violations of antidiscrimination and whistleblower protection laws.

By the way, I obviously mis-spelled House of Representatives in my first post.

Here you go bhoomes-KOZ. Make of it what you can. Only a state senator but pretty salacious.

"W. Va. Lawmaker Embarasssed by Photos
By LAWRENCE MESSINA
The Associated Press
Wednesday, October 4, 2006; 11:52 AM

CHARLESTON, W.Va. -- A state senator said he is evaluating whether to continue his bid for a second term after a Charleston television station aired revealing pictures of him last week.

"My family has urged me not to withdraw from the election and I will work with them to make a decision in the immediate future," State Sen. Randy White, a Webster County Democrat, said in a letter to newspapers in his district."

I have nothing against Republican voters. I think the vast majority are good people who mean well. Maybe a little gullible, but certainly not malicious (generally).

I have a MAJOR problem with Republican politicians. Every single one of them. They have actually betrayed the trust that their GOP constituents have bestowed upon them. To the GOP voters' credit, they have stuck with their party despite being treated like pawns in a deadly game of he said/she said corruption and war.

If only the GOP voters held equally as fast to the ideals of AMERICA the country and not some idyllic pseudo-fascist oligarchy based on extreme Christian fundamentalism.

American people are clearly ready to move beyond the GOP politicians' selfish and childlike behaviour in favor of a sane political platform that is good for the whole country and our image around the world (which, contrary to Neocon partisans, IS important in preserving our ideals of being a beacon of freedom for the downtrodden).

That said, Democratic politicians arent exactly God's gift to humanity... But I trust the policies forwarded by Democratic-minded individuals more than Conservative-minded individuals. Um, obviously. :)

Are pages provided training on the No FEAR Act of 2002 so that they would not be afraid to complain? Is there a Civil Rights Office within the Howse of Representatives?

I'm a left-wing zealot and I think Romney means what he says. I think he believes in doing what's best for Massachusetts and have been a *GASP* good governor, working with both sides. Something I cannot say about Frist, Hastert and Allen.

Bhoomes, actually I take pride in being a Left WingNut. It's what's required to counteract all the Coulter/Reilly/Drudge/Limbaugh insanity. I proudly voted for GHWB, have my share of Rep. friends (moderates and wingers), & don't think them "evil". Easy word to throw around as a distractor when you still haven't said anything about the GOP leadership, or the lack thereof. Are you evil? Nah, you don't have it in you, and it's not likely the crowd you run with does either. But the crop of "leaders" you seem to be suppporting have done evil things, the Foley/PageGate scandal being only the latest. I do consider it evil to protect the party over children.

"Some other Republicans rallied to the speaker. The chairmen of two coalitions of social and fiscal conservatives in Congress said he should not step down. "Speaker Hastert is a man of integrity," Rep. Mike Pence, R-Ind., and Rep. Joe Pitts, R-Pa., said in a joint statement."

Yes, R's can trust him to cover up our misdeeds.

""We need to move forward quickly and we need to reach conclusions and recommendations about who is responsible," McCain said during a campaign speech for Sen. Lincoln Chafee in Rhode Island. "I think it needs to be addressed by people who are credible." "

There goes John McCain again, saying what needs to be said. Bhoomes, let me put your spin on this: Shame on him! Such a grandstander! Never mind that this is the obviously moral course of action!

"Republicans have been struggling to put the scandal behind them, but another member of the leadership, Rep Roy Blunt of Missouri, said pointedly during the day he would have handled the entire matter differently than Speaker Dennis Hastert did, had he known about the complaints when they were first raised last year."

Never thought I'd miss Roy Blunt. I bet the R's agree with me on this one.

"I think I could have given some good advice here, which is you have to be curious. You have to ask all the questions you can think of," Blunt said. "You absolutely can't decide not to look into activities because one individual's parents don't want you to." "

That is a pathetically weak excuse for not minding the business of the US House of Representatives.

Wetterling is playing a dangerous game. You never know when the next shoe will drop or from where. It is the reason that while Qantas never had an airline crash, they never ran ads saying "never crashed". It only takes that one time.

And remember, Foley, until Friday, was a noted child protection advocate (Not saying anything regarding Wetterling, just pointing out you never can tell. I was brought up to trust school teachers and priests too.)

I am glad at least MikeB can say a few good things. BLUEDOG proves my point of what a real wingnut is. A wingnut cannot accept that other people may have a different viewpoint of the World and still be decent people who may be kind to animals, help their neighbors and volunteer to help others. He believe that you must be evil if you don't see Iraq like him. I know Drindl is a real partisan but I suspect she may be a real nice person who cares about animals and others the same as me. Its okay to fight about politics but lets get away from demonizing politicians and people who do not see the world as you. That how Ronald Reagan and Tip O'Niel could really rip into one another during the day and share a drink and a few good jokes in the evening.

Interesting that a staffer has resigned already. It will be interesting to see what Justice comes up with.

Meanwhile local DFL (Democrat) candidate & child advocate Patty Wetterling is using the Foley mess in her race for the MN 6 seat. It will be interesting to see if she tries to pin her opponent down on whether they support Hastert or not. Personally I think Ms. Wetterling should focus on issues more important to voters in MN-6, but clearly this story has some legs, at least for a little longer. It is also rumored that the DCC will be running an ad tying the NRCC, which received a large contribution from Foley, to ads attacking Ms. Wetterling. It will be interesting to see if tying an alleged pedophile's contributions to a group attacking a noted child protection advocate will impact the electorate. More interesting will be if the GOP candidate finally condemns the misleading NRCC ads.

"...Justice Department has ordered all records preserved and indicates that this is in preparation for a criminal investigation."

Which means that this is going to take forever (politically speaking), and the official repsonses will now be, "We can't comment on that because it's part of an ongoing investigation."

Which will, a) be a field day for the conspiracy nuts, and b) have the 4th Estate run the story, which they've been doing up until now, anyway.

Are all the Subjects of Interest practicing their "To the best of my recollection..." responses yet?

bhoomes,

No, I don't think that one side has all the virtue and another has all the vice. Certainly there are some people (on either side) who think that way. Some of the people who criticize Bush, Frist, Hastert, DeLay, et al. would always have criticized them anyway. But there are others, many others, including many conservatives, who are criticizing these guys because they think that they have governed extraordinarily badly. I know people who probably didn't vote for a single Democrat in their lives until partway into Bush's presidency. These people weren't partisan Democrats or something - they were, after all, life-long Republicans. But they thought that refusal to engage in bi-partisan negotiation, refusal to perform adequate oversight of the executive, making misleading public statements, irresponsible spending, as well as stunts like threatening the 'nuclear option' in the Senate, were a betrayal of the principles of good government, whether liberal or conservative.

There are plenty of Republicans that I can say good things about. But it's tough with the ones you mentioned. The reason isn't that I'm partisan (I've voted for Republicans and Democrats in equal numbers). The reason is that the Republicans currently running things in the Senate and the House (and the WH) are some of the worst of the bunch. I'd have trouble coming up with praise for the worst of the Democrats too. I mean, you don't have to be a partisan Republican to have trouble coming up with praise for, say, Dan Rostenkowski. You just have to care about ethics in government.

Thanks,

Beren

bhoomes, I have had good things to say about Republican's whenever I encounter them. I already mentioned Rep. Rodney Alexander. I would add Chuch Hagel and Colin Powell to that list. Good men, honorable people. As for Mr. Allen, though, if I were you I would give him a wide birth, if I were you. And all of the House leadership is in deep trouble. In the case of both Hastert and Boehner and Rove, again, that might well include criminal troubles. Bill Frist and Rick Santorem are going to be up to their eyeballs in "deep doodoo" about this time next week, as well.

Bhoomes, you're missing the point. "On a personal level" is a feeble attempt to rise above the fray. It's personal to me when my friends die in a war that wasn't necessary, it's personal to me when my friends lose their jobs because of "downsizing" while their fatcat bosses get millions, it's personal to me when the policy of the ruling party is devestating to my family, friends, community, state & nation. Of course I don't have anything good to say about the GOP leadership, because I don't care about them "personally", I only care about their policies and how they affect me/us/everyone, and their policies suck. I find it disengenuous to argue "can't we all get along" when the GOP has ravaged the Dem's for years, personalizing attacks. Move on with your points, tell us what the GOP is doing right, tell us how Hastert is leading, tell us anything with substance that supports the GOP's myopic view of the world and how to manage it.

MikeB - "As you well know, every time I assemble a list of web references and send them with a post, they are intercepted and "held"...so they dob't get published."

Thanks for the sources which you do provide; but realize that we don't get to see what you get censored on. The bottom line problem for me in any post is are the sources "credible." It's not unreasonable to ask, so we don't waste input in taking the thread in a certain direction when the primary source isn't credible.

CNN reports the Justice Department has ordered all records preserved and indicates that this is in preparation for a criminal investigation.

Also reports the FBI is interviewing pages.

Well I see you guys proved me right, couldn;t say anything good about our current Republican leadership. I have nothing bad to say about Nancy Pelosi on a personal level, just don't care for her left wing politics. I believe Steny Hoyer is a good man who puts his country ahead of party.(2nd in line behind Pelosi) I like Joe Biden, Russ Fiengold, Chris Dodd and others who are thinking about running. Geez, can zealots say anything good about Allen, Frist, Brownback, Rommney, etc. I doubt it because again you live in a simple world where your side has all the virtue and our side has all the vice. I can disagree with a lot of the dems viewpoints and still like them on a personal level. But most of you guys can't and then you call other people wingnuts. Yeah right.

RMill, God I hope he is, it would mean someone in Government actuallys has courage AND conviction.

FYI

Kirk Fordham is Chief of Staff for Congressman Reynolds (NY-26).

MikeB

Don't be so sensitive. The reason we asked is because we are not lazy clods but could not find any reputable news outlet confirming your assertions is your post. You made it sound like you are a rogue FBI agent leaking information.

Bhoomes: "I defy Drindl, JEP, Yockel and others to say something good about Hastert, Bush, Cheney, Frist, Boehner, etc."

I think I will pass on saying something nice about the Republican leaders named by Bhoomes above, however, I think there are some names that can be included in the "etc." like Congressman Jim Ramstad of MN - who represents Minneapolis' Western affluent suburbs. He is an R in the old Reagan sense of the word - minimal govt, low taxes, fiscal conservative, but a good man, who also happens to be a recovering alcoholic and now-mentor to fellow Congressman in recovery - Patrick Kennedy of RI. Mr. Ramstad has put partisan politics aside in favor of decency and humanity to help a guy who was down and out. If the Republicans put guys like that in leadership, they wouldn't be in this mess. Integrity is still valued in this country. Other Republicans who still have this are the two women Senators from Maine - Collins and Snowe.

Bhoomes: please note that as a Democrat, I am saying nice things about Republicans, something you seem incapable of doing.

Mike, MSNBC is reporting Rep. Livingston's involvement, as well as the resignation of a former Foley/current Reynolds staffer for trying to quash the story. Seems the staffer, Kirk Fordham, went to ABC and asked them not to run the story. He claims he did it to protect his boss from the political storm, not to obstruct justice. Your post has legs. Thanks.

Nice try guys. As you well know, every time I assemble a list of web references and send them with a post, they are intercepted and "held"...so they dob't get published. So,...instead of being lazy clods, why don't you use an internet search engine and look it up. Try "outed Gay Republicans". One site, blog DOT democratics DOT COM SLASH gayrepublicans has a lengthy list of a few of those who are about to be outed. I can't for the response of the christian right when some of their prominent people get listed next week.

Do you think, at gut-check time, that NJ residents will vote for a GOP senate candidate even if that vote might keep the Senate in Republican hands??

That would be truly astonishing.

Fordham just resigned.

No offense, MikeB., but I hope you are wrong about the facts in your post. I wouldn't be surprised if the Rep.leadership simply decided that they didn't want to know what was happening wiht Foley and the pages, and didn't look at it very closely. Plausible deniability. (At least they hoped for that).

I think Beren has largely zeroed in on the GOP's problem.

The Republicans were in charge and everyone knew it. They flaunted their power and kept Dems on the outside and them derided them for not ever getting anything done or cooperating.

In my mock ups of the midterm, if I had to choose numbers today-

US Senate Dems win 6 seats but lose NJ (net +5) for a tie and GOP stays in control.

US House Dems win 29 seats and take control.

Governors Dems win six but lose MI for a net +5 and make up a majority of statehouses.

The legal stuff is from law enforcement. The other...look it up yourself! How many of you knew that prominent Republican's and their media lapsdogs are being outed this cycle? For one on Matt Drdge, try here: http://news.neilrogers.com/news/articles/2004100421.html
Rick Santorum: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=1631638&mesg_id=1631638

This is also intersting:
http://blog.democrats.com/gayrepublicans

You might also look at the GayPatriot, a conservarive gay group, and the Advocate, a liberal gay grouop that has assembled a who's who doomsday list that they are threatening to release.

On the wider issue that Mr. Cillizza raises (whether national disdain for Congress will trump local concerns) I think that the Republicans themselves have made it much more likely that people will vote on a national, rather than a local, basis. It's a result of how they've behaved in Congress.

The Republican party has acted almost monolithic in both houses of Congress, and has failed to engage in serious negotiation with the minority party. Individual Republican congressmen have been far too quick to cave to their party leadership. Democratic amendments (even completely unobjectionable ones) have been rejected on a strictly partisan basis. Congressmen have subordinated their own concerns to the concerns of the national party.

At this point, the Republican party is really acting like it's governing in a parliamentary system. It can only do this for so long before voters start to vote as if they were in a parliamentary system as well.

There have been senators for whom I have high respect from both parties. Same for representatives. But this year, after watching the antics of Congress for the last half-decade or so, I know that a vote for a moderate, thoughtful, conscientious Republican is really a vote for Bill Frist & Co., or their colleagues in the House, who are, in my opinion, a bunch of irresponsible, deceitful, unthoughtful, pandering demagogues. I don't want Frist screwing things up any longer. But the way this Republican Congress has behaved, even a vote for Susan Collins or some other moderate Republican, for whom I might very much like to vote, is really a vote for Frist to keep running the Senate.

Now none of this means that Foley's misdeeds should be imputed to all Republican members of Congress. But it does mean that the Republican party has, over the last few years, been defining itself in national terms. It therefore invites national rejection. I have to say I think they brought it upon themselves.

Thanks,
Beren

RE: Foley Scandal - No Real Surprise
www.IndustrialAgeGovernance.com

The Foley scandal shouldn't be surprising. A cover up was launched much like the Catholic Church protected pedophile priests, principals in positions of power who knew about the problem looked the other way, protection of children received the lowest priority in a mix if competing interests, and even after the last page scandal effective reporting channels weren't installed. Thus, at the highest levels of government the same enabling factors and conflicts of interest exist, only the circumstances are different. One thing is clear, the standard cycle of investigation, new legislation, and telephone hotlines aren't enough. Unless the underlying processes and communication channels are structurally improved, this will surely happen again !

Important issues like these are illustrated in my book, along with specific reporting structures, checks and balances on conflicts of interest, and elimination of information barriers - key measures that would effectively expose pedophiles. But they can only help children once finally implemented.

Today, this is precisely where media and leadership attention is needed the most - examining the underlying factors and fundamental changes that will prevent future occurrences, not simply spinning sensational daily events.

Industrial Age Governance is a must read for journalists, educators, activists, and policy leaders. If you or your colleagues are interested in perusing the galley, I will be happy to forward a free copy.

Wilson@IndustrialAgeGovernance.com

These stories are currently circulating regarding the La. congressman cited by MikeB. I can find nothing about confirmed reports of actual sexual contact that is being asserted above.

The congressional sponsor of the page, Rep. Rodney Alexander, R-La., said he was asked by the youth's parents not to pursue the matter, so he dropped it.

_Alexander said that before deciding to end his involvement, he passed on what he knew to the chairman of the House Republican campaign organization, Rep. Thomas Reynolds, R-N.Y. Reynolds' spokesman, Carl Forti, said the campaign chairman also took no action in deference to the parents' wishes

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/n/a/2006/09/29/national/w123452D40.DTL&type=politics

Rep. Rodney Alexander, R-La., the congressman who sponsored the page at the heart of the furor, said Hastert "knew about the e-mails that we knew about," including one in which Foley asked the page to send his picture.

http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/nationworld/bal-foley1004,0,7634416.story?track=rss

U.S. Rep. Rodney Alexander, R-Quitman, defended House Speaker Dennis Hastert and himself Tuesday even as calls for both lawmakers' resignations came for their handling of the page scandal that cost Republican Congressman Mark Foley his job.

The firestorm broke Friday after reports surfaced that a male page from Monroe contacted Alexander's office about inappropriate e-mails from Foley in the fall of 2005. Foley resigned Friday.

Alexander said his office contacted the teenager's parents and Hastert in the fall and House Majority Leader John Boehner and Rep. Tom Reynolds, the National Republican Congressional Committee chairman, in the spring of 2006.

"We contacted the family and the House leadership on multiple occasions about the e-mails," said Alexander, R-Quitman. "If the speaker didn't know any more than we did, I think his response was adequate."

The page's family had U.S. Rep. Jim McCrery, R-Shreveport, come to Alexander's defense on Tuesday, saying he 'has done everything he thought was appropriate. Rodney is beyond reproach," McCrery said.

http://www.shreveporttimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20061004/NEWS01/610040335

MikeB

But what is your source? Please share.

MikeB, we're asking "where are you getting this stuff from?" It's fine to tell us what you've heard/read/gathered, but please give us your source, or explain why you can't. I'd love it if your information was factual, but verification is needed. Thanks.

Judge C. Crater - Actually, I do. The "rumor" about Foley actually having had sex with underaged children is being confirmed by law enforcement right now. Both the FBI and D.C. police are interviewing witnesses who have come foreward and are actively pursuing leads concerning the threats made against witnesses. A *Republican* Congressman who is leading the charge on this is Rep. Rodney Alexander of Louisiana. He was contacted 11 months ago by a page who had been "inappropriately touched" by Mr. Foley and reported that to Dennis Hastert *personally* that day! He also claims, in a sworn deposition, to have personally told Tom Delay and Roy Blunt of this. There is evidence that this information was passed to the White House and, from there to John Boehner within the past seeral weeks. Someone in that group is responsible for using Rove's dirt meister's to dig up dirt and otherwise threaten the families of the page who broke those to begin with. So, bhoomes and Mr. Crater, this is no longer a "rumor" nor is it a simple story of pedophilia. It is a full scale criminal investigation, involving coverups, witness tampering, and a lot worse. This is Bush's Watergate. We'll see how he and the Republican's handle it. You can already see one moral Republican player, Rodney Alexander, who is going to follow this through wherever it leads. I am going to be interested in how many follow his lead vs. how many side with Hastert, Rove, and the Whitehouse.

CHE, insightful?!?! He was declared a certified troll by the denizens of this blog MONTHS ago, and we all agreed to ignore him.

He posts his self-promotional press release, usually way off-topic, then splits. Never participates in discussion. A nusiance, like a guy who leaves flyers under your windshield wipers. I've even seen him posting his spiels on the Celebritology blog, under entries about Nick Lachey.

While I don't think we should be rigidly staying on topic, there is something to be said for those posters (Colin is one good example) who seem to understand that quality, not quantity, is the key.

I get really tired of hearing the same three or four people carrying on, post after post after post. It drags the quality of discussion way down.

Nilmat
Good catch

The average disapproval is 60.875%

The last 8 polls on Congressional Approval can be found at. You can check my math too.

http://www.pollingreport.com/CongJob.htm

Bhoomes: "I defy Drindl, JEP, Yockel and others to say something good about Hastert, Bush, Cheney, Frist, Boehner, etc."

Lets be reasonable, Bhoomes. When children are in danger then it's time to hold the powerful accountable, not praise them even though they failed to exercise their duties.

By the way, I did say something good about Bob Michel. The relevant fact is not that he was a Republican leader but that he put the welfare of children before partisan advantage. Unfortunately, the opposite is true of Hastert. That's his fault, not mine.

It is sad that you can only see that matter in partisan terms.

Vienna, you're exactly right about the triviality of those old scandals, particularly in comparison to the egregiousness of current events (Iraq NIE, WMD's, etc). Unfortunately for the GOPher's, it's not the historical importance that matters, it's the moment, it's the one final thing that takes the electorate over the top. The Foley/PageGate scandal is now 5-6 days old, long for news cycles and still has legs. It will take another major story to dislodge it, probably not something good for the GOPher's. The seeds of dissent have been growing for a while now and they reap what they sow.

Some good things:

I think Bush has done a good job staying alive so Cheney doesn't officially become President.

I think Cheney has done well not to take Bush duck hunting.

I think Frist served his constituents well by not running again.

I think Boehner did the right thing by sidestepping his responsibility and dropping the Foley matter in Hasterts lap.

I think Hastert does a good job keeping the trains running on time (After all, AMTRAK's major hub is in Illinois).

Just a quick fact check. . . In paragraph #4 CC mentions an average disapproval rating for congress of 68.75 and then, in the next paragraph notes that the highest disapproval rating is 68, in the AP-Ipsos poll. I'm thinking that the average is incorrect. Maybe it's 58.75?

BTw, bhoomes, I've never heard you say anything good about democrats...

you want me to say something nice about dick cheney, say somehing nice aobut nanci pelosi...

"I defy Drindl, JEP, Yockel and others to say something good about Hastert, Bush, Cheney, Frist, Boehner, etc."

I honestly can't think of anything. I'm not saying all republicans are bad, altho at this point i would haave say anyone who still identifies R utterly baffles me...

but what have any of these peoople done well, or in the public interest? absolutely nothing. It's like saying, say something good about Stalin or Mussolini...

At least with Musolini you got the trains running on time, as they used to say.

But these people can't even do that...

Lets not forget that, with few exceptions (Fox, SInclair and Clear Channel) this Cheney administration has been overtly hostile to the press, even though they paid them well for advertising.

So don't expect any sypathy from those newsrooms, the neocons might be popular with the advertising department, but that's a different set of sharks than the ones in the newsroom.

When yhose soon-to be-revealed "secrets" hit the presses, there WILL be a feeding frenzy, just look at the past week.

What are today's headlines?

Foley is everywhere.

Bhoomes, your hypocrisy slip is showing. When, if ever, did you say something good about either Clinton. Does vigorously disagreeing with the EXTREME element of the GOP mean I'm not an adult. If anything, I think it takes maturity and courage to oppose a fascist state. It's very easy to roll over and agree with one's "leaders". It's much harder and requires actual thought to disagree and articulate that disagreement. Why don't you tell us what the Hastert leadership doctrine is, instead of what it appears to be?

Judge, events like this tend to spin out of control, as the MSM takes advantage of a moneymaker. Does anyone really think more revelations won't occur? Stories that would have been ignored or hidden in the last few years by the cowardly MSM will now get some attention. Bush bashing and GOP bashing is okay now, as the sheer volume of hypocritical behavior is proven beyond the ability of GOPher's to counter and damage the MSM. If the MSM can make money off this and other stories, and they are making a mint right now, some board executive is going to say, "The he** with partisanship, print that sucker!".

Remember, in November, don't vote for anyone with that "R" rating!

"I defy Drindl, JEP, Yockel and others to say something good about Hastert, Bush, Cheney, Frist, Boehner, etc."

They will soon be out of power?

That's pretty good.

I suspect bhoomes remembers Bob Michel as a liberal Dem. And compared to winguts like KOZ and bhoomes, he is.

The House Bank and Post Office "scandals" were interesting in that their actual political ramifications greatly outweighed their relative triviality. The Gingrich gang were able to put together a bunch of nice sounding platitudes (yeah, how much of that still exists, I wonder?), churn out the Contract on America, use the "scandals" to paint the Dem majority as out of touch (which quite a few of them were), and unseat a 40-year old majority.

It appears that in the space of 12 years, the Republican majority may also go that way, and even without much cohesiveness of argument on the other side. Craven, supine, and hypocritical are not three adjectives you want associated with your party if you're a majority member of the House these days. And yet, that's just where they are.

Look I said Foley was a slimeball and I am glad he is gone even if it means losing the majority. So I wouldn't be surprised if he did like Studs have sex with an underage page. I read Tip O'Niel's book "Man of the House" and he was your typical loverable irish pol, just like Reagan. You can tell if you are just a partisan zealot if you have nothing good to say about the leadership on the other side. I defy Drindl, JEP, Yockel and others to say something good about Hastert, Bush, Cheney, Frist, Boehner, etc. They can't becasue they live in a childish simple world where there side represents good and our side represents evil. Grow up.

I suspect bhoomes remembers Bob Michel as a liberal Dem. And compared to winguts like KOZ and bhoomes, he is.

The House Bank and Post Office "scandals" were interesting in that their actual political ramifications greatly outweighed their relative triviality. The Gingrich gang were able to put together a bunch of nice sounding platitudes (yeah, how much of that still exists, I wonder?), churn out the Contract on America, use the "scandals" to paint the Dem majority as out of touch (which quite a few of them were), and unseat a 40-year old majority.

It appears that in the space of 12 years, the Republican majority may also go that way, and even without much cohesiveness of argument on the other side. Craven, supine, and hypocritical are not three adjectives you want associated with your party if you're a majority member of the House these days. And yet, that's just where they are.

MikeB: got a source or three for your comments?

""The big danger for Republicans is they are going to reach a tipping point with the conservative base and they are going to stay home," said Republican consultant Rich Galen."

A couple more R revelations like Foley's and that outcome will be assured. The "identifies themselves as Democrats/Independents" metric will also increase.

MikeB: got a source or three for your comments?

""The big danger for Republicans is they are going to reach a tipping point with the conservative base and they are going to stay home," said Republican consultant Rich Galen."

A couple more R revelations like Foley's and that outcome will be assured. The "identifies themselves as Democrats/Independents" metric will also increase.

Mass, I beg to clarify. Studds was a Member of Congress representing the Cape Cod region of Mass (10th District, 73-97). Please get your facts right before you tell others to.

" Some sort of Republican Party operative (and, God I hope they are connected to Rove, because that is the current theory of law enforcement)"

Find me one Republican that can be called an operative that ISN'T connected to Rove, there aren't any left out there.

Old Turdblossom knows he's on the "A"list, Rove's the Joker card in the deck of deviates that Congress will go after if the Democrats get the power to weild REAL justice.

Rove's Hew Hampshire voter-fraud shenanigans are enough to put him into stripes, but if he's gone desperate and ordered some stupid threats, he's clearly trying to add to the list of laws he's willing to break for political reasons.

And that he's going to face time for.

Mass - When did they move the RI State Line further East so New Bedford, Cape Cod, Nantucket and Martha's Vineyard are in it?

To All,

Studds was from RI not MA please correct your posts. We may allow gay marriages but we do not tolerate underage sex with pages.

Sorry, it posted so many times don't know what happened! Grannysue

G.=grab as much as you can for yourself
O.=old rich white guys who hide behind the bible.
P=Puppets, perverts & pedophiles

Tell me something I didn't already know about the GOP. Grannysue

Okay Jackson, let's stick to point: Chris said "Traditional measures of the electorate's temperature (presidential approve/disapprove, congressional approve/disapprove, generic ballot etc.) show that Americans are extremely unhappy with the party in power and ready for a change. Republicans insist that these macro-measures matter little in individual campaigns that are influenced more by local concerns than national issues."

I say "RepublicaNazi's, like so many in their party, are in a State of Denial regarding the electorate. They refuse to acknowledge their own Elephant-in-the-Room, the one that's trumpeting "All politic's is local, except when it's not!" The Foley/PageGate scandal is simply the most glaring example of the RepublicaNazi head-in-the-sand management style. Being a Conservative means moving slowly and carefully. Being a NeoCoNazi conservative apparantly means not moving at all, which allows other's to kick them in the A**. After a while all that kicking is going to leave a bruise."

Now, is that on point regarding Chris's column?

"bhoomes" provides striking evidence that hope does indeed spring eternal. He deludes himself into thinking that a Democratic majority in the House (how about the Senate, too?) could do any worse than our current cabal of Neoconservative clowns. I think I can almost hear Darth Cheney saying to his mentally-challenged comic foil, "say goodnight, Duhbya."

Good thing Foley's dropped out, after his "never too tired" comments, people might be quite hesitant to shake his hand.

G.=grab as much as you can for yourself
O.=old rich white guys who hide behind the bible.
P=Puppets, perverts & pedophiles

Tell me something I didn't already know about the GOP. Grannysue

G.=grab as much as you can for yourself
O.=old rich white guys who hide behind the bible.
P=Puppets, perverts & pedophiles

Tell me something I didn't already know about the GOP. Grannysue

G.=grab as much as you can for yourself
O.=old rich white guys who hide behind the bible.
P=Puppets, perverts & pedophiles

Tell me something I didn't already know about the GOP. Grannysue

Hey, I like Che's stuff, very insightful and informative, why would you want to stifle it?

"Foley is a slimeball, but Denny Hastert is a damm good man, and this republican will never backstabb his friends."

"Hastert is a damn good man"

After these recent scandals, how can you be so certain?

You would have said the same thing about Foley before his fall from grace, so your fear of "backstabbing" is actually considered "enabling" by many legal codes.

If you are afraid to "backstab" (tell the truth about) your friends who are pedophiles, or their enablers, you are breaking the law in some states.

But, then, apparently those laws are meant for others, not Republicans.

Now so-called journalists are being paid to appear in government propaganda.... and so the guy who fired them gets fired... Pravda.

'The Miami Herald's publisher resigned Tuesday, saying "ambiguously communicated" personnel policies resulted in the firings of three journalists at its Spanish-language paper who were paid to appear on U.S.-government broadcasts aimed at promoting democracy in Cuba.

Jesus Diaz Jr., the papers' publisher since July 2005, had dismissed two El Nuevo Herald reporters and a freelance contributor who had been paid by Radio Marti and TV Marti. Diaz said the company offered to rehire the three and would not discipline six others it recently discovered also took payments.'

Che,

Go start your own blog instead of trying to hijack someone else's for your own posts that have absolutely nothing to do with Chris' blog entry. Everybody else doing this as well: cut it out. Grow up.

And, bhoomes, the Limbaugh/FOX claim that Foley never had sex with an under aged child is about to explode in all of your faces. The whole reason the FBI is involved in this is because THEY HAVE VICTIMS WHO ARE TALKING! And, not just that, someone has been threatening these victims and their families. Some sort of Republican Party operative (and, God I hope they are connected to Rove, because that is the current theory of law enforcement) has been making threats to intimidated several victims and has offered bribes to the familes of others. Now, doesn't that just make you just SO PROUD to be a Republican?

Jackson Landers" Is it your blog, Jackson. I don't think so. The editors don't seem to have a problem with what people post here, so why should you?

there are lots of other places you can go.. What does adulthood have to do with free speech?

Judge: The iMs were given to ABC by pages themselves, after ABC did a story on the emails, I think.

The emails have been out there for a while, but nobody acted on them. Fox News had them for a year too.

Gerry Studds??? Is that the best you've got???

The disgraceful activity you speak of occurred in the early 1970s. If you'd like, we can open the discussion of 1970s party corruption, but I don't think that's a winning hand for you guys either.

Bhoomes - "...the differnce is Reagan and the republicans...." How DARE you compare the current neo-con crop of swine, crooks, swindlers, pedophiles, serial adulters, con men and worse with ROnald Reagan. Ronald Reagan was a good father, a decent and honest man, and even a godly man, who had the best intersts of this country at heart. In the days of ROnald Reagan *I* was a Republican! Since 1998, the Republican Party has gone under the control of corporate and investor interests and that collection of neo-nazi nitwits that call themselves "the christian right (and they are neither). The web is is alive with rumors that, sometime in the next two weeks, at least two other national Republican figures are going to be "outed" along with a list of players in the Fundimentalist movement. God, I hope it's true, becasue these swine have misled people and done too much harm. Ronald Reagan would be campaigning for todays moderate Democrats.

A Foley bounce? From Rasmussen:

"October 2, 2006

Democratic Representative Harold Ford
Representative Harold Ford (D) has taken a 48% to 43% lead over Mayor Bob Corker (R) in Tennessee's increasingly competitive race for U.S. Senate (see crosstabs).
Ford has an edge with unaffiliated voters and leads by a whopping 70% to 23% among moderates.
Ford has gained ground fast in recent weeks. A Rasmussen Reports poll conducted September 5 showed him trailing by a single point, 44% to 45%, after lagging by six points in August, twelve in July."

bhoomes: Ask yourself how Bob Michel would have handled this? The same way? I suspect not.

Oh, and Bhoomes, Reagan respected O'Neill because they both believed in dialogue, not demagogue. I have no respect for Hastert because he's rolled over for the GOPher's in the past and will continue to do so in the future. He's in a Leadership position, but doesn't lead. That's the act of a coward or an incompetant, maybe both. He ascended to the Speakership by being meek and mild so as not to interfere with the Delay agenda. Now he's being hung out to dry by Boehner and Reynolds. I've got no sympathy for someone who's only excuse is to claim a vast leftwing conspiracy.

Careful, oldhonky, Mother WaPo will remove your comment if you venture too far down the path of page-derived humor. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if it disappears and this post ends up looking out of place (even more so than my usual).

Colin, I am simply asking for the same standard to be held, thats all. I believe an early posting stated Studs had sex with somebody of legal age, Thens why the scandal if that is true. Consensual sex bewteen adults is accepatable. But Studs had sex with a page who was under 18. Just Because Massachusetts is such a liberal state that sex between adults and minors is okay doesn't make it right. When you apply even standards across the Board nobody can accuse you of simply partisan behavior. Foley is a slimeball, but Denny Hastert is a damm good man, and this republican will never backstabb his friends. Washington Times has made a fool of themselves for Hastert.

House Republicans are trying now to move on past the Foley scandal. Maybe they'll manage to turn over a new page.

Yockel - Somehow I missed Pelosi's action. I just keep reading about the freezer. Thanks.

The two instances may not be comaprable in the acts themselves, but they are in the ethics of the handling of the matters. When confronted with something wrong, those with responsibilty must take appropriate action. In the Jefferson matter, Pelosi acted ethically. In Pagegate, the responsible authorities have acted politically, not ethically.

RMill: I dunno, seems unlikely. Too many voices on their side saying the things that KOZ-bhoomes says. I cannot imagine Rove giving up that easily; "slime works everytime!" must be his motto.

Who gave the info to ABC News? Looks like it was already out there but was certainly not being acted on by anyone in the government.

Public opinion and yes, even voters' choices, will not matter at all if we continue to rely on voting machines that are so easily corrupted that one minute's download of malicious software enables the Republicans to fix the vote. Who can doubt that the electronic vote was fixed when the disparity between the exit polls and the actual results contradicted one another so thoroughly? In addition to reporting on opinion polls, the Washington Post needs to report on the wholly dubious nature of electronic voting and the many ways in which the votes in these machines can be falsified. Therein lies the death of our democracy, and those in power will continue to allow electronic voting machines to be used so that they can continue to rule without ever needing the approval or, indeed, the votes of the people.

Nor'Easter, there is no comparison between Jefferson and pagegate.

Law enforcement busted Jefferson and Nancy Pelosi has removed him from the Ways and Means Committee. Eventually, Jefferson will go to jail. Nancy Pelosi has done her duty.

The problem with pagegate is that Republican leaders refused to investigate Foley. Therefore they have to go.

Drindl, don't you know that NeoCoNazi's feel assaulted when one question's their policies? The use of Thug's-r-USSS to intimidate is the norm. God forbid we demonstrate our constitutional right to disagree, it's downright unpatriotic.

Drindl, don't you know that NeoCoNazi's feel assaulted when one question's their policies? The use of Thug's-r-USSS to intimidate is the norm. God forbid we demonstrate our constitutional right to disagree, it's downright unpatriotic.

How's this for a theory:

White House, tired of getting beaten up and down on Iraq and the revelations of Woodward's new book that Rice was briefed regarding the 9/11 plot in the Summer of '01, and knowing (since it was widely known) Foley was gay and had this history with pages, were the ones who outted him in an attempt to distract voters and hoping it only affected one house seat instead of a whole lot of complicit House Republicans who helped Bush with Iraq.

Probably not but not as far fetched as you might think.

My guess is that they already saw the writing on the wall with the midterms and if they lost the House, Hastert was a goner anyways.

The strategy is they are burning the village in order to save it for 2008.

Nor'easter-- you're right... I have a strange dyslexia with acronyms. But the point is, the FBI agent I knew resigned over the current excessive partisanship of the agency-- the worst he's seen in 25 years.

t Begins. Can you say 'police state'?

'Attorney David Lane said that on June 16, Steve Howards was walking his 7-year-old son to a piano practice, when he saw Cheney surrounded by a group of people in an outdoor mall area, shaking hands and posing for pictures with several people.
According to the lawsuit filed at U.S. District Court in Denver, Howards and his son walked to about two-to-three feet from where Cheney was standing, and said to the vice president, "I think your policies in Iraq