In the end, before the elections enough republican legislators will fell the heat and go with impeachment to save their jobs, Even Hatch.

I think that We the People have the Democrats figured out. They ran on ending the War in (on) Iraq. It is clear that they are going to take little baby steps that will be vetoed by the President. I say lay off the Republicans and start confronting the Democrats who have absolutely no intention of ending this war before the 2008 presidential election. They do not want their fingerprints on this war, although many of their distinguished and esteemed colleagues voted for it. The Dems are going to do nothing to speed up the end to this war. If they did, and things improved in Iraq, Bush would get the credit and the Dems would worry about their seats. So while both sides are playing pure politics and talking a good game, our soldiers and innocent Iraqis are dying or maimed for life. Who are these people that we elect? They do not seem to have human hearts.

With the Dems pushing so hard for withdrawal from Iraq, the party seems unaware that they may be making the job much harder for themselves should they get the chance to govern again someday.

After all, the United States has many vital strategic interests in the region, and it is not obvious how a plan no more elaborate than bringing our troops home from Iraq will protect, for instance, the free flow of affordable Persian Gulf oil.

Is there any real hope of a comprehensive deal with Syria? Of course not.

If a stable Iraq and Lebanon were in Damascus's "best interests," then the regime wouldn't have been working so hard to destabilize its two neighbors for the last several years.

Apparently, Hillary Clinton intends to visit Damascus in the coming weeks.

In Damascus they will find a negotiating partner who has been waiting several years now to sit at the table with the Americans, to look them in the face and talk nice, while they are helping to kill U.S. servicemen in Iraq.

http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/013/598bhsro.asp

Dave! writes
"It's hard to talk about peace between Israel and Palestinians when people elect a party who's platform is the destruction of Israel. This is but one example of the problems in the ME. So to answer your question, not a darn thing."

Its also hard to talk about peace when you rule out talking. Hamas may not be the ideal partner for peace in Palestine, but likewise the IRA wasn't an ideal partner in Ireland. Yet, once the Brits started talking with the political arm of the IRA, they were able to negotiate peace. Likewise, Bush needs to move past his self-imposed roadblocks to diplomacy and sit down with people he might not particularly care for.

roo,
I believe that the roadmap did (does) have a two state solution. Clinton had a two state solution going. The problem is that the Palestinian government (Hamas) does NOT. You will have to find some other problem to blame the US for.

Dave!--Yes, there has been a lot of effort put in the Israel-situation.

Sort of like you can put a lot of effort into pushing a door to get in when the door opens outwards.

When the U.S. actually accepts that the two-state solution is the only possible successful one, we might get somewhere.

Kay D.
"No solution to the problem at hand. Bush upset the apple cart when he stormed into Iraq and unleashed a civil war onto the people of Iraq." Well, when the solution is to not try anything new, not be willing to change tactics or to withdraw the troops, it becomes a self fulfilling prophecy that there is no solution. I guess removing a mass murdering sadistic tyrant could be labeled as "upset[ing] the apple cart". So your implication that brutal suppression by a dictator masks and limits fighting between various groups is correct.

So many posters today want to affirm their righteousness or blame each other. That must be the inability to compromise CC suggested.

But...there will be a Middle East after the American led counter-insurgency in, or occupation of, Iraq concludes. It will continue to be the potential source of terrible problems for us and for the west for the rest of my life, at least.

Taking a long view that America has a positive role to play here has led me to similar conclusions to the Iraq Study Group or the Council of Foreign Relations.

Good Night, y'all.

bsimon,
"What would happen to peace in the Middle East if the President put as much effort into supporting peace as does avoiding it?"
Well, there has been a lot of effort put into the Israeli-Palestinian conflict and what has happened? Suicide bombings, kidnappings, targeted killings, an election of terrorists to run the Palestinian territories, a continuation of the occupation, etc. If you recall, there was a "roadmap" that both sides failed to live up to. It's hard to talk about peace between Israel and Palestinians when people elect a party who's platform is the destruction of Israel. This is but one example of the problems in the ME. So to answer your question, not a darn thing.

To Jeff_F_F: With over 3,000 American servicepeople dead, and more dying every day, it is not a question of what is "portrayed" in the news, but the realities of what our military is facing every day on the ground. The situation in Iraq has devolved into a civil war, and having our military personnel right in the line of fire does no one -- lease of all Americans -- any good.

The world has been waiting for the "if" that you imagine (i.e., declining violence) for more than 4 years now. It's time to face the realities of what war really is: No solution to the problem at hand. Bush upset the apple cart when he stormed into Iraq and unleashed a civil war onto the people of Iraq. This was something that the most learned people already knew before the War on Iraq began. Even the elder Bush knew that it was foolish to invade Iraq during the first Persian Gulf War. It would have been wonderful if the younger Bush had been that wise.

All of this assumes that the war is going as badly as what we see portrayed in the news. If the surge really is working and violence really is declining, those who were so vocal calling the surge a failure and saying that the war is lost will be in a very cold and lonely place.

Very well said jhjbyer.

If America does not want to fear the world, we need to quit arming and causing conflict with it. The same goes for the earth.

Bush has shown that intransigency does not advance anything. Pelosi, Reid and Bush have to talk. However, the debate must also be public. The Democrats have to articulate their case publicly and gain public support so that Bush is aware that his stance is rejected by the public. A Stand-off is foolish. Nevertheless, there is no need to rush amendments through. Bush should have to sweat it out. The more he argues his case in public the more the public will see how isolated and unconvincing he is.

To better appreciate the insights offered by rufus1133 and william t street [above] it helps to recall that this conviction that our being in Iraq keeps Al Qaeda away was unheard of before the clamor to bring home the troops drove the administration to rationalize continuing the so-called war they,re afraid to lose, never mind that the only thing left to win is more loss. No military intel, no expertise on terrorism, no evidence at all has been presented in support of what has nonetheless gone from mere convenient speculation to cause belli. It would be a shameful policy, indeed, and one to make of us all cowards, if it were true. How dare we use another people,s country for our own fight, just so they suffer the collateral damage and not us. How can conservatives, who claim moral superiority, stomach something so immoral? And if that,s our policy, why not simply occupy, with their kind permission, one of the remoter Canadian provinces and draw Al Qaeda there? We,d save a mint on transporting our precious troops for bait, All the convenience plus cool summers. Do you think Al Quaeda might balk? Because they don,t speak the local language, understand the culture, blend in, or share common cause with Canadians? We didn,t let that keep us out Iraq, but then we had an army, a navy... Too many rifles for their taste in Canadian hands? [More per capita than in the U.S.] Speaking of the U.S., it could be our proximity in sufficient numbers with our home school advantage that keeps them in the Middle East like it did all those years it took to plot one attack, 911, a stunt that according to our intel they no longer have the capability of implementing, thanks to our fruitful work in Afghanistan, which is not complete, and apparently never will be, owing to Bush,s lack of genuine concern for our security, as evidenced by his continuing to deplete our military readiness in disregard of warnings by generals who actually care.

Thomas Friedman's NY Times column today precipitated this post, not particularly because he deserves it, or because he provoked it, but basically because it was his column today that was the latest bit of Pollyanna Pabulum to spring from the Big Elephant fairy tale machine. Like Cal Thomas, and George Will, and Charles Krauthammer and all the other self deceivers, he has assumed three basic axioms that aren't actually so. He assumes that there was ever any rational thought given to getting us into this war, and that there is actually some thought taking place at some proximity to the White House to actually resolve the problems caused by the Neocon/Rumsfield Fairy Tale implementation, and he assumes that there exists some concatenation of circumstances that could be described as "Victory" in Iraq.

We may deal with the last invalid axiom first. There aren't even half a dozen Republicans who can actually specify some state that they would call victory, and no two of them would in fact agree on what constitutes victory. The only agreement among republicans is that leaving Iraq, or any solution reached by Democrats is DEFEAT!! That being so, every Republican call to win is a call for a never ending U. S. military presence in the mess in Iraq. No Republican will even begin to deal with the implications of this dicta, so that no conservative promulgation has any basis in reality. The only Republican end to this story is "... and they all lived happily ever after. The End." Obviously there is no arguing with this position.

As for there being any actual thought being given to resolving the Iraqi Problem, the utter lack of evidence available to show that such intellectual effort is taking place is prima facie evidence that no such intellectual effort is taking place. We are at the point where we can invoke the maxim of the law, "Innocent until proven guilty". Until George can be proven guilty of actually thinking about any aspect of this mess, he and his administration must be assumed to be innocent of the slightest effort to resolve the problem.

Rational thought about getting into this war? Not on George's watch, brother.

In fact, except to anticipate that this war would be compared to A Viet Nam War, thereby preparing the whole draft dodging bunch to deny any similarity to Viet Nam at the first q and u coming out of a Democrat's mouth, forethought and prescience were absent as a matter of policy.

They still aren't aware that the Dems are comparing them to the wrong Indochinese war.

George is really reliving the French experience at liberating Indo China from the Japanese. The French went in assuming that the Vietnamese, Lao, and Cambodian people would be so grateful for ending Japanese occupation that they would willingly go back to letting Michelin and associates rob them blind. When that didn't happen France could never quite come up with a Theory of operations, or a Strategy, or even meaningful tactics to accomplish anything that might look like Victory. Eventually they put enough French troops into a situation where their utter annihilation was a looming possibility and had to write off the whole exercise and go home. In between they produced lots of material for books like "The Street Without Joy"

George et Cie followed France faithfully, right up till now, where by scattering what insufficient force we have in country efficiently, we can be put through our own Dien Bien Phu, with hundreds of minor outposts being over run and eradicated during a dismal winter, thereby showing the bankruptcy of the Neocon/Rumsfield theory of dealing with wars of national liberation. If the Republicans think that what the Dems want is a defeat, what will Cheney's Geneva Peace Accords look like in comparison? Like France, but for far different reasons, the U. S. was dragged into this quagmire with no planning, vastly insufficient Forces, no meaningful doctrine, and no particular backing at home. France wasn't big enough to man or fund the First Indochina War properly, and George et al were basically too parsimonious to fund the war, and too desperate to get it started to ever try to properly man it. Now they dare not mention raising sufficient troops to even stand a chance of meeting even their own limited understanding of a successful campaign. Thus while lots of Republicans are willing to demand "Whatever It Takes To Win", they are unwilling to demand just what it would take to have a chance to prevail.

In Essence, to stand some chance in what George calls "The Global War On Terror" will require a standing Army of between 2.5 and 3 million men, heavily loaded with military tail. It will easily require about ten times the current ongoing costs, and it will require heavy taxes to support this process.

Find me just one Republican with the courage to propound this doctrine.

"Bring the Troops Home NOW!!!

I see it is business as usual today. And I had such high hopes after yesterday.

Solutions are hard ..a good start would be to sever Carl Rove, Tom Delay, and W from influence.

anon poster, you think I post from the Chamber of Commerce? LOL

I guess they'd really love my position on illegal immigration - keep 'em out! Build a fence! Kick out all those who are here against the law!

I'm reasonably sure that the COC would prefer the cheap labor...

I didn't want to assume. Well you are the woman drindl. :)

Sorry if I offended the troll lurking in the shadows. I know you have such delicate sensebilities Razor or should I say Zouk

Your the man/woman drindl

Indeed

woman, rufus. pleased to meet ya.

What is a zouk?

That's what's up drindle. They also got these hate merchants like rush/coulter/hannity/o'reilly/savage play their fears like a violin. It's would be sad it they weren't so damn evil about it. It would be sad if they didn't turn that fear and hate against their own people. WE know this was all for money to the few. People who only what Fox "News", they don't know that. Your the man/woman drindl

you spend all your time p*ssing your pants

I am having difficulty with my Depends today so I am curretnly obsessed with scatology.
you just make sh*t up

Zouk - Never been to KOS or on the DNC website.

koz is the dregs, the lowest common denominator in the threadbare rags of what's left of failed convsrsatism, which will be finished by 2008. maybe then he'll go away like he used to promise.

The 'facts' I present are just that -- facts, carefully documented and sourced

coming from drindl - hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

IC - Although you usually present less reasoned material than even dingbat drindl, much of it appears to be simply daily Kos and DNC material. It's as if you take the material on faith and never think how slanted it is in one direction.

JD, you sure do scare easily. But that's the thing about you cons -- you spend all your time p*ssing your pants. Everything scares you. That's what makes you so violent. The 'facts' I present are just that -- facts, carefully documented and sourced. You just don't recognize them because you cons don't deal in facts -- you just make sh*t up.

And we represent, by and large, the mainstream in american thought right now. If that scares you, you should move to another country -- an authoritarian place like Russia or China should appeal to you.

I have no blind hatred of anyone. I dislike bush becuaze he is exceptionally stupid and destroying my country.

As for doing something rash, it's all you winger gun nuts that are constantly wading into crowds of schoolchildren and mowing them down. We aren't the violent ones -- it's your side that's always jumping up and down and screaming nuke 'em. Take a look in the mirror sometime.

Here's William Buckley today -- does his 'leftis' ideology scare you too?

'The testimony reveals the CIA run by a man who cannot think straight, advising the national security adviser, who went on to make false allegations, and the vice president, who made even more false allegations, and the president, who took ill-considered and disastrous actions.'

From my boys at crooksandliars.com

The Democrats promised to conduct oversight when they took control of Congress and boy, are they delivering. On Monday, the Senate Oversight Committee held a hearing dealing with Halliburton and their exploitation of a loophole in U.S. law that allowed the company to use foreign subsidiaries in order to do business with terrorist states - namely, Iran. This clip shows Democratic Senators Frank Lautenberg (D-NJ) and Sherrod Brown (D-Ohio) grilling Sherry Williams, V.P. and Corporate Secretary for Halliburton about the company's deplorable ethics and questionable practices.

Download (119) | Play (94) Download (51) | Play (69)

Vice President Cheney continues to recieve his hefty pension from Halliburton, all the while knowing that that money is being earned with the blood of American soldiers. These people have no morals and no conscience. It's all about the almighty dollar, screw the troops and screw the American people. They're going to get thiers no matter where the money comes from and how many people have to die to get it. This isn't new by any means, but getting these scumbags in front of Congress and forcing them to answer for their disgusting business practices is, and it's about time. Enjoy the show...

I'm glad I scare you. I'll admit the right-wing attack machine USED to scare me. That was before the 07' elections :). Now your just sad. Get out of you cave buddy. I know it's really bright at first.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plato%27s_cave

JD - Although you usually present more reasoned material than Zouk, much of it appears to be simply Chamber of Commerce and RNC material. It's as if you take the material on faith and never think how slanted it is in one direction.

JEP, drindl, and rufus, you 3 really need to get out more. Your hardcore leftist ideology frankly scares me.

Also, your 'facts' on this blog are so far divorced from reality, I fear that your blind hatred of Bush will drive you all to something extreme.

Check this out. Bill O eats his words. For anyone who's interested.

Content analysis of O'Reilly's rhetoric finds spin to be a 'factor'
Commentator uses name-calling more than once every seven seconds in 'Talking Points Memo'

http://newsinfo.iu.edu/news/page/normal/5535.html

That is called a threat trotsky. That is like the rudy comment of vote democrat and die. Who has the power to make these calls. To me only people who have contact's in the arab world can make these threats SPEAKING FOR WHAT THE TERRORIST WILL DO.

Are you saying bush is an ally with the same terrorist WE are fighting?

critter69, you ain't from USM/USN are you?

"Those who profit from the war should pay for the war."

you mean like innocent americans from all walks of life who aren't getting killed on public transportation by bombers?

Is there anything under the sun that you dopes don't think is taxable?

If you really want an advantage create an intelligence tax. Democrats would obviosly be immune.

drindl - if you ever get an idea, we will be happy to ignore it. and no cries for mommy.

There are no coincidences, only conspiracies. we all know Bush did it.

Drindl is FOR censorship, on comment which is characteristic of what this Administration and its ilk have been saying since 09/11/01?

Drindl - your idea is one best ignored.

The Law of Unitended Conmsequences - Chis censors you before he censors Zouk.

slt notes that "Models are only as good as what is truly known about a system."

Agreed. The phenomena described in the piece I saw was called 'global dimming.' The premise is that increased particulate matter in the upper atmosphere facilitates cloud formation, which reflects more of the sun's energy, so less reaches the surface below. Widescale pollution thus changes weather patterns because less of the sun's energy reaches the planet's surface. Some scientists in the piece also speculated that this 'global dimming' effect resulted in underpredicting the actual impact of global warming from increased CO2 in the atmosphere. I wouldn't call the story definitive, but interesting. Definitive proof of African drought? Maybe not; but then again, when particulate pollution was reduced, the rains returned to central africa. Perhaps this was only coincidence.

That's 100% KAy D. From a ex-army infantry soldier. War's only goal is to FEED itself. The right know's this. They are not as ignorant as they would have you believe. Look at what all politicans do, not what they say. They can say anything. Fox "News" says it's against fascism. Bill O starts sentences with, " I don't want to demonize anybody, BUT." Watch what they do

Maybe Congress should pass the funds, but with no deadline.

Instead, insert a provision for an increase in taxes on business to fund the war. Businesses that profit from this war, such as KBR, Halliburton, Boeing, Lockheed Martin, Northrop Grumman, Raytheon, General Dynamics, United Technologies, Science Applications International Corporation (SAIC), Health Net, L-3 Communications Holdings, Honeywell Inc., Hughes, Rockwell, Textron, etc. Also, add a tax (10%?) on the stock dividends received from all companies profiting from the war. Those who profit from the war should pay for the war.

In addition, place an additional tax (10%?) of total compensation on any executive of any business whose TOTAL compensation is more than 30 times the average pay of the employees of the company. Since average pay across the US is approximately $35,000, most making more than $1,000,000 would be included.

Wonder what Bushie would say in his veto statement?

Truth or consequences

Not in the Democrat/Liberal vocabulary.

Bismon,

Models are only as good as what is truly known about a system. Our knowledge about the atmosphere (i.e., cost a lot of money to run those studies) is limited and the exactness of our models less than idea. If the melt off of ice at the poles is truly 30 years ahead of schedule then it tells us we do not understand our system. It means that temperature increases in the atmosphere are not as related to the melting off as modelers thought. It may be there are other factors unrelated to temperature that are responsible for this melt off or those temperatures have a greater impact on the melt off. A model is only as good as it predicts and if it can not predict well then its not a reliable. I am not saying global warming is not real only do not put a lot of faith in models.

You also say PBS now blames particulates from NA for the past famines in Africa which I would add is highly speculative with almost no ground truthing. If particulate matter (PM) was the cause of famine in Ethiopia how were they also the cause for the lower temperatures in the 60 and 70s (some people were predicting global cooling...mini ice age at the time) prior to our run-up in temperature since the late 70s. I would expect that famines in the 60 and 70s would have been even worse or the thought that lowering temperatures in the 60 and 70s were caused by increased PM is wrong. This shows how complex our system is and the difficulty in making predictions (i.e., contradictory data sets).

Modeler's believe that their model is prefect while experimental scientists such as myself question if we measured all our parameters correctly. However, it's the modelers who are taking our data and making prediction. I just wish they would add the caveats that I add to my papers.

"War is never the answer to any problem."

I am quite sure that Hitler and others would have loved to hear those words. While I agree it is not the most palatable and may not be the correct option at the time, unfortunately War IS sometimes the ONLY answer to a problem. If we don't agree with a war we must not merely disagree because we don't like it. Hell, no one likes it!! Find the alternatives!!

Not so fast!! Cutting and running, sticking our heads in the sand is not an option either.

Its too easy to arm-chair quaterback after the fact.The options must be real and they must be achievable regardless of your political tendancies.

Blarg notes
"All of the major newspapers and media outlets believed that Saddam had WMDs and that war was necessary."

Well, that's what happens when you're shown selectively leaked intelligence reports. Judi Miller's involvement in spreading false rumors precedes the Plame leak.

Please censor anything I don't like. all this truth is causing me to wonder if my source of information is good anymore. I am so used to Dem lies, I can't tolerate anything stopping me from my fictions. you may have noticed that's exactly why I come here -- to vomit and p*ss on the floor with my insulting and moronic drivel. you will never find anything of import with my name on it.

The press supported the war in Iraq for a long time. Before the war, anti-war voices were shut out of the media. All of the major newspapers and media outlets believed that Saddam had WMDs and that war was necessary. (So much for the old "liberal media" strawman.) The media turned on the war as it became more obvious that the occupation wasn't going well, and that we invaded under false pretenses.

drindl, there's a link at the top, next to the 'Comments' header.

What would happen to peace in the Middle East if the President put as much effort into supporting peace as does avoiding it?

Remember the day koz wasn't on here, how it didn't sound like a kindergarten? That's exactly why he comes here -- to vomit and p*ss on the floor with his insulting and moronic drivel.

CC -- I would like to ask you to put up the email address to report objectionable comments, like the above, equating democrats and terrorists. It's sickeningly abusive and i would like it removed. There was a link in the Post a Comment section for a while and now it's gone.

Anonymous poster queries: "What would happen in the war in Iraq and to the terrorists across the world if our PRESS/PEOPLE put as much effort into supporting the war that they do in trying to sabotage it? "

My answer: There would be even more bloodshed than we have now. Why would we want that? And why would you assume that anyone would really support war? War is never the answer to any problem. War is only death, destruction and instability.
Which is why it is ridiculous for our president to say that he is bringing stability to the region by waging war on a country.

It is not the job of the American people or the press to be cheerleaders for war. War should never be condoned because it never solves any problem. War only creates more problems.

'what would happen in the conduct of our foreign policy if idiots like koz and the moron administration he supports had any brains whatsoever?'

THERE GOES THAT SUBSTANTIVE DISCUSSION AGAIN!

We need those senate seats. If soldiers die in the process - too bad.

We win, they lose (Dems and terrorists that is), understand?

'What would happen in the war in Iraq and to the terrorists across the world if our press put as much effort into supporting the war that they do in trying to sabotage it?'

Q. 'what would happen in the conduct of our foreign policy if idiots like koz and the moron administration he supports had any brains whatsoever?'

A. 3000 young americans would not be dead.

and there was NEVER a bigger cheerleader for any war than the american press was for this one.

Note to moron: Reporting the news is not sabotage. It's called one of the rights we are guanteed by the Consjtitution.

What would happen in the war in Iraq and to the terrorists across the world if our PEOPLE put as much effort into supporting the war that they do in trying to sabotage it?

What would happen in the war in Iraq and to the terrorists across the world if our press put as much effort into supporting the war that they do in trying to sabotage it?

The Congress did the right thing. They passed a bill which allowed funding so that our military can have the necessities to do their job, while directing Bush to establish a timeline for withdrawal. Bush, however, continues to bury his head in the sand and refuse to accept that this war is only causing more and more problems for this country, and solving none of our real problems. Even if you are willing to give Bush the benefit of the doubt and believe that he thought he was doing the right thing at the time that he sent troops into Iraq, any thoughtful human being would have long ago taken stock of the situation and determined that our effort in Iraq has caused nothing but trouble. Not our president, though. He refuses to budge from his position one inch and actually consider a different strategy for our presence in Iraq. Subsequently, he costs more and more American lives every single day.

I believe the Congress should stick to their principles and refuse to present President Bush with a bill that does not establish a timeline for withdrawal. Wars cannot be endless. Sooner or later, the U.S. will have to leave Iraq. President Bush and his advisors prefer to waste their time and energy on re-spinning their position on our presence in Iraq, as opposed to dealing with the realities that our troops are more imperiled every day they spend in Iraq.

It is just so sad that one of only two vetoes of Bush's entire presidency comes at the expense of our troops. Why must Bush constantly burden our troops with his thoughtlessness? It is such a slap in the face to every man and woman serving in the military, as well as their families!

The truth is most likely half-way between the two of you.

The idea that anbar is getitng safer is the talking point of the day, all over the winger blogs--bush said it in that rambling madness he called a 'speech'

He also said this:

..."But slowly but surely, the truth will be known. Either we'll succeed, or we won't succeed. And the definition of success as I described is sectarian violence down. Success is not, no violence. There are parts of our own country that have got a certain level of violence to it.

Yet for all the indications of a heartening turnaround in Anbar, the situation, as it appeared during more than a week spent with American troops in Ramadi and Falluja in early April, is at best uneasy and fragile.

Municipal services remain a wreck; local governments, while reviving, are still barely functioning; and years of fighting have damaged much of Ramadi.

The insurgency in Anbar -- a mix of Islamic militants, former Baathists and recalcitrant tribesmen -- still thrives among the province's overwhelmingly Sunni population, killing American and Iraqi security forces and civilians alike. [This was underscored by three suicide car-bomb attacks in Ramadi on Monday and Tuesday, in which at least 15 people were killed and 47 were wounded, American officials said. Eight American service members -- five marines and three soldiers -- were killed in two attacks on Thursday and Friday in Anbar, the American military said.]

Furthermore, some American officials readily acknowledge that they have entered an uncertain marriage of convenience with the tribes, some of whom were themselves involved in the insurgency, to one extent or another.

don't tell harry - One of my sons is stationed in Anbar. The main road is called "IED Alley". It's worse. Prior to his last leave he was on duty for four straight days without sleep. It's bad and getting a lot worse. The Shia militia's have driven most of the Sunni's out of Baghdad and they have taken up residence in Anbar towns and villages and *welcome* Al Qaida as their protectors. You wouldn't last 24 hours there without round the clock troop protection. No U.S. personnel go out in squads of less than 12 and are armed at all times - ROE is "cocked and ready". As for the markets, they have always been open. It's where Iraqi's buy their food. When the mysteriously close up early is when U.S. troops call in for support.....

don't tell harry - One of my sons is stationed in Anbar. The main road is called "IED Alley". It's worse. Prior to his last leave he was on duty for four straight days without sleep. It's bad and getting a lot worse. The Shia militia's have driven most of the Sunni's out of Baghdad and they have taken up residence in Anbar towns and villages and *welcome* Al Qaida as their protectors. You wouldn't last 24 hours there without round the clock troop protection. No U.S. personnel go out in s1uads of less than 12 and are armed at all times. As for the markets, they have always been open. It's where Iraqi's buy their food. When the mysteriously close up early is when U.S. troops call in for support.....

DOJ official to fired US Attorney Bud Cummins: circumventing the senate was the "White House plan."

Oh surprise, surprise. After Carol Lam was fired last December, she had a conversation with DOJ official Michael Elston. When Lam asked to be able to stay on briefly to oversee certain key cases. Elston told her she had to be gone in "weeks, not months" and that the order for her firing was "coming from the very highest levels of the government."

'Very highest levels of the government'. I don't think Monica Goodling or Kyle Sampson count in that category, do they?

Also of interest, given the DOJ's cover story for Lam's firing, Lam called Deputy AG McNulty and asked why she was being fired. According to Lam: "He responded that he wanted some time to think about how to answer that question because he didn't want to give me an answer 'that would lead' me down the wrong route. He added that he knew I had personally taken on a long trial and he had great respect for me. Mr. McNulty never responded to my question."

I guess no one had clued McNulty in on the 'immigration enforcement' talking points.

That's it Trotsky, dodge and weave! Your leader was a dodger, a draft dodger, and is still a coward and a drunk. But, all conservatives are either drunks or druggies aren't they? Back to reality, Trotsky. The subject at hand is getting our children out of harms way and that madman, that jerk, that idiot, that fool you call "president", has caused too much heartache, caused the loss of too many lives, and the cheerleading jerks on the right that support him are as criminally liable as is he.

I'm not sure someone like McCain can't win the general election based on his position. The only way it makes sense that majorities support both sides sticking to their guns is that poll-responders prefer people who have convictions more than they like people who agree with them.

Anbar Province, long the lawless heartland of the tenacious Sunni Arab resistance, is undergoing a surprising transformation. Violence is ebbing in many areas, shops and schools are reopening, police forces are growing and the insurgency appears to be in retreat.

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04/29/world/middleeast/29ramadi.html?ex=1335585600&en=56f686052b572dac&ei=5124&partner=permalink&exprod=permalink

"It pains me to say this, but I now believe that there is no person in American public life today who has a lower ratio of real to apparent integrity than Jimmy Carter. The public perception of his integrity is extraordinarily high. His real integrity, it now turns out, is extraordinarily low. He is no better than so many former American politicians who, after leaving public life, sell themselves to the highest bidder and become lobbyists for despicable causes. That is now Jimmy Carter's sad legacy."

http://frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=28044

From Dershowitz no less.

"Carter and his Center have accepted millions of dollars from suspect sources, beginning with the bail-out of the Carter family peanut business in the late 1970s by BCCI"

a failure in so many ways that carter fool.

'Confusion reigned in Iraq yesterday as varying reports about the possible death of al Qaeda in Iraq's leader were circulated.

The cause of the confusion may have been cold hard cash, according to a senior Saudi intelligence official who said that bounty hunters often present body doubles in attempts to claim reward money on wanted terrorists.

Saudi and Jordanian intelligence services have been working with "tribal elements" to hunt down the leaders of al Qaeda in Iraq, said the source, who has been involved with the Saudi's operations in Anbar province in Iraq.

This effort, according to the source, involves the disbursement of cash rewards for any al Qaeda leader killed or captured.

The problem, however, is that in the past several months many of these tribal militias have unduly requested cash rewards, sometimes presenting bodies identified as associates of Mr. al Masri, who were not.'

too bad the msm is stupid or whipped enough to fall for this crap. how many times have they reported this guy dead? can't you people even try not to be rove's stenographers?

Yeah. I hear iraq is great in the spring. I'm thinking taking my kids their for vacation. We can get some cheap rugs :)

The cons stay in their cocoon, safe from examination and analysis. This is called cognitive dissonance and is a cherished staple of movement conservatives in their quest to redefine reality.

rufus notes
"Tin foil. I read your little "iraq is great" marketing piece there."

Rufus, I think what he meant to say was that Iraq is going swimmingly & the troops will begin coming home in October.

tinfoil hat squad - Ah, yes, another press release from thye boys at the Pentagon. WOuld this be the same Pentagon that now censors email, letters home, and blogs from active duty troops? The same Pentagon that, instead of buying a functional anti-RPG system from an Israeli firm, instead awarded a no bid contract to a defense contractor for such a system...to be delivered by 2011? O, the same Pentagon that cares soooo much for our wouned troops that they outsourced care for wouned soldiers to a Halliburton subsidiary (and thereby brought us Walter Reid and much much much worse care.....like my son's, who passed out cold from his wounds and laid there for two hours before someone noticed?). I could go on, but the Pentagon is composed of a bunch of career minded flunkies and Bush yes men. I wouldn't trust anything they had to say as far as I could projectile vomit.

How scary is this? The most powerful nation on earth run by one of earth's stupidest men:

'By the way, in the report it said, it is -- the government may have to put in more troops to be able to get to that position. And that's what we do. We put in more troops to get to a position where we can be in some other place. The question is, who ought to make that decision? The Congress or the commanders? And as you know, my position is clear -- I'm the commander guy.'

The commander guy. The Moron in Chief. The Retardo from Hell.

small gov't @ work wrote
"People have eaten millions of chickens that were given feed tainted with recalled pet food, federal officials said Tuesday. They said the threat to human health is unknown."

Don't worry, SG, the bio-engineered chickens have been designed to withstand tainted food. You have nothing to worry about, just trust the Government.

Rep. McDermott (D) to Pay $700K for Illegal Phone Leak

Tin foil. I read your little "iraq is great" marketing piece there. Wher eis the meat and potato's. How many soldiers lost last month? Was it the deadliest month yet? What about iraqi lives. no mention. I see there what is good for marketing and business. What about real people?

NEW YORK (CNN) -- People have eaten millions of chickens that were given feed tainted with recalled pet food, federal officials said Tuesday. They said the threat to human health is unknown.

"the reason for the greatly reduced precipitation, you dummy? Climate change."

PBS broadcast a story the other night about how increased particulate matter in the atmosphere, primarily from North America, was responsible for moving the jet stream in the 80s, which caused the Ethiopian famine by blocking the usual summer rains from occuring.

Imagine how many names and cell phone numbers ABC News must have if they can hold off, in the middle of ratings sweeps, for days, until a Friday night, when hardly anyone is watching TV. Must be a lot of Democrats among the johns.

"did those same models predict warming on MARS?"

I couldn't say; the article had no mention of MARS.

bsimon - did those same models predict warming on MARS? you may want to recalibarate with some new variables. do you still think that CO2 is a pollutant? don't tell my trees that.

'The research team found new evidence showing that lower precipitation--and not rising temperatures on the summit--is the main cause for the Kilimanjaro glaciers' retreat.'

--yes, and the reason for the greatly reduced precipitation, you dummy? Climate change. Christ you are a simpleton koz.

'typical paranoid, elitist Liberal. your thoughts and policies are so weak they can stand up to no challenge.'

You see Judge -- obviously koz. As JEP siad, tinfoil hat, trotsky, all the delusional winger posts are by him. He posts every 2 minutes or so, for 7 HOURS A DAY.

Don;t tell me he doesn't get paid. I think Chris should be notified. The RNC started funding ringers and trolls last year before the election, and putting them on the bigger leftleaning sites and MSM blogs. Couple of my friends who run blogs outed them. [The webmaster can tell what server a post is coming from].

What, pray tell is this poor boy rambling about? Sabotage, "Right-wing conspiracy theory", games??

http://www.grd.usace.army.mil/news/releases/20070430.pdf

Iraq progress report. Do not share with liberals or DC/NY press. they will go blind. Instead, suggest sticking fingers in ears and wailing.

anon wrote "more inconvenient facts for the church of Owlgore"

Perhaps. Did you see the other news on the enviro front? Apparently the climate models were too conservative - when applied retroactively, they predict far less arctic (and antarctic) melting than has already been measured. In other words, the melting that's already occurred wasn't predicted to happen for another 30 years.

70% of Connecticut Republicans voted for Lieberman. (As opposed to 21% who voted for their party's candidate.) Republicans made up 26% of the electorate in Connecticut. That means 18% of the Connecticut electorate was Republicans who voted for Lieberman. Lieberman won the election 50-40. Deny it all you want, but Lieberman won because Republicans voted for him instead of the Republican nominee.

Dems did keep their 100 day promise of Pay-Go. Problem is, it only affects 2008 budget; they foolishly didn't include Iraq appropriations to the pay-go rules. Which really begs the question: why is Iraq funding still 'emergency' in nature? Didn't Bush see this one coming?

Sorry for the double post. The first one didn't take, I thought. Sorry for the rant.

THIS IS NOT A GAME PEOPLE

This is not a game. OUR soldiers lifes are not pieces in risk. People are dying and starving everyday. THIS IS FUNNY TO YOU? I hate sabotoge of this country. I was 11B army infantry. The games you people play both with OUR coutry and the ,ilatary akes me sick. You WILL get yours. Your movement is over for ten years, maybe more. Go hid ein a cave like a good dittohead. Don't come on here to destroy any contructive debate. Your movement already did that to the government. Let the people have a blog without you destrying it with more propoganda and lies.

Peace to you. God will be your judge Razorback/zouk/tin foil. Not me

The fabled snows of Tanzania's Mount Kilimanjaro may not succumb to global climate change as quickly as scientists had feared. A joint Austrian-U.S. research team that took seven years of measurements from weather stations atop Africa's tallest mountain says that its ice fields will be around for another 30 to 40 years /snip/ The research team found new evidence showing that lower precipitation--and not rising temperatures on the summit--is the main cause for the Kilimanjaro glaciers' retreat.

more inconvenient facts for the church of Owlgore

I don't like sabotoage. I don't think this is a game unlike you. People are dying. People are starving. This is not a game. Our soldiers lives are not games. I was army infantry 11B. The games you facsist play make me furious. You have sold this county out. I had hoped once eveyone KNEW fox news and rush were propoganda they would fall off. That didn't happen did it? You kept marching to that drumbeat following the walrus to the feast. THIS IS OT A GAME. The conservative movement makes me sick

...yes, and "|" can be interpreted to mean "nothing" as well as "anonymous", which can be rearranged to spell "anoy mous", which is misspelled but describes someone of insignificant interest who is merely annoying. (oops I forgot the "n"!)

"you are disconnected from reality and have no interest in civil discourse." "You and your movement is full of facsist and tratiors. You will get yours. The lie has been exposed."--rufus1133

"which is interesting and rather descriptive of someone, so out of touch with reality, that they post the sort of nonsense this hick posts." "spelling and punctuation errors don't count unless you're an unemployed English major and a complete twit."--MikeB

SLOW DOWN GENTLEMEN!! THAT'S WAY TOO MUCH SUBSTANCE FOR TODAY!

"George W. Bush said his [favorite book] was The Raven, an old Pulitzer prize winning bio of Sam Houston that is readily available in Texas. Most interesting bit: Houston had the same problem Bush had."

I had no idea Sam Houston was a sociopathic coke freak, nor that he believed the Alamo to be a great success right up till such brains as he had were dashed out by Mexicans. History is fun!

This guy has no idea who trosky even is. Just using more right-wing fear as talking points. You can't talk about what is. He will lose everytime. his only hope is sabotage. Just like the republican party. I call sabotage treason. I call selling your country out to line your pockets both being a tratiors and treason. How do you reaspone tin foil hat.

Actually, Lieberman ran as an independent and promised to conference with the Democrats, so as not not allow for a possible Republican majority. Furthermore. Lieberman ran as a mainstream Democrat on labor and other issues. His pro-Iraq stance was never a part of his campaign. Instead, he portayed his opponent as a far left radical that has only been nominated due to some "leftist" activists. tinfoil hat squad, before you go around posting utter nonsense, please check your facts. Facts count, spelling and punctuation errors don't.

"The letters in "Trotsky" can be rearranged to spell "skytrot"

- what passes for intellect on the left.

Blarg, stop making up things. Please name all those vetoed laws. I stated spending proposals, not laws. I am careful to use the proper words around Democrats because you never know when the word "is" might change meanings.

as for Liberman - yeah, whatever gets you through your day. the GOPS elected him. In connecticut.

I notice you avoided the broken campaign promise and corruption truth.

But I am sure your minions JEP, Dufas, drindl, ignorant coward et al will cover for you with some invented facts. More likely name calling and conspiracies knowing them.

Careful, Rufus!!

Your liberals are showing and their turning all blue and stuff.

The letters in "Trotsky" can be rearranged to spell "skytrot", which is interesting and rather descriptive of someone, so out of touch with reality, that they post the sort of nonsense this hick posts. Earth to skytrot, spelling and punctuation errors don't count unless you're an unemployed English major and a complete twit.

Lieberman won with significant Republican support. The RNC decided they'd rather have Lieberman than a real Democrat, and threw their own nominee to the wolves. It's just that simple.

By the way, the Democrats in Congress have passed several laws. Bush just keeps vetoing them. Again, a simple fact that seems to have eluded you. And how can spending keep increasing if no laws are passed?

"Tinfoil hat squad", why don't you just post with your normal name? What's wrong with a little honesty?

Rufas teaching about grammar, vocabulary and spelling. Hardy har har.

That's like Algore telling us to conserve energy. Or JEP admitting something is a coincidence. or drindl getting an econ notion correct. Or bill clinton lecturing us on abstinence. or murtha telling us about integrity. or harry reid mentioning patriotism. or, nevermind, the list of Democrat hypocrites and fools is just too long to imagine.

Through his own stupidity, KOZ made a valuable contribution to helping the Dems win back Congress.

You win tin foil hat. Obviously, you are disconnected from reality and have no interest in civil discourse. All you can do is attack. OR "well a dem did this in 1856." You win we'll all leave the site because "you can't handle the truth.". Just know you can't live in that cave forever. The real world is, and you can't hide forever. You can't close you eyes and ears forever. You and your movement is full of facsist and tratiors. You will get yours. The lie has been exposed.

Peace in the middle east

Why did Lieberman win? the ex VP nominee of the party was shunned for his pro-war views. the suicidal liberals in conn tried to force the issue by nominating Lamont. the moveon crowd was not able to win an election (still no victories) and the lose the war crowd was humiliated. the election was not about losing the war, as proven by this one instance.

But considering the Democrats did win the election, what have they done with their majority? Zero laws passed. zero campaign promises kept. corruption at all time high. spending increasing with every new proposal. and the moveon folks think they run the party now - yes, they do, into the ground.

When the president and the rest of the nation refuses to surrender and committ suicide, the rubes at Kos scratch their empty heads and can't figure out why they keep coming up short. Take a poll, it will make you feel better.

Facts, huh? FActs? You abviously don't know what the word FACT means. Here you go. This will help you in the future to determine for yourself "what is". So you know, not all polls or opinions are classified as fact. If you know what a word means before using it, that will help you in life.

1. something that actually exists; reality; truth: Your fears have no basis in fact.
2. something known to exist or to have happened: Space travel is now a fact.
3. a truth known by actual experience or observation; something known to be true: Scientists gather facts about plant growth.
4. something said to be true or supposed to have happened: The facts given by the witness are highly questionable.

Congressman Dingell offered a Democratic plan to lower the price that Americans pay at the gas pump and reduce the cost of home heating oil.

http://democrats.org/a/2005/10/congressman_joh_2.php

those pesky facts again. Doesn't interfere with JEP's personal "reality" though.

"We have proposed a tough anti-price gouging law" - even though no evidence of gouging was ever found. We just like new laws that much.

There is absolutely nothing the Democrats can do to the Republicans that will hurt them more than leaving them to stew with their unwinnable war.

The more funding they get, the fewer strings are attached, the less the GOP will be able to deflect blame for the catastrophe they made.

Full funding, no withdrawal timetable. This is what Republicans SAY they want, but it's actually what they most fear.

Give Bush the rope and he will hang the GOP. Congressional Republicans know this. They are desperate for a bill that will end the war. They just don't want their names on it.

"By focusing on Bush hatred, liberals succeed in shifting the focus from their own failed policies. Much the same way third world dictators do. (Having a common enemy is a very powerful unifying factor.) By concentrating on all the real and imagined failings of Bush and America, the liberals can stay in their cocoon, safe from examination and analysis. This is called cognitive dissonance and is a cherished staple of secular progressives in their quest to redefine reality. Reality is what they say it is. End of debate. Sound familiar?"

Reverse this statement and you have the conservative movement in a nutshell. Sorry, speaking of reality. I have to assume the worst about this post. Otherwise, dittoheads will say, "yeah that's true. Liberals are doing that." I had to clarify just incase they missed it. Just incase they DON'T know fox/rush/hannity'oreilly
are liars and propogandsit. They will say anything for $$$$. Like Ann Coulter loves to say. "The worst things I say the more money I make." That to me is treason to me. That is elling out your country to me. Is this a time of war, or not? If so the rules apply to all. The right doesn't suppor tthe troops, they are not patriots. They are sell-outs and tratiors. Ship them all to Austraila wit their boy rupert murdock. Let him mold a new reality for them. They can live likes it's 1958 forever

"liberals succeed"

Surely they will toss you out of the Federalist Wannabe Society for putting those two words together on the same page!!!

William - Your inane comment is why I find you right wingers so offensive. Look, the Islamists want to spread their silly religion around the region, retake Israel, etc. To be sure, they would likewise spread it to Europe and the U.S. They tried, and were partialy successful, back in the 1300 and 1400's. So what? If you want to really make the West safe, you would advocate using cruise missiles on every mosque and treat Muslims like they were memebers of the SS. Is that what you are advocating? You're not going to find many "takers" for that position.
We have experienced fanatics, spreading their twisted ideologies and religions throughout history. We've had Nazism, Marxism, Fundimentist Christianity, animal rights screwballs, NeoCOns and Naderites. All are whacked out and all eventually have been or will be consigned to the garbage heap of history. Islam, f we allowed it, would either moderate or will simply disappear. Same for the claptrap nonsense of Fundimentalism.

That does sound like I've heard it before speaking of reality. :)

It's so funny watch fox "news". It comedy to me. I've seen them on their accusing leberals of being nazi's and fascist. It's the old elementary trick of "I know you are but what am I." Orwell called this doublethink and newspeak. Rather than saying, "hey that sounds a lot like fox." It turns a dittohead from thinking not about the argument, BUT THE COUNTER TO THAT ARGUEMEnt. Truth dosn't matter. I heard someone on fox say it best. "I am a soulless lawyer. I look at both sides." They said it not me. Soulless

"the Democrats promised to lower it if elected"

...find a link to that fact and someone might believe it.

I know better.

And if memory serves, it seems we were all saying that, as soon as the election was over, prices would jump? It has not even been 6 months, and it is already over $3 a gallon.

So who was wrong?

Zuk's provided us with another example of how even defeat and shame can be spun into some sort of Republican victory delusion...

We gave em' lemons in November, now they think they'll make lemonade out of it. At least in terms of what they can accept or deny with such brainwashed brains.

By focusing on Bush hatred, liberals succeed in shifting the focus from their own failed policies. Much the same way third world dictators do. (Having a common enemy is a very powerful unifying factor.) By concentrating on all the real and imagined failings of Bush and America, the liberals can stay in their cocoon, safe from examination and analysis. This is called cognitive dissonance and is a cherished staple of secular progressives in their quest to redefine reality. Reality is what they say it is. End of debate. Sound familiar?

http://rightbias.com/News/042707libs.aspx

Dave!

Well, yes...a concept which I admit occasionally using (as opposed to, say, the the White House or its Justice Department, if by 'planning ahead' you mean trying to anticipate the long-term consequences of a proposed course of action)

Dave at 1:52;
"How this translates into "Wall street really likes Democrats" is beyond me."

Wall Street has climbed more since the November elections than it has throughout Bush's entire tenure...

Prove me wrong, if you really know the story. Your arguments so far are just scrambling for good news about Republican's effect on the economy. The daily news suggests that kind of good news is very hard to find and even harder to justify.

But them's just facts, feel free to spin it to match your prejudice.

Surely there must be SOME OTHER explanation than the public having more confidence when Democrats rule.

God forbid, that should ever be proven to be true, it would take away one more Republican delusion, like "stronger on homeland security," or "more experienced in foreign policy." You know, the delusions they keep promoting to their brainwashed base (who apparently still feel the need to repeat it, regardless of the day-by-day evidence to the contrary, you would think they might be embarrasses to be wrong so often, but considering Bush and his policies, denial seems indemic and essential to the conservative cause.

Reality is a great experience! How unfortunate so many conservatives will never know it's joy...

To much Fox for you willaim. Put that stuff down, it's bad for you. Who are the Islamists freinds in DC? Who was bush 41 meeting with on 9/10/01? Saudis? Who are his business partners? How about the hijackers? How about bin laden? Who is winning the most right now in right? Most would say Iran. What brought that vicotry to iran, the democrats? I think you need to look good and hard at the republicans. Not just what they say but what they do. What is happening as a result of actions. I don't know how you people can continue to call the dems terrorists. Eveything points to the republicans. From before 9/11 (rudy, bush, wworld trade center security was conencted to the bush family) and after ( mishandling of the war, no plan, lies lies lies.) Get your facts together. Otherwise you risk look like a dittohead

JEP - only one conspiracy today. you must be getting tired.

why is my gas price so high? the Democrats promised to lower it if elected. I thought you claimed it was easy to manipulate this market. Why are they making the poor suffer with high gas prices?

"Judge you seem to have a lot of personal knowledge on mind warping drugs."

An assertion supporting the concept that jumping to erroneous conclusions based on limited facts is common to unthinking R's everywhere.

"he used 'Lib' and 'moonbats' under trotsky yestereday..." Hmmm, maybe you're right.

JEP do you substitute this conjecture for newswothy print? I don't like Gonzoles either, but at this point that is only an opinion, and from of all places, the "Left Angled Times"?

JEP, you need to have your head examined. You say that the Islamists don't want to come here and mess with us. Wrong, dummy. You really need to do some reading other than the Democrat Party's line. The Democrats are going to get us all killed. Their instrument? The Islamists. Trouble is, they won't make a distinction between Republicans (red necks), and Democrats (appeasers). It really isn't good to fight a war using polls. Polls are generally answered by people who are ignorant of the facts. It appears that you are one.

"Is he your nemesis?"

No, KOZ, you are your own worst enemy, you don't need us to be a nemisis.

We just point it out whenever you prove it once again (and again, and again, ad infinitum)...

I must say, I'm a bit disappointed your thesaurus is getting dusty, haven't heard any of your contrived vocabularizations yet, but I would geuss I just haven't been back aboard long enough.

The president said today in a speech before the Associated General Contractors of America:

"But slowly but surely, the truth will be known. Either we'll succeed, or we won't succeed. And the definition of success as I described is sectarian violence down."

No more searching for weapons of mass destruction, no more powerful ally in the Middle East, no more "free and Democratic Iraq", no more "shining beacon of hope". Now success, according to the president, is simply "sectarian violence down". In other words, a return to what we had before we spent the hundreds of billions of dollars and the thousands of American lives and the hundreds of thousands of Iraqi lives, right, Mr. President?

"Either we'll succeed or we won't succeed."

In the game of lowering expectations, the president searches for the ultimate nadir...

tinfoil hat squad
trotsky
king of soup

All the same peson.

And here's a conspiracy I just dug up, thanks to Elizabeth Holtzman (someone with real authority and not just self-important opinions)and the LATimes...

"NO MATTER how many members of Congress lose confidence in Atty. Gen. Alberto R. Gonzales, President Bush is unlikely to let him go. If Gonzales resigns, the vacancy must be filled by a new presidential nominee, and the last thing the White House wants is a confirmation hearing. All this is reminiscent of the Watergate scandal"

It is a great article...
I know KOZ, in any manifestation, won't have the clear-mindedness to understand and consider the implications of this editorial, but most of you should get it...

You misfits seem to have an unhealthy obsession with this koz guy. what gives? Is he your nemesis? Has he done something to aggravate you? do you have a life outside of counter-koz? can you create an argument for anything sensible without resorting to name calling and boogeymen?

do you all inhabit the same wing of St E's? Was it diagnosed as bush derangement syndrome?

JEP,
"Wall Street really likes Democrats, the stockmarket has been flying higher and higher since the Dems took back Congress." Got one word for you - stagflation. If your words were true, then the economy would have been great through the 70's as congress was controlled by Dems for all the 70's as well as having a Dem for a pres for almost half the decade (plus one can make the case that Nixon did not govern as a conservative on fiscal matters). Congress was split until the late 80's - 94 when the Dems controlled (note through the "Bush I recession"), and since then its been mostly republican controlled. Clinton, to his credit, was very centrist on his dealings with the economy. Plus he kept Greenspan. How this translates into "Wall street really likes Democrats" is beyond me.

On point kchses. But why waste 5 minutes of your life trying to explain something the right already knows. "Bush didn't lie." How can a sane person argue against someone who posts that? Like I've said, and other on this site, the right is not as insane sa they would have you beleive. tHEY JUST HAVE TO LIE TO ACHIEVE THEIR GOALS. If they told the truth they would be gone. If Bush told the truth, we would be in this war. Him and his cronies wouldn't have made billions. It''s not about truth. THEIR MOVEMENT IS A TALKING POINT. Facsists. The whole right-wing conservative movement

Judge you seem to have a lot of personal knowledge on mind warping drugs.

Drindl, you wouldn't know the truth if it bit you. Are you still counting votes in FL?

JEP, whatever happened to the gas conspiracy, you remember, the one where Bush was controlling the price? It aligned nicely wtih your preposterous claim that the economy is in ruins. In all this time AWOL, you haven't managed to come up with one intelligent thought? the idea that Broder is a conservative is clear evidence of your delusions. Maybe talk to Judge about something stronger.

JEP -- he used 'Lib' and 'moonbats' under trotsky yestereday...

It's so much easier to say..."why should we", than "I am unable to"

Sorry Blarg try again.

To no facts please we're dems

Point 1: This is a fantasy of the reactionary right and talk radio deadheads that somehow the majority of the country can be classified as conservative. Polls only indicate less then a 1/3 consider themselves conservative.

Point 2: Sounds correct but only an extreme few on the left believe religion is the opiate of the people. Those few are not, contrary to the reactionary rights straw man arguments, representative of the left.

Point 3: Self evident.

Point 4: Again almost no one on the left thinks America is the "bad guy". This is more reactionary propaganda to demonize opponents. It serves only a selct fews interests and not the countries. As to "winnable" what exactly constitutes winning in Iraq? If you think Iraq will ever be an ally of the US you know nothing about the history, culture and politics of these people.

Point 5: One should be reasonably mindful of what your allies think of you. To disdain those who have historical and cultural ties to you just because you think their too leftwing is idiotic.

Point 6: Lieing is probably too strong. President Bush and VP Cheney willfully ignored intelligence reports because they thought they knew better. Guess not.

Point 7: The belief that America or conservatives "won" the Cold War and toppled the Soviet Union is childish and silly. No nation has ever possessed the power to decisevly influence a great political upheaven in another great nation on the other side of the world. In fact it is extemely likely that the Cold War helped propped up the Bolshivik regime after the death of Stalin. To suggest that the US was responsible for the collapse of the Soviet Union is an insult to the memory of all those who did bring it about.

Point 8: Also self evident.

Point 9: Again self evident

Point 10: Its fascinating how no one has tweeked to the reality that the end of the Cold War is what strengthened the US economy. That the increase in our military budget is what has weakened it. We as usual are our own worst enemy...or more to the point the reactionary right is our own worst enemy. They think unlimited spending on the military is somehow good for us.

Point 11: Totally irrelevant what Saddam Hussein had and used on his own people. Simple fact, he had no way to use them against us. After that I couldn't care less.

Point 12: No comment. Both Bush's and Gore's behavior regarding the Florida recount was disgusting and not in the general interests of the country. Only their own narrow self interest.

Point 13: More disgusting behavior by the reactionary right who somehow believe everyone to th eleft of themselves are communists

Point 14: Who cares

Point 15: All I have to do is read the Washington Times to see such examples everyday or listen to talk radio. This point is hammered endlessly in the reactionary media

Point 16: Wawawa

Interesting that those who live in a conservative bubble believe that everyone else lives in a similiar bubble.

koz-If you didn't use EXACTLY the same language and same straw men and red herrings, no matter what nome you post, it wouldn't be so easy to out you.

I didn't see a list of facts. I saw a list of assertions, some of which were provably false (like the one I already proved false), and the rest of which were just conjecture and opinion. ("Religion is good" is an opinion. "Most Americans believe..." is, at best, unproven.) And the whole thing was based on the ludicrous stance that the American media has a strong liberal bias. Why should we respond to it any more than we already have?

Drindl: I dunno I can't see KOZ posting without the use of the prejoratives 'lib' and 'moonbat.' 'Trotsky' might be him if the floor supervisor in his ward is trying out a stronger medication like teflutixol.

JEP, how many conspiracies have you uncovered today? without you and Scully and Muldar, we would all be in the dark.

'Cute drindl, I noticed you avioded the truths presented in "no facts" post.'

well, koz, if there had been any 'truths' in that half-baked delusional propaganda rant, I might have addressed them. But there weren't.

so the response to a list of facts from the mutual admiration society is to insult king-of-zouk.

do you all inhabit the same rubber room together?

bsimon:
LOL...
but from a very practical standpoint...I'm having trouble conjuring up any names that go well with "respected conservative" these days, they are all either fruitlessly re-spinning the old lies (Broder comes to mind) or they are prudently silent and obfuscatory (new word?).

I still can't bear to watch Fox News, but Newshounds (http://www.newshounds.us/) watches them for me, and it has become quite evident from their shrill, vitriolic pitch and desperate tactics that even the Fox Newsies are starting to see the writing on the wall, and it just doesn't match the propaganda Ailes is puts up on the teleprompter for them to promote...

I really hope you're joking, bsimon. Because I'd hate to think of anyone seriously making that argument.

Blarg writes
"Anne Coulter wrote a book called "Treason" accusing all liberals of being traitors. Limbaugh does it practically every day."

Blarg, the original poster asked for RESPECTED conservatives' quotes (emphasis added)....

HA Ha ha...

Too easy!

Thanx, Drindl, I was hoping to flush him out of his latest nom-de-plume, (is that anything like a mushroom cloud?)

I sort of figured he was still behind the scenes, hiding from The Truth like all the rest of the embarrasingly discredited Republican trolls seem to be doing these days.

So many of them who have finally admitted defeat are just bitter losers, it worries me how desperate they are to convert their delusions into reality.

Like Romney wooing the Scientologists, their only loyalty is to those who agree with them for the moment.

"I'm afraid the 'wind' is coming from a slightly lower part of his body"

Cute drindl,