Weekend update

I was on the phone this morning talking to a team source who refuted a published report which said Ernie Grunfeld has offered Andray Blatche a three-year, $11 million deal. Ernie's made an offer, make no mistake about it, but I hear that it's less than that.

I'll stick by my gut feeling that Andray will wind up signing a three-year deal for something in the neighborhood of $9 million. Thing is, Andray has every right to ask for three-years, $11 million because that's what Amir Johnson got from Detroit. Stay tuned. I do know this: Ernie probably won't sign Dominic McGuire until a deal for Blatche is done. Gotta stay under that luxury tax baby.

Miami's decision to sign Smush Parker means you can rule Pat Riley out of the Juan Carlos Navarro sweepstakes (I call him JNC because some folks on this blog tend to think that the guy is a cross between a Spanish Michael Jordan and the real JC). Perhaps the Lakers will call and make an offer now that they need a guard? Bottom line: I see Ernie getting a deal done this week.

By Ivan Carter |  July 28, 2007; 4:29 PM ET
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Comments

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First!!!

Posted by: BigCarter | July 28, 2007 4:44 PM

Ouch. Not so good, Washington Times.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 28, 2007 5:15 PM

Ivan, what are the wizs going to do about Ruffin?

Posted by: Anonymous | July 28, 2007 5:16 PM

Not so sure the Lakers need a guard with Kobe, Fisher, Farmar, Crittenton, Evans and Vujacic

Posted by: Eric Pincus | July 28, 2007 5:21 PM

You know something, I'm gonna change my tune and agree with EG on this one.

It's not the Wiz's fault that there was a crazy "buy out" attached to Navarro. The Wiz drafted him originally to play here after all.

I think EG should just sit on him. Let him play in Europe another year and come back next year. Maybe by then maybe he will suit up for the Wiz, if not then trade his rights.

This all only went down a month ago, imagine what a full off-season could bring in as far as trades. I don't think he's being treated "unfairly" at all. That crazy buyout was the only unfair thing as far as I can see and that's not the Wiz's fault.

Ivan, would you please get some reactions to the new coaching hire from the players. How is he fitting in with everyone?

- Ray

Posted by: Ray | July 28, 2007 5:42 PM

I hope you're not saying there's a chance we would not sign McGuire if it would put us over the tax. Man that guy looks like he's gonna be a good player. He was the best player on the summer team, better than Young or Pesh IMO.

If we are so close to the tax, it seems our only option with Navarro would be to deal him for a draft pick. It seems nobody has any interest in Etan.

Posted by: Darnell | July 28, 2007 6:06 PM

I'd love to deal him to Utah for the rights to Fesenko and a pick.

Posted by: Darnell | July 28, 2007 6:07 PM

The Moonie paper gets it wrong again. We gotta sign D-Mac, how could we let him fall to us at 47 and not sign him?

Posted by: Wizzy | July 28, 2007 6:33 PM

Welcome to the real world, Ray.

No worries on Dominic, guys, Ivan was just saying they have to sign Blatche first. They'll both be in.

Posted by: Patrick | July 28, 2007 6:44 PM

Finally an explaination of the JNC

Posted by: Anonymous | July 28, 2007 7:06 PM

Man who cares about this luxury tax nonsense or what we do with Dray & Dominic?

Ernie did what he had to do this offseason. He got me paid when no one else was going to. He kept Gil happy and now me & Gil will rule the NBA together for the next couple of years. The Hibachi & 50/50....yall better watch out.

Posted by: DeBrick Stevenson | July 28, 2007 8:00 PM

Don't be so critical of the moony paper. Remember, they were telling us about gilbert opting out more than a year ago. One year later, Gilbert's opting out.

Posted by: Jason Rothschild | July 28, 2007 8:10 PM

Don't be so critical of the moony paper. Remember, they were telling us about gilbert opting out more than a year ago. One year later, Gilbert's opting out.

Posted by: Jason Rothschild | July 28, 2007 8:10 PM

Don't be so critical of the moony paper. Remember, they were telling us about gilbert opting out more than a year ago. One year later, Gilbert's opting out.

Posted by: Jason Rothschild | July 28, 2007 8:10 PM

Don't be so critical of the moony paper. Remember, they were telling us about gilbert opting out more than a year ago. One year later, Gilbert's opting out.

Posted by: Jason Rothschild | July 28, 2007 8:10 PM

Don't be so critical of the moony paper. Remember, they were telling us about gilbert opting out more than a year ago. One year later, Gilbert's opting out.

Posted by: Jason Rothschild | July 28, 2007 8:10 PM

Don't be so critical of the moony paper. Remember, they were telling us about gilbert opting out more than a year ago. One year later, Gilbert's opting out.

Posted by: Jason Rothschild | July 28, 2007 8:10 PM

We heard you the first time... lol

Posted by: Jim | July 28, 2007 9:18 PM

The Lakers may be interested...you know what that means: You take Etan and JCN and we'll take Kwame back!

Posted by: oddjob | July 28, 2007 11:26 PM

hey, dc fans. ready for your lousy football to resume its place on the bottom of the heel of Philly, Dallas and New York? why do they even bother to field a team in this luke warm market anymore?

Posted by: Anonymous | July 29, 2007 12:45 AM

Wow, I can't imagine our being so stupid that we would not sign McGuire! What??? He's a second round pick, so we only have to offer him a few hundred grand.

We can offer Blatche $3 million a year and still have enough to sign McGuire. We need to sign McGuire! This is a guy who averaged 9.8 rebounds, 3.6 blocks and 3 assists a game. He's a stud. And he can play three positions.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 29, 2007 1:58 AM

Jason Rothschild is an idiot - latency gettin to ya?

Posted by: Anonymous | July 29, 2007 2:22 AM

What's up with JCN's Spanish team trying to give the Wiz a deadline about getting something done? How are they in a position to dictate anything since the buyout has been completed? JCN has already waited at least 5 years to get into the NBA, it won't kill him to wait however much longer it takes. I'm glad EG is not rushing anything, that's how mistakes often get made. Blatche is a ton of untapped potential and hopefully his agent won't play too much hardball with EG. I think he will stay in a Wiz uniform. Don't be too surprised if the Wiz remain stuck with both BTH and the Poet for a while, no team seems to be jumping for either of them. It's too easy to now say that EG should have just let the Poet escape to the Bucks a few years ago. As always hindsight is 20/20.

Posted by: low | July 29, 2007 3:37 AM

The question is with Navarro, now that his agent went back to Barcelona and got them to set a deadline, what's his move if the deadline comes and Ernie does nothing?
If he resigns in Spain, does he try his NBA dream again next summer? Or does he try and get a long term deal there? I can't imagine he's going to be willing to just walk back into the same deal he had over there with a 14m buyout. I'd really think as this deadline draws closer Navarro and other team's will start to feel the heat to get something done.
Ernie seems to already have determined that he's set his roster without Navarro. In the end he'd settle for a draft pick if it's a 1st rounder, but he's really still shopping for a way to move Daniels or Etan's contracts or Haywood if he can get an upgrade at center in the deal.
Finding a team willing to part with an expiring contract and take Etan or Daniels seem to be high on Ernie's list. Seperating Haywood and Eddie seem to be a lower priority.
Don't count Riley totally out of the Navarro race, there are alot of NBA people that seem to regard Navarro as more of a combo gaurd with slashing and scoring ability with a deadly long range jumper than a true point. Smush Parker doesn't give Riley another scoring and shooting option, if it's true Riley still has 2.8m left that probably just about enough to sign Navarro.
Riley doesn't have to be as concerned about Navarro's defense as we do.When somebody blows by him, which could be often, he's still got Shaq and Zo in the paint, we've still got problems at the 5. On a site where many have blasted the Wizard's defense repeatedly, the Navarro vs. Stevenson choice really boiled down to on thing. Who's the better defender?
All of the positives that I see Navarro bringing to a club Arenas already does. If we could clone Gilbert, could two high scoring penetrating point gaurds with three point range prosper in the same back court?
And on defense who's going to gaurd the D Wade's or even the Jason Richardson's in our division if we paired Navarro and Arenas? Not to mention what happens to Daniel's minutes.
I'll be more surprised than if there's not a deal for Navarro than if there is. But I wouldn't be shocked if it's after this so called deadline which is more of a PR ploy than anything. It really amounts to a way to keep Navarro's name on the front burner, come friday don't be shocked if we hear,"something's close so it's been extended".
This thing could roll on for awhile, and the Blatche situation could stretch til close to camp. There doesn't seem to be another bidder driving up the price, most are hoping that Blatche ends up signing the tender and becomes a FA next summer. That way it gives them another year for them to watch and see if this kid is really going to mature into something, or if he is another guy that flashes promise but never raises his game to the next level.
As much as Blatche and his agent want it to happen it doesn't look like anyone is going to help them get a rich long term deal out of Ernie. He's already proven if the deal on the table gets too rich he'll fold his hand and walk away.
Looking seriously at the deals that Hughes and Jeffries got and what they are producing, is their anyone that really thinks we should have matched either? Ernie has a reputation for being a good judge of developing talent. There's not many in the league that will try and drive up the price on Grunfeld like Thomas did last year when he left the Knicks holding the bag for a really bad deal.
Settle in folks, Ernie's dealing and he's in no hurry since he's holding the cards he wants. And McGuire, he'll sign, it's just going to be awhile. Grunfeld is still looking for an Ace to drop his way, but if it doesn't he'll keep playing for awhile yet.

Posted by: GM | July 29, 2007 9:09 AM

Ernie Grunfeld is the best GM The Wizards/Bullets Organization has had in decades. He's playing this just as he should. Boston, LA, Memphis, Golden State are all interested in "JNC" If no one bites then throw it back in the hopper for another year or two. I would like to see this ugly "Todd v. the Poet" issue cleared up before the start of next season though.

Posted by: Moeman | July 29, 2007 9:18 AM

low -- Barcelona still has power because JCN hasn't bought out of the contract yet. He has negotiated a buyout but has not exercised it yet - he won't exercise until he has a contract in place.

Posted by: Bill Baxter | July 29, 2007 9:31 AM

Lakers need a guard? Is that a reference to Smush signing with the Heat? The Lakers moved on without Smush as soon as they lost to the Suns in the first round. These goons need to pay more attention before spouting unfounded "rumors"...

Posted by: Anonymous | July 29, 2007 10:09 AM

Ivan, who in god's name has ever called JCN the Spanish "Michael Jordan?!?!?!?!" I saw clips, and his game is not above the rim. Let's just stick to "Spanish Juan Dixon" or "Spanish Gilby Arenas."

Posted by: DC Man88 | July 29, 2007 10:13 AM

the wizards are herting this kid just let him play for another team because nobody real care what he might bring to a team.
the wiz are not going to get no mush in return that what are you going to let this guard continue to play in europe, just a nove that in our division nobody gets that going to hert us please!
the league right now is no doing well with all the scondales that are going on now, let the guy play period.

Posted by: wizkid | July 29, 2007 11:05 AM

Why would the Lakers want him? He's really a shooting guard and they have Fisher, Crittenton and Farmar at the PG position. Let's face it, the Wizards will lose Navarro without getting anything for him.

http://www.cyberdunk.com/?ref=35180
(Create your own basketball player)

Posted by: eboknumber2 | July 29, 2007 11:43 AM

"Welcome to the real world, Ray."

Ummm, thanks???

;)

- Ray

Posted by: Ray | July 29, 2007 11:56 AM

If Navarro's only choice is to go back to the contract with a 14m buyout, then his agent will work overtime for a trade.
One thing to remember in all of this, if you go back and look at Ernie's comments just days before Navarro's agent announced the buyout the Wizards were proceeding thinking there was no way it was happening this year. This seemed to come out of no where as far as the Wizards were concerned.
For a guy that has been saying all the right things to the press about wanting to be a Wizard first, it seems a little strange that Grunfeld went to Spain personally twice this winter and then it appears we got blindsided by a buyout.
And then old Pat Riley says he was stopping off to see Navarro a couple of weeks ago. Did the Wizards grant him permission? Or was Riley supposed to be stopping by to discuss paella?
Did Navarro's agent think that Grunfeld would just let him walk to another team if we didn't have the cap space to sign him? I know some NBA teams have renounced the rights to Euro guys after a few years if they didn't come over. I'd agree with Ivan I'd drive a hard bargain to let him land in Miami,send him out west where we'll only see him a couple of time a year.
I think Navarro's agent is getting a taste of dealing with Grunfeld and other GM's in the Luxury Tax Era. If a team is capped out Navarro might be a luxury not many can afford.

Posted by: GM | July 29, 2007 12:06 PM

Don't you think its shame GM, that the Wizards won't go over the luxury tax for one year to sign Navarro. I mean if you have to pay it for one year, so what. It just seems like a waste unless we can get Etan's contract out of here with Navarro. I just wonder why the Suns haven't been mentioned as a suitor (esp. since they have an $8 mill trade exception now).

Posted by: George Templeton | July 29, 2007 12:21 PM

George,

The suns don't want any more salary... they can't afford it... that's why they keep selling draft picks... i doubt that they will use that trade exception except maybe in some sort of deal for garnett.

Posted by: Dante | July 29, 2007 12:33 PM

George the problem is not just the luxury tax. since we've already used part of our MLE we don't have the room capwise either. I'd really think there'd be a role for him on this team, just not at the expense of a decent defender in Stevenson.
DCman88 is right in that in many ways he might be as similar to Jaun Dixon as anything that we've seen here to compare him to. Which at 3 million a yr. isn't really a bad thing to have as a quick offense option off the bench. Lord knows when Arenas and Butler were down we could have really used him this year.
The problem is in order to get enough room under that cap to sign Navarro we've got to move something like 11m off the books. There was a pretty good posting here a couple of days ago explaining the Cap/Luxury Tax effects. It really isn't a matter of Pollin not wanting to go just a few million over the luxury tax as much as we don't have an exception left to sign him under the cap since we're over like most everybody else.
I would tend to think that Grunfeld and Stevenson's agent had a gentleman's agreement that Stevenson would opt out and get part of the MLE this year since we didn't have it available last year. Those handshake deals do seem to happen fairly often, to skirt the MLE thing. I think Ernie kept his word with Stevenson's agent because as a starter beside Arenas he provides us with much better defense than a Arenas/Navarro tandom. And we don't need to get any worse on defense.
But I'd agree I'd love to find a way to have Navarro coming off the bench. Only thing is we have less than 2m of the MLE left and only 1.8m in the LLE and you can't combine them.
But can Ernie smile and wink in Spanish, sign him to a min. deal and allow him to Opt out when we have the MLE available again. Even that might be better than chaining himself back to that 14m buyout.

Posted by: GM | July 29, 2007 12:58 PM

What about JCN for James Posey? I know he's a free agent but the Heat could sign him for like $6 million/year and then do a sign and trade. We get Posey, they get JCN, everyone is happy.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 29, 2007 1:01 PM

actually even if the lakers wanted him - they only have $1 mil left of their mle - if CJN costs just $1 mil the Wizards would be better of signing him - but my guess with a $3 mil buy-out JCN isn't signing for $1 mil.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 29, 2007 1:03 PM

Hey George Templeton,

Let's remember that it's not JUST the salary you pay JCN to get him here. You also have to pay the luxury tax amount, and the team forfeits their share of the Luxury tax distribution.

Individual teams are required to carry 13 players (12 active and one inactive). The Wiz have 10 players under contract for about $64.2 Million according to Ivan's article this morning.

So if they sign Blatche for $2.9M, McGuire for the minimum (I think it's around $427K), and fill in the other roster spot with a rookie minimum salary ($427K)... they will be RIGHT AT the Luxury tax limit of $67.9M in salaries.

So, if they then sign JCN for $3M per year (the number I've seen bandied about on these boards), you pay an additional $3M for the Luxury Tax, PLUS you forfit the Luxury Tax distribution payment (probably about $2.5M this year)...

So, is JCN really worth $8.5M?

Posted by: Rook | July 29, 2007 1:06 PM

I'm sorry Ray, I meant nothing personal.

I've just seen so many posts on these boards gushing over they guy it got to me. I'm glad Ivan addressed it when he explained why he calls him JNC. Hehe. Still makes me laugh.

Go Ray! Go Wizards! Man I wish the season were starting sooner, love me some ball.

Does anyone know if they are going to have a public practice down here at VCU this year?

Posted by: Patrick | July 29, 2007 1:57 PM

Any sign and trades that involve the Wiz getting back a contract in a 1 for 1 trade does not avoid the salary cap/tax issue. So, on the above suggestion, Posey for JCN means $6M added to the payroll since JCN counts for 0 right now.

Either he gets traded for a pick, or part of a package where it ends up to be less payroll on the books than there is now. Thomas, or AD, plus JCN for Swift and a pick might do it, or for Radmonovic and a pick (or rights to Gasol) from the Lakers, or something along those lines. Then the tax is avoided and there is some cap relief. Of course, the hard part is finding someone desperate (stupid) enough to take a bad contract.

If they do nothing with him, they lose the chance to get "something for nothing" since he was never in the Wiz' plan anyway. They keep his rights and it starts all over again a year or two (or more) from now vs. getting an immediate return for his rights when they obviously have no interest in him for themselves.

Posted by: Daydreamer | July 29, 2007 2:14 PM


Why are the wizards bumping up against the luxury tax? are they still on the hook for part of Juawan Howard's contract?

Posted by: noups | July 29, 2007 3:40 PM


Why are the wizards bumping up against the luxury tax? are they still on the hook for part of Juawan Howard's contract?

Posted by: noups | July 29, 2007 3:41 PM

Because Arenas makes $12 million, Antawn makes $16 million, Caron makes $8 million, Etan makes over $6 million, Daniels makes $6 million, and Haywood makes $5 million. That's $53 million for 6 players. Then Songalia makes $4 million and Deshawn makes $3 million, so you are already at $60 million. Juwan was traded not bought out, so there is no reason why he would still be on the WIz's books (this isn't football).

Posted by: Anonymous | July 29, 2007 4:00 PM

"Don't you think its shame GM, that the Wizards won't go over the luxury tax for one year to sign Navarro. I mean if you have to pay it for one year, so what. It just seems like a waste unless we can get Etan's contract out of here with Navarro. I just wonder why the Suns haven't been mentioned as a suitor (esp. since they have an $8 mill trade exception now).

Posted by: George Templeton | July 29, 2007 12:21 PM "


George, this goes back to what EJ mused about last season. He sees what other teams are doing and wonder why Les BouleS can't get those kind of guys, but quickly caught himself and said "I know, this team is on a budget." Abe is not a risk taker, and is content with status quo. Even a guy as greedy as Gilby knows this is a cheap team.

The way things are going now, and if Leonsis does not come aboard soon, I wonder if EG will quit if another opportunity comes up. Who wants to work for a tightwad owner who's not willing to take risks and can't even pick his own coach? I'm sure EG often wonders what he could do if he had an owner who spends freely (ie. Dallas, Portland, Miami, or the Knicks). If either of those jobs become open, and EG interviews, Les BouleS might as well kiss him goodbye.

Posted by: DC Man88 | July 29, 2007 4:38 PM

"DCman88 is right in that in many ways he might be as similar to Jaun Dixon as anything that we've seen here to compare him to. Which at 3 million a yr. isn't really a bad thing to have as a quick offense option off the bench......"

Posted by: GM | July 29, 2007 12:58 PM "


JESUS LORD!!!!!!!

Posted by: DC Man88 | July 29, 2007 4:41 PM

So, DC Man88 - From your post, I take it that you think that Polin should go over the Luxury Tax ceiling; pony up the $6M it would take to sign JCN, and lose the $2.5M Luxury Tax payment..?

Posted by: Rook | July 29, 2007 4:50 PM

I think Les BouleS, instead of wasting money on DS who had no leverage at all, should have spent the money on JCN whom EG spent gobs of time evaluating. Even before JCN, I would have focused monies on AB instead of DS.

Guys like DS are a dime a dozen, and DS didn't show anybody anything above and beyond the hype that he created on his own. Ok, so you hedge your bets that AB won't get a better offer out there, and you lowball him by offering him less than Amir Johnson. Is that going to inspire AB to commit to this franchise? If I were AB, I'd sign a 1 year offer and become unrestricted new season.

Given Les BouleS situation now, they are best to trade JCN's rights along with either BTH or ET and get something in return, maybe anything. EG would be fool to let JCN return Europe for nothing. Also, I highly doubt fences have been mended between BTH and EJ, and maybe even ET.

This team could implode this coming season with Gilby about to become a free agent, AJ leaving, BTH/ET/EJ situation, AB disgruntled, Nick Young and DMac emerging, no solid starting center, etc. For a team that was #1 before the all star break, I see tons of questions marks and uncertainties that weren't ironed out during the offseason.

Posted by: DC Man88 | July 29, 2007 5:27 PM

DC Man88,

I was just trying to understand your "cheap team" statement ... since the Wiz are one of a handfull of teams that will probably end up right at the Luxury Tax cap (but not one of the 4 or so that go over).

Thanks for the clarification..(?!?)

Posted by: Rook | July 29, 2007 5:38 PM

GM has made some very good points on this thread. A lot of what goes on with management and agents is arranged under the table, and that's very obviously what happened with Stevenson this summer. A verbal promise was honored. Equally obviously Riley had permission to meet with Navarro. Looks like he wasn't impressed.

And as for Navarro coming here--the Wizards don't need him, for a simple reason. They already have an International-style combo guard who rains three-pointers and plays matador defense; his name is Gilbert Arenas. And he's way tougher and more durable than Navarro and drives to the basket a lot better. Plus he's a lot younger in NBA years, which are like dog years on the legs. The best Navarro will ever be here is a talented 6th man like Ginobili. Would you want to build a franchise around Ginobili? I wouldn't, not outside South America. Donaghy won't be around to whistle his flops next season.

I would guess, barring some trade that takes everybody by surprise, that Navarro will get traded for a draft pick. But no one here that I've seen has pointed out that he might simply go for cash. The Wizards don't really need even a second first-round pick next season--enough repeat injuries to their Big Three (and with Jordan playing them 40 minutes per game at least one is all but guaranteed), and they could make the lottery on their own anyway. But if the cash price is high enough, then suddenly the Lux Tax is not an issue for Grunfeld--this year.

Posted by: KTV | July 29, 2007 5:40 PM

Paying the luxury tax has nothing to down tih it. There is no money left under the cap and no exceptions left to use.

Posted by: JJ | July 29, 2007 5:46 PM

...and you cannot use cash from the trade of a draft pick (or player) to lower your Salary Cap (or the Luxury Tax cap)...

It just goes into the team's coffers.

Posted by: Rook | July 29, 2007 6:11 PM

I'd rather have Navarro instead of Daniels personally. That is what is hurting us with the whole thing. When we lost Hughes we signed AD to a substantial contract expecting him to be our starting 2 with Gil. Instead he started off real slow, and found his role coming off the bench. In hindsight we paid him starter money and ended up with a backup point. Sure he's solid. But for a guy off the bench in limited minutes, I'd rather have a guy who could drop in 15 a night in 15-20 min a game. That's what Navarro would do.

Hey Ray, WELCOME TO THE REAL WORLD!!

Posted by: Darnell | July 29, 2007 6:13 PM

Um yes, Rook, I know it goes into the 'team's coffers'. The team's coffers are then what you use to pay off the Luxury Tax. Well, maybe a check.

Money is money.

Posted by: KTV | July 29, 2007 6:25 PM

"I'm sorry Ray, I meant nothing personal."

No worries, I know what you meant. ;)

- Ray

Posted by: Ray | July 29, 2007 7:40 PM

Darnell, you big goof. :P

:)

- Ray

Posted by: Ray | July 29, 2007 7:44 PM

How many of the Europeans aren't actually stiffs with a designer label? Pfund and Riley finally figured that out. Still, I'm guessing there's a drooling moron out there willing to grossly overpay for Navarro...like Danny Ferry, for example. I'm shocked that retard hasn't already swung a deal.

Posted by: Bill T. | July 29, 2007 7:53 PM

GM - you said "I would tend to think that Grunfeld and Stevenson's agent had a gentleman's agreement that Stevenson would opt out and get part of the MLE this year since we didn't have it available last year. Those handshake deals do seem to happen fairly often, to skirt the MLE thing. I think Ernie kept his word with Stevenson's agent "

Man, I'll bet you're right. Last year Stevenson signed for the Veteran minimum contract. IF there was a handshake agreement, and DS had a big year, he could clean up - otherwise he would just take the mid-level offer from Ernie. DS held out long enough this year to find out no one else wanted to pay him more and accepted the Wiz's mid-level offer.

Now about JCN: He waited too long to negotiate his way out of the $14M buyout. By the time he announced he wanted to play in the NBA, EG was already in negotiations with Stevenson.

IF two of the most respected GM's in the league have gone over to Spain to see this guy (Ernie twice, and Riley), and nothing gets done, then I'm thinking that maybe JCN is not the next big European star.

My prediction for our final opening day roster:
Gilbert Arenas
DeShawn Stevenson
Caron Butler
Antawn Jamison
Brendan Haywood
Darius Songaila
Antonio Daniels
Etan Thomas
Andre Blatche
Dominic McGuire
Oleksiy Pecherov
Nick Young
Aaron Miles - Inactive (D-League)

Posted by: Rook | July 29, 2007 7:59 PM

That should have read:
the next big European star to make a major contribution in the NBA.

Posted by: Rook | July 29, 2007 8:02 PM

Rook, I agree he waited too long. I remember Ivan asking Grunfeld about JNC after the draft and Ernie seemed resigned to fact that Navarro was not an option for this season. Since we drafted Young to fill that scorer off the bench role we don't as much need for Navarro. Navarro could really punish teams when they double up Arenas though. I mean he'd come in and be the 4th scoring option on the floor with wide open shots, he could do alot of damage in limited minutes. He's the type of player that could come in and be a momentum changer. I like Young, but he's gonna have some growing pains. I think JNC is able to step into that role immediately.

Posted by: Darnell | July 29, 2007 8:44 PM

One option could be the Spurs... they got at big 8 mil salary exception. Maybe we could deal Daniels to the Spurs for a salary exemption equal to AD's salary, and then sign JNC? AD is a former Spur, and their type of player, solid, dependable, mistake free, team oriented, leader-type of player. He'd be a nice backup to Parker. Then we'd have some salary relief, and enough room to sign JNC.

Posted by: Darnell | July 29, 2007 8:48 PM

Darnell,

Hard to tell about JCN. Sometimes success in Europe does not translate to the NBA.

Also, I've never seen him play - so all I have to go on is what the scouts and NBA GM's say about him. They all seem to say that he'd be a good 6th man. But for $3-$4Mil per year, that's a big gamble. We're already paying one backup guard, and one backup center too much.

I watched Young play in the Summer League games. Even though it's really too early to tell, I agree with you that he probably needs some seasoning - but he could eventually be that big gun off the bench.

Everyone seems to think we've upgraded our bench - and I tend to agree (with some hesitation).... I still don't see where we're gonna get that offensive spark when EJ goes to the bench... We already know what Thomas and Daniels bring. Blatch has only shown flashes. Pech, Young, and McGuire are all rookies. That leaves DSong; and although I like his game - I don't think he can create his own shot.

Funny - now that I'm thinking about it.. Our second team is a better defensive unit than our starters.

Posted by: Rook | July 29, 2007 9:00 PM

"DC Man88,

I was just trying to understand your "cheap team" statement ... since the Wiz are one of a handfull of teams that will probably end up right at the Luxury Tax cap (but not one of the 4 or so that go over).

Thanks for the clarification..(?!?)

Posted by: Rook | July 29, 2007 05:38 PM "


Rook, I think you should reference the quote from the lion's mouth, namely Gilby Arenas. He was quoted towards the end of the season how he admires other teams like Miami who act like champion teams, compared to Les BouleS. He was talking about things such as facilities, food, accomodations, how the players are treated, etc.

-------------------------------------------
"I asked Arenas last month what he thought the Wizards had to do to appease his wishes. He wouldn't campaign for the Wizards to acquire certain players, but he did say, "If you want a championship, you got to get a championship team."

He added: "I know this might not sound right, but the championship teams treat themselves like champions. You go into Miami's locker room, I'm like, 'Wow, what the hell is this?' Everything from their game-day meals for their players to every state-of-the-art thing you can imagine. As a player, why would you want to leave the locker room? I could sit there all day.

"We've been doing a better job, but it comes down to this: You treat your players like champions, they want to be champions," he added. "All the best teams in the league treat themselves first-class every day. Other players come over and think, 'They got this, they got that. Oh, I want to be here.' "

Whether Arenas was telling Abe Pollin and Ernie Grunfeld to upgrade the Wizards' facilities is up for debate. But he was clearly illustrating how the defending champions take care of their players. How the Wizards interpret Arenas's words gets to the issue of how much leverage stars have in this league."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/04/24/AR2007042402488.htm

-------------------------------------------

Being a cheap team is not just about salaries, but about some of things Gilby mentioned, including international scouting, more assistant coaches/trainers/ nutritionists/specialists, staying in first class facilities rather than your Abe's brother's motel chain, etc.

Ask yourself, if you were a free agent, would you prefer to play for a franchise like Dallas or Miami, or a team like Les BouleS?

Posted by: DC Man88 | July 29, 2007 9:09 PM

"And as for Navarro coming here--the Wizards don't need him, for a simple reason. They already have an International-style combo guard who rains three-pointers and plays matador defense; his name is Gilbert Arenas. And he's way tougher and more durable than Navarro and drives to the basket a lot better. Plus he's a lot younger in NBA years, which are like dog years on the legs. The best Navarro will ever be here is a talented 6th man like Ginobili. Would you want to build a franchise around Ginobili? I wouldn't, not outside South America. Donaghy won't be around to whistle his flops next season.

Posted by: KTV | July 29, 2007 05:40 PM "

KTV, I don't think it's fair to compare Gilby Arenas with JCN. Gilby will make 12 mil this season, and JCN wants around 3 mil. Given that, Les BouleS proved last season that their bench is beyond weak. If Gilby goes out, who do they turn to pick up the slack from the 1 and 2?

Posted by: DC Man88 | July 29, 2007 9:13 PM

If the NBA scouts and GMs all seem to say that he'd be a good 6th man, then he'd already be traded and signed. Navarro is a future NBA stud like Harold Miner was Baby Jordan.

Posted by: Bill; T. | July 29, 2007 9:18 PM

DC Man88 - George asked GM if he thought it was a "shame .... that the Wizards won't go over the luxury tax"

and you responded with:
"George, this goes back to what EJ mused about last season. He sees what other teams are doing and wonder why Les BouleS can't get those kind of guys, but quickly caught himself and said "I know, this team is on a budget." Abe is not a risk taker, and is content with status quo. Even a guy as greedy as Gilby knows this is a cheap team."

My bad - I thought you were responding with the "cheap" statement to George's question about the Luxury Tax.

So you were just making a statement about the general spending habits of the team for facilities, food, accomodations, etc...

Posted by: Rook | July 29, 2007 9:25 PM

Bill T.

I think that was my point.

If nothing happens by the end of this week, then I think we can all assume that the GM's in this league don't think JCN is worth a First round pick and an expiring contract.


Posted by: Rook | July 29, 2007 9:30 PM

So sayeth the Miami Heat fan Clewiston88:
"This team could implode this coming season with Gilby about to become a free agent, AJ leaving, BTH/ET/EJ situation, AB disgruntled, Nick Young and DMac emerging, no solid starting center, etc. For a team that was #1 before the all star break, I see tons of questions marks and uncertainties that weren't ironed out during the offseason."

Posted by: DC Man88 | July 29, 2007 05:27 PM

Posted by: Anonymous | July 29, 2007 9:47 PM

Rook,

Siiii, I was referring to how Abe has been running a franchise on a tight budget, cutting corners were he can. Even Bob Johnson, a tightwad himself, called Abe cheap. Now that's bad.

Personally, I don't think these athaletes (borrowed from JT2) need to be pampered with meals and all that, but I do think Les BouleS need to focus on international scouting more (and they have been as of late), better development of their big men, and you can take the rest from what Gilby said about the current state of the team.

Case in point when Caron said last season, when he was out with his injury, that he wanted to travel out to the west coast and play. I think Caron even said he was going to fly coach if he had to. Given that, I, as Abe Pollin, would have chartered a flight out there for him if he really wanted to play.

Also, I think Caron hurt his back after the plane sat on the runaway for several hours while waiting for a light back. These large athaletes can't sit coach on these regular planes. Abe needs to make this happen.

Posted by: DC Man88 | July 29, 2007 9:55 PM

Anon,

I think the Heat have a lot more problems than the Wiz.

They have four players over 30 years old - all of whom are injury prone. (JWill, Walker, Shaq and Zo) -

If Shaq goes down again (and he will), Zo will never pull major minutes - so that leaves them playing Doleac the majority of the time at center.... Michael Doleac as your starting center!

Walker is just done... he is an OLD 30!!!
and they have him for another 3 years at $8M per year! Nobody in their right mind will take that contract in trade; so the Heat are stuck with a Salary Cap problem for the next several years.

Haslem is a nice complimentary player, but certainly not a Second (or even third) option for scoring.

They just acquired Smush Parker...as their backup point guard ; but he'll be starting as soon as JWill goes down (AGAIN!).

I'm sure that's why Riley is interested in JCN. But he's not going to take on ANOTHER bad contract (Poet) just to bring in a guy that is untested in the NBA.

So, as soon as Shaq is injured, the Heat will play pretty good defense, but they'll be pathetic on offense.

Posted by: Rook | July 29, 2007 10:15 PM

So.....total proof DCMan and Clewiston88 are one and the same - even though he adamantly denied it all last season.

And he thinks he knows how to run and manage the team. What a laugh.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 29, 2007 10:16 PM

(shhh..... baiting that Heat fan).........

Posted by: Rook | July 29, 2007 10:17 PM

(be vewy vewy quiet)

Posted by: Rook | July 29, 2007 10:21 PM

Whatever loser. I can freely admit that I am not Clewiston88 and I am especially not a Heat fan. In case you haven't noticed, I'm not shy about making statements without having to hide anonymously.

If you believe that the "88" somehow signifies a relationship between me and that other person, then it's almost as dumb as saying anyone who blogs anywhere anonymously is you.

Posted by: DC Man88 | July 29, 2007 10:21 PM

BTW, even though Rook is acting like a jerk right now, I agree with his assessment of the Heat and do not care if they fail or prosper. Given that, they could be at least a middle of the rung type of team with a healthy DWade back.

Posted by: DC Man88 | July 29, 2007 10:25 PM

We all know Clewiston88 and DCwoMan88 are the same person. That was proven months ago. You were caught, remember? We do.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 29, 2007 10:26 PM

Wow... Not sure what I typed to deserve that.

Posted by: Rook | July 29, 2007 10:28 PM

Just like your dad was caught with his pants down when visiting Barney Frank.

Posted by: DC Man88 | July 29, 2007 10:28 PM

Rook, you're probably new here, but a suggestion: Stick to basketball and don't try to get cute.

Things can quickly spiral out of control, especially with a f$cktard like the anonymous person who's focusing on me rather than the subject of Les BouleS.

Posted by: DC Man88 | July 29, 2007 10:32 PM

Been here since the Blog started. Don't post much.

Been watching Wiz basketball since Wes Unseld was drafted.

I'm NOT cute; and I know it.... so I don't try to be.

I'm not sure why you called me a Jerk..but don't really care either.

Now back to basketball:

Further on the Heat -
DWade is making $13M this year (with 3 more on his contract)...
Shaq is making $20M this year (with 3 more years)...
Walker makes $8M (with 4 years remaining)
Haslem makes $6M (with 3 remaining)
and they're $12Mil over the cap - with NO chance to improve through trades or Free Agency.

Perhaps it's not a bad idea to give them the rights to JCN for a 1st round pick and a 2nd round pick. They may just be a lottery team.

Posted by: Rook | July 29, 2007 10:39 PM

Speaking of franks, I took one last nite after my twerps degree couldn't get me into the blue lagoon.

Posted by: DC Man88 | July 29, 2007 10:51 PM

Heck, I don't even know what the blue lagoon IS.

Anyhow, I kind of get tired of all the speculation on this board, but that's my problem, admittedly.

Anyone know who played at Barry Farms today?

Posted by: Mitch | July 29, 2007 11:33 PM

Darnell,
the Spurs are right at the luxury tax limit. If they got Daniels, they would have to pay his salary and dollar-for-dollar the luxury tax, meaning that they would pay AD 12 mill/yr. Unless I'm misunderstanding this salary exception thing.

Posted by: Emmet | July 29, 2007 11:56 PM

IMO the best deal we could make is with Utah, sending Navarro's rights for the rights to Kyrylo Fesenko and a draft pick.

Utah is in position to compete for the finals, and Navarro would be a nice addition for that goal. Utah is also one of few teams with the salary space to sign JNC once obtained.

Fesenko is an intriguing prospect, 7-1 270 center, with skills well suited to the princeton, a true low post game, compared to GS's Andris Biedrins. He is from the same country and league as Pecherov.

We are so close to the lux tax, we are unable to take on any additional salary. We can obtain Fesenko and leave him overseas for another season like we did with Pesh. He would not add to our cap this year, and we can add him next offseason after resigning Gil. And dealing JNC for Fesenko we can probably also get another draft pick of some sort included in the deal as well from Utah.

Build for the future

Posted by: Darnell | July 29, 2007 11:57 PM

The NBA would be so much better if it adopted the NFL's policy and did not have guaranteed contracts. Imagine if we could simply cut Poet and AD.

Posted by: Emmet | July 30, 2007 12:03 AM

All of you salary cap geeks (who couldn't contact anyone in the nba if your dull-ass lives depended on it) seriously need to stop actting like you're plugged into anything other than your own empty fantasies!You write as if you just had dinner with Ernie Grunfeld (you didn't), and everyone of of you except Ivan is making up garbage that no one believes other than yourselves and, let's see, maybe Santa Clause! Here's a hint: get girlfriends!!

Posted by: Anonymous | July 30, 2007 12:43 AM

Some good points on the Navarro situation, especially yours rook about including the cost of the lux tax with Navarro's contract.
I just think we are all going to look back at choosing Stevenson over Navarro in a year and wonder what the hell were the Wizards thinking (even though Stevenson isn't that expensive). And if Gilbert does split it is only going to look worse.
But enough about that, I am guessing that Antawn won't be dealt during the summer because he hasn't been dealt by now. I really can't see the Wizards dealing him during the season because I don't think Ernie could convince Abe, Eddie and Gilbert of the merits of doing that no matter who the Wizards could get. What do you all think?

Posted by: George Templeton | July 30, 2007 12:46 AM

From the other side of the Atlantic, you're quite missing the point when critizicing Navarro. The problem is FC Barcelona. As far as you don't understand it is a competition team with a competitive life, not just a repository of prospects, you won't understand the problems there have been. Navarro was drafted in 2002. You should have taken him then. From 2003, the club has had to overcome a financial crisis, and the only way to keep the basketball team in a decent position was keeping Navarro at any cost. It was forced a negotiation with the player, and that's why there is the so high buyout (thank he plays for a team of the spanish league, in any other country he wouldn't have buyout). Now the situation is stable again, the president can take a hard decision of letting Navarro go, just as a congrat for all this years of commitment and hard work, and before he's beggining to get too old to get to the NBA.

Navarro is happy in Barcelona. But Europe has got too small for his basketball, so he wants to try the NBA before it's too late. NBA is a lobby of teams that send the players wherever they want, so he just doesn't mind which team he plays for.

And I feel someone is underrating him. Scouts see him as a 6th as average, not as best. He's a gamble. He's a hell of a player in Europe, nobody knows what would happen in the NBA. He can score a lot. He would have to adapt to the different refereeing. He's smart, hardworking, and teamworking. He's not a strong defender. He can be the next Jasikevicius or the next Ginobili. You can lose... but you can win a lot too (and I feel that Jasikevicius hasn't still said his last word!).

But it's not Navarro who decides when the teams leaves him go, it's not Navarro who needs a decision to be taken before a week, the same way it's not him who decides which team in the NBA he's gonna play for. Barcelona is not a team of the NCAA.


PD: Here, nicks with 88 usually mean nazi adhesion. 88 is an acronym for Heil Hitler (the H is the 8th word of the alphabet). This, or you're speaking with someone born in the year 1988, who knows. These are the two most common reasons to have a 88 in the nick.

Posted by: Catalan | July 30, 2007 1:16 AM

JCN for Kwame Brown?

And, no, I'm not really serious.

Posted by: JPT | July 30, 2007 1:28 AM

Kwame Brown for HOF

Posted by: Dr Kitchen | July 30, 2007 7:19 AM

After reading Ivan's explanation about "JNC," I wondered whether Michael Lee wrote this post. Many of you will remember the Post chat when Lee went berserk on people who posted any positive comments or questions about Haywood, with responses like, "If Haywood is so great, why don't the Wizards trade him straight up for Tim Duncan?"

Now Ivan is pulling the same bull? I don't recall anyone on this blog saying anything close to the opinion that Navarro is the next Michael Jordan. But Ivan likes to hold the same opinion as Wizards management for some reason, so if the Wizards are looking to trade a guy, that guy obviously has no skill and Ivan disparages anyone who suggests otherwise. Nice.

Posted by: Sean | July 30, 2007 8:47 AM

this was from el deportivo, translated with alta vista... its awful, but you can tell the general consensus in not only memphis but in spain (gasol was just cover boy over there) is that the two of them shoud play no matter what. and i dont buy any other teams saying the price will drop... WORST case scenario is we send him to some western conference team for a second rounder.


Juan Navarrese Carlos and Pau Gasol, probably the most successful pair of the history of basket Spanish, agreed during many years in the Barça and in the Selection and now they can also do it in the NBA, concretely in the Memphis Grizzlies. This American tax exemption is the one that is negotiating at the moment more actively with the Washingtons Wizards, the equipment which it has right NBA of Navarrese, to take control of the services of crack azulgrana. In these last weeks they have asked and 10 sets of the American league have been interested in ' the Bombá approximately about, but finally the one that continues insisting and betting by Navarrese is Memphis, where Gasol takes six seasons being main the referring one. The offensive of the Grizzlies is right now in its final straight line. As much it is so it is hoped as much that tomorrow same something can be known definitive, in a sense as in another one. It is necessary to remember that the Barça put days ago a term limit - the 3 of August so that Navarrese communicated to him definitively if march to the NBA or remains in the Barça. The own player, although has not marked at any moment dates limits, also he prefers that all this subject is solved as rapidly as possible to thus be able to be centered in the Selection and the Eurobasket. So that the operation can be carried out, nevertheless, it is necessary that the Grizzlies guarantees to Navarrese a contract with which does not lose money with respect to which it perceives at the moment in the Barça considering that it has to pay an amount to the azulgrana club to free itself and also it is necessary to give something in return to the Wizards, which they do not count on ' the Bombá, so that they accept to transfer to the Spanish escort. In the equipment of Memphis, crack azulgrana would not be with too much competition in the position of ' unó and ' dos', reason why in theory it could have enough minutes of game. If any crossing does not take place that alters laplantilla, the bases of the equipment are Damon Stoudamire, a veteran come to less, and Mike Conley Jr. and Kyle Lowry, two very promising young people but with very little experience. In the outer positions they emphasize Mike MillEr and Rudy Gay, two players of talent, but that they rather occupy the position of ' tres'. , on the other hand Navarrese also it would have the advantage to have to his side to his great friend Pau Gasol like mentor, with which the adaptation and integration to the city and the equipment would be much more fast, something that always is important. If finally tomorrow it is confirmed that Navarrese ' vuelá in the direction of Memphis will have finished a relation, the one of ' the Bombá and the Barça, that began in 1992, when it was gotten up to the infantile equipment of the azulgrana club. In these last 15 years, ' Juanquí, as they nickname many affectionately to him, has gained it absolutely everything and it has become the main reference of the Barça of basket. Its next great challenge now is to prove itself in the NBA. Joan Laporta opened the door to him ' flexibilizar' - really and actually, to reduce its clause of rescission, that was based in 10 million euros, and Navarrese does not want to fail to take advantage of this historical opportunity

Posted by: greek mike | July 30, 2007 8:53 AM

Rook, got you by a year! went to my first NBA game when Earl "The Pearl" was a rookie.
88'er just when you go and say something intelligent that pertained to basketball you go off into another one of speels. I know it's somebody else's fault. Always is!
It would be nice to come up with a trade tha we could find enough cap releif to sign Navarro. Problem is seems like the only chip we have to offer in a trade for salary cap releif is Navarro.
I'd agree that if Grunfeld had known about Navarro's buyout prior to the draft it could have changed his statagy. But Young does seem like he's the potential bench scorer that we need. He may take longer to develop but may have a higher upside than Navarro.
I'd be surprised if the Spurs would bite on Daniels alone, but they may take a run at Navarro if he's included. I can see him fitting in where he's surrounded by vets and good defenders. Besides the Trade Excemption they have, I think Barry is in the last year of his deal.

Posted by: GM | July 30, 2007 9:17 AM

How about Ronny Turiaf?

he'd be a great starting 5 for us

Posted by: Jasper | July 30, 2007 10:25 AM

How about Ronny Turiaf?

he'd be a great starting 5 for us

Posted by: Jasper | July 30, 2007 10:25 AM

they need 2 package up jnc,etan,and brendan haywood 4 a nice offer 4 a big man dat is a real dominate

Posted by: ace | July 30, 2007 10:44 AM

they need 2 package up jnc,etan,and brendan haywood 4 a nice offer 4 a big man dat is a real dominate

Posted by: ace | July 30, 2007 10:44 AM

The luxury tax distribution won't be $2.5 million per team next year. It was about $2 million each this year, with the Knicks being by far the biggest payer. But the Knicks dropped about $40 million from their payroll this summer (Allan Houston, Jerome Williams, Shandon Anderson, etc) so their bill is going way down.

Posted by: Joe Blazer | July 30, 2007 10:52 AM

KEEP NAVARRO

Posted by: whooo whooo whoooo | July 30, 2007 11:05 AM

KEEP NAVARRO

Posted by: whooo whooo whoooo | July 30, 2007 11:05 AM

Looks like the Celtics are about to get better then the Wizards. This is what happens when you sit on your hands EG:

http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/7073708?MSNHPHMA

- Ray

Posted by: Ray | July 30, 2007 11:09 AM

The Wiz should get Pau Gasol and sign Navarro.

Posted by: Jesse | July 30, 2007 11:35 AM

Starting 5:

Gasol
Songaila
Butler
Stevenson
Arenas

What do you think?

Posted by: Anonymous | July 30, 2007 11:42 AM

Blows my mind why some of you keep fantasizing about impossible lineups. Ain't gonna happen.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 30, 2007 11:54 AM

The Wiz should get Lebron too while we're in NBA Live mode.

Posted by: Stringer | July 30, 2007 12:01 PM

at this point the Lakers could send the rights to Marc Gasol, but to get Turiaf we'd have to send them salary and don't have any that match up. Phil loves big PG's so Daniels might be tempting for them. But they don't have any salaries that easily get them in range of AD's. We don't have the roster spots to take back Vujacic, Turiaf, Mo Evans and others.

Again, a 3rd team is needed.

Utah signed Jason Hart and will sign Price at PG. So they don't have enough of the MLE left to offer JCN.

At this point, Memphis is back front and center.

Posted by: Monte | July 30, 2007 12:16 PM

Don't get too much confident about the spanish press, they're like a father speaking about his children: they are the best of the team, they should always play, etc etc. It's always better to look for the original source, because in Spain they don't want to take the NBA seriously, and in the US they simply don't know about what's abroad more than what someone once said.

If the Wizards wanted to sign Navarro, it's not that complicated. Someone has to go to Barcelona, ask for Zoran Savic (the manager of the basketball team), and negotiate. It's always hard to deal with a serbian, but Barça has said that they're going to listen. I think I understood that the Wizs only have cap for 1,8 million this year, but it improves for the following years. So a possible offer would be 1,8 million this year (1 for Barça, 0,8 for Navarro), and 3,8 the two or three following years (3 for Barça and 0,8 for the player). This, plus the money the NBA lets the club pay (I think it's something like 0,5 million). And a friendly match to be played in preseason. Or a player that the Wizs don't really need. Or whatever else. And Barça to have the rights for the player when he leaves the NBA. Or whatever. There are a lot of things the Wizads can offer, it's just a matter of creativity. Brainstorming! The player only needs the money to pay the buyout, so the best option is to speak directly with the owner of the buyout.

All this has to be taken into account, obviously, only if the Wizards want to keep him. That's the doubtful thing right now.

Posted by: Catalan | July 30, 2007 12:29 PM

While they do have money to offer after this year, he can't get that big of a raise from the 1.8 level, in his second year. They almost have to sign him to a 1 year deal. I don't see why he'd accept that. he needs 3 or 4 years for guaranteed money to make it work.

At this point AD and JCN for Stoudamire and Kinsey and a 2nd round pick looks to be about as good as it gets. It saves around 800K this year and Damon comes off the books a year earlier than Daniels.

Kinsey is a nice second year player who can play multiple positions. He could play some defensive 2 while Young figures out the NBA on that end.

Posted by: Monte | July 30, 2007 12:51 PM

haywood is the worst

Posted by: Anonymous | July 30, 2007 12:58 PM

monte and his trades are retarded. Why do we want 2 PG's we have gilbert who never comes off the floor.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 30, 2007 1:00 PM

I would like to see the WIZ trade AD and sign JCN.

Posted by: Cypress | July 30, 2007 1:05 PM

uh oh, sounds like someone's feelings got hurt and now they forgot to add a username. So I'll just call you Baiter.

We're gonna wind up with 3 PGs should Miles make the team (just like last year cuz thats how they put together). AD and Stoudamire are comparable, except Damon has a better 3 point shot, better contract, and would be a better short term fill in for GA. if we need a long term fill in we're screwed anyway. The point is to give Gilbert more of a rest anyway.

Its not a great deal but its better than handing him to Miami for a package of picks. Fact remains we aren't going to get a great deal for him. So instead of trying to figure out how to get Gasol I stick to reality.

btw, trading AD doesn't give us the room to sign Navarro. We can't "just sign him".

Posted by: Monte | July 30, 2007 1:27 PM

Jasper,

I'd love to have Turiaf on the Wiz. He's just the type of hustling, all-out-energy big man the Wiz need. But he's a PF, not a C. And the Wiz are already crowded at the 4 (assuming they don't lose Blatche). Anyway, if the Lakers want Navarro, Bynam should be the first big man the Wiz ask about. When they say "no" to that, then ask about Turiaf.

Posted by: kalorama | July 30, 2007 2:08 PM

boo

Posted by: navid | July 30, 2007 2:45 PM

Turiaf would fit, and he comes cheap. The problem is finding salary to include that matches. (and doesn't include taking on Radmanovic)

Posted by: Stringer | July 30, 2007 2:50 PM

i think we're looking the wrong way here for trading JNC.

apparently, the celtics are close to trading for garnett. word is that they need extra contracts to get the deal done. as of now, the report is that they would trade jefferson, gomes, green, telfair, ratliff, and two #1s for garnett. that seems ridiculous (trades 5 players and depletes boston's roster), and still doesn't even work b/c it doesn't account for garnett's trade kicker.

so how about the wiz jump in and trade JNC and etan to the t-wolves, in exchange for the t-wolves #1 pick. dumps etan's contract and gets a sure lottery pick for next year.

Posted by: kp | July 30, 2007 3:18 PM

Boy it sure is awesome how frequently this blog is updated. Good thing the Washington Post has two guys on the job. Well done.

Posted by: Tenzing Norgay | July 30, 2007 3:29 PM

It's pretty unlikely the Wolves would trade away a 1st round pick, since acquiring furst rounders is one of the primary goals of trading Garnett.

And trading those assets for Garnett is a very good deal for a Boston franchise coming off a decade of failure with a coach and GM on the hot seat to make something happen now. A core of Garnett, Allen, and Pierce has a very good shot at winning the East.

Posted by: kalorama | July 30, 2007 3:31 PM

The salaries still have to match, we can't just give Etan away. They would if they could.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 30, 2007 3:46 PM

kalorama-

sure, it's a great deal for boston, but it doesn't work, even with all the salaries lined up because it doesn't account for kg's trade kicker. boston has nothing else to trade, so they need a third party to account for the $6.5 million. and sure the t-wolves want to load up on #1s, but they're getting two from the celts. but assuming they wouldn't want to part with a lottery pick, i'd take one of the celts #1s or brewer or foye (either of whom becomes expendable to the t-wolves after the addition of JCN and green) instead of the #1. But if the wiz have to take back a guard, I'm sure they'd want to dump AD's contract instead of etan's.

the best option for the wiz is to get a draft pick in return and send etan and JCN to the t-wolves. i don't see a better deal out there.

Posted by: kp | July 30, 2007 3:53 PM

3:46, you're right. this would be part of the celtics deal for garnett. it would be a 3-way trade.

Posted by: kp | July 30, 2007 3:59 PM

Is JCN hungry enough for the NBA to play in the frozen hinterland for a team in rebuild mode? Minnesota's a long way from Miami...

Posted by: reispace | July 30, 2007 4:03 PM

"the best option for the wiz is to get a draft pick in return and send etan and JCN to the t-wolves."

But that's probably not the best option for the Timberwolves. Also ( even a 3-way deal, don't salaries have to match (within 15%) coming and going? If so, the Wiz couldn't just trade Etan and Navarro's rights for a pick to the T'Wolves in a 3-way anymore than they could in a straight up deal. They'd still have to take on some kind of salary.

Posted by: kalorama | July 30, 2007 4:10 PM

According to cnnsi, a deal is imminent for Garnett. ...

Posted by: mark | July 30, 2007 4:16 PM

OFF TOPIC: Any chance of moving AJ to the bench next year?

Our reserve play was terrible last year and AJ showed in the playoffs he could still get his points without the Big 2 on the floor. AJ coming off the bench would be like Ginobili for the Spurs -- a real go-to guy on the 2nd team who can create match-up problems for the other team.

The 1st team doesn't suffer much of a dropoff b/c Gil & Caron get the lion's share of the ball already. A healthier DSong and a wiser Blatche wouldn't be too much of a drop-off. Plus the best 5 (including AJ) would finish the games (again, like the Spurs), so AJ should still get 30+ minutes and 15+ ppg.

Thoughts?

Posted by: mik_smith | July 30, 2007 4:25 PM

All of these teams are over the salary cap. So the Wiz still have to take salary back to make it work. It doesn't work for just a pick. Plus Minnesota wants to stock pile picks not give them away.

-Green is nowhere near the prospect that Foye or Brewer are. We aren't getting a lottery pick for Navarro alone, let alone Navarro and Etan. There's no better deal out there including this one.

And I'm not sure why Minnesota wants Navarro as part of their rebuilding plan to begin with. I don't see the point. Boston would love him though.

Posted by: Johnny Boy | July 30, 2007 4:26 PM

mik_smith,

My thoughts are that if the Wiz had a legit, all-out effort rebounding, defending big at C, starting Songaila at PF and bringing Jamison off the bench would be a good move.

Two problems, however: They don't have a legit, all-out effort rebounding, defending big at C and Jamison likely wouldn't want to come off the bench.

Posted by: kalorama | July 30, 2007 4:43 PM

mike, i think thats where they're heading with all of these 4's in the pipeline. Increase Blatche's time this season to prepare him for a potential starting spot.

i think they picture Pesh (eventually) as a back up to the Center position, spreading the floor with his shooting.

I can't compare productivity though. Jamison is still far beyond what we have seen form the younger crowd. Songalia should help, but he can't handle starting 4's anymore than Jamison can.

Posted by: Stringer | July 30, 2007 4:50 PM

actually, the wiz do not have to take salary if they are not taking a player. the way the rules work is that teams above the cap cannot acquire more than 125% plus $100,000 of the salary they trade away. there is no lower limit--teams can divest as much salary as they want if they don't take on additional salary. the teams that do take on additional salary must be within that 125% range. which is why if etan and JCN go to the t-wolves and the wiz just take back a draft pick, the deal works under the rules. check the espn trade machine if you don't agree.

why would the t-wolves do this? because they and the celts need to find a way to compensate for the 6.5million KG trade kicker and because they would otherwise be starting mark madsen at the 4 and because they have no shooters (JCN).

Posted by: kp | July 30, 2007 4:55 PM

Stringer,

No one's going to confuse Songaila with Rodman at his prime, but at full strength with his lets under him (which he never had last seasons) he's easily a better, stronger, hustling low post defender than Jamison. Damning with faint praise, I know. But still...

But the real reason I think he'd make a better choice for starting POF (along side a bruising boarding C) is because he'd give them a better, more reliabel low post scoring presence at the 4 than Jamison. Jamison has post ability but (A) he rarely seems inclined to use it and (B) he's most effective matched up against SFs in the post.

Posted by: kalorama | July 30, 2007 4:55 PM

Ye gods!

Please excuse the typos in that last post. I was in a hurry and didn't have chance to proof it.

Geez, that's embarrassing.

Posted by: kalorama | July 30, 2007 5:08 PM

agree to disagree then.

I saw Songalia scoring from the elbow not the post. His post points are the same as AJ's: put backs and effort points. He was scoring on second team defenders too. Plus he's never been an above the rim player either. Now he'd be asked to score on Haslem, not Simien, Howard or Battie instead of (insert whoever is their backup now, Garrity?) etc.

For all we know, he may do a slightly better job defensively. AJ would now be getting the bulk of his miuntes versus backups. So the overall +/- could be in our favor. I wouldn't bet on it though. I think he'd rack up fouls quick too.

Posted by: Stringer | July 30, 2007 5:19 PM

trade mahcine isn't taking either player's trade kicker into account. so how can you be sure it works?

Posted by: Anonymous | July 30, 2007 5:29 PM

You get a better pick from Boston if Navarro goes there while Etan goes to the Wolves.

that would leave Minnesota with 7.9 tied into Blount and over 7 (over 21 for 3 years) tied into Etan.

definitely worth trying if it clears us of Etan without taking any salary back.

Posted by: Monte | July 30, 2007 5:41 PM

Songaila doesn't need to be an above the rim player to be an effective post scorer or defender.

He's stronger than Jamison and would have better success using his body to root guys out of postion defensively. And scoring in the post isn't necessarily about outjumping guys at the rim. It's about strength, positioning, and footwork, all of which were compromised for Songaila last season because of his back injury (which is why he took more standstill jumpers outside and made fewer inside moves). The fact that he can play both inside and out actually works for the Wiz.

Like I said, he's not a great defender by any means, but he's got better physical tools and a more willing mindset to play it than Jamison.

Posted by: kalorama | July 30, 2007 5:48 PM

Not being an above the rim player comes into play when the guy guarding you is Chris Bosh, or Howard, or even Shelden Williams. He can't score if he can't get his shot off. It comes into play when you're barely pushing 6'8 and don't have above average quickness for your position.

hitting jumpers is perfect in this offense. But its not post scoring. he's never been a classic post up player.

Posted by: Stringer | July 30, 2007 6:04 PM

i think antawn would do anything for the team as long as we could win.
he came off the bench for the Mavericks the 03-04 season and was 6th man of the year started only 1 game whole year and was still effective. I think its crazy, though, to put songalia into the starting lineup over antawn.

Posted by: TDAV | July 30, 2007 6:24 PM

i think antawn would do anything for the team as long as we could win.
he came off the bench for the Mavericks the 03-04 season and was 6th man of the year started only 1 game whole year and was still effective. I think its crazy, though, to put songalia into the starting lineup over antawn.

Posted by: TDAV | July 30, 2007 6:24 PM

i think antawn would do anything for the team as long as we could win.
he came off the bench for the Mavericks the 03-04 season and was 6th man of the year started only 1 game whole year and was still effective. I think its crazy, though, to put songalia into the starting lineup over antawn.

Posted by: TDAV | July 30, 2007 6:24 PM

Looking ahead to next year, I'm worrying more and more about the logic of not trading Jamison. Even after trading for J-Rich and re-signing Gerald Wallace, the Bobcats payroll for next year will be approx. $47 million. That will place them at least $20 million under the luxury tax going into next offseason.
Jamison will be a free agent next year.
Jamison spoke in early July to the Charlotte Observer about the possibility of finishing his career with the Bobcats.
"I asked him if he thought he might end his career with the Bobcats.
He took pains to say he was content playing for the Wizards, then added: 'It's not far-fetched whatsoever. I've got some good ties down here. ... I would love to come home and have the opportunity to play. If it happens, great. If not, I'm definitely happy with the situation in Washington.'"

Bobcats will have significant salary available for Jamison, and the Wizards who will resign Arenas to a max contract next summer will not have that space. Furthermore, Jamison wants to play for the
Bobcats, in his home state of North Carolina.

Sounds to me that there's a good chance we will lose AJ next summer for NOTHING, whereas we might have traded him this summer and got something in return.

Posted by: Emmet | July 30, 2007 7:12 PM

As they call it, playing down to the level of your competition, or in this case, your antagonists.

Posted by: DC Man88 | July 30, 2007 8:19 PM

G's up Hoes down

Posted by: Anonymous | July 30, 2007 9:27 PM

Yer mamma responds kindly.

Posted by: DC Man88 | July 30, 2007 10:24 PM

Stringer you should get your facts straight about his height before saying that just cuz he can't play above the rim means he can't be effective scoring or defensively. With shoes, he measured out as 6'9.5" like Chris Wilcox and Carlos Boozer with a very good wing span of 7'1" as well.

http://www.draftexpress.com/measurements.php?year=2002&sort2=ASC&draft=100&sort=

Certain of players like Othella Harrington, Juwan Howard, Corliss Williamson, and even Zach Randolph do not play above the rim but can still be effective. Although DS' biggest offensive strength is his elbow jumper and high post passing skills, there were more than a few games where he used the rolling hook shot very well.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 30, 2007 10:44 PM

Height and wingspan are important characteristics, but given that, I wouldn't take wingspan over pure height. A guy with height usually has more bulk/build in his frame, and takes up more space down low, so could be in better position to box out and get the board. I'm shocked to see that Caron is really only 6-5 without his shoes on.

Posted by: DC Man88 | July 30, 2007 10:54 PM

Who would have thought that Jordan Farmar has a 42" vertical? Nate Robinson at 5-8 has a 43.5" vertical.

Posted by: DC Man88 | July 30, 2007 10:59 PM

I'm not shocked at all about Caron's height if you compare him to Gil and Stevenson. I don't totally agree on the height and bulk/build correlation. That bulk build is more correlated to bone structure that allows you to have a thickness and muscle structure. Neither Elton Brand or Carlos Boozer have a lot of height for the 4 but they make that up with their wingspan and thick frame without giving up quickness. Caron is also built in a similar manner whereas a guy like KG has the height but his frame is not so solid. If he were to put on weight to where it is similar to his height that a Brand/Boozer would carry, he'd lose too much of his explosiveness and he would actually look fat. Those skinny framed guys just don't look like they carry the weight well.

Having that 42" vertical is nice and all if you actually used it in a game of bball. On that same site and test, DWade measured a 35" vertical for which I'm sure he underperformed that day but he certainly uses whatever God given vertical in a game much more than Farmar. There's more to the game that just the measurements, it's a small part of the equation. It's the tools you work with, if only you can maximize those tools. If you don't, it's just a waste whereas someone with less tools but maximizes them can be a much better player overall.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 31, 2007 10:49 AM

height without shoes: 6'8. My facts were fine.

I never said people his height can't have a good post game. Corlis Williamson is pushing 6'5 but he operated as Detroit's main post offense off the bench in the title run. But being that height doesn't give Songalia Boozer or Wilcox's game. Love the irony of you replying by saying that because other guys his height are successful he is too. that makes a lot of sense.

What I said was thats never been his game. Checking ESPN's review of him: "He has a very limited post game and isn't a great finisher around the basket, mostly because at 6-8 he's short for a power forward and he isn't a great athlete."

I was being nice compared to them. Putting him up against the best 4's in the East is not recipe for success and won't lead to post production. His points will mainly come from the elbow, baseline and top of the key jumpers. There's nothing wrong with that. Just don't assume he is a low post threat, he's not. He'll get his share of put backs and we'll be happy to have them.

There's also a difference on defense. From the same review:
"Songaila's size also gets him in trouble at the defensive end. Post players have little trouble shooting over him and he has below average strength so they usually get good position."

When opposing players know their defender can't block their shot it makes things very easy. They take their pet shots the same way they've done 10,000 times in practice because they're comfortable. Songalia doesn't make anyone uncomfortable guarding them.

Clearly his best role is coming off the bench, pulling reserve forwards away from the basket while playing the pick and pop game with our guards.

He's going to help the team a lot this year. he's a quality player. Alas, people tend to go over board at this time of year projecting impact. Counting on Darius Songalia as your starting PF and projecting post scoring and above average post defense from him is just that, overboard. The NBA is about match-ups and Songalia versus first tier 4's is a bad match-up.

Posted by: Stringer | July 31, 2007 11:34 AM

TRADE:
-Etan Thomas
-JCN
-Blatche

FOR:
Seatlles
-Carl Wilcox
-"Future Draft" or another player who fits the Finance

Washington: get Wilcox, a true PF who can step in immediately and take the pounding away from Jamison. Here we can allieviate some cap issues. We also relieve our CAP issue w dumping Etan, and hopefully get another player in return.

Seattle: gets, Blatche another 6'10 playa who make Seattle "very very" young and talented. Seattle also gets JCN, whom are short of scoring guards. They also get Etan, who fits nicely as D-Fense presence.

Posted by: Bullets | July 31, 2007 12:20 PM

Carl?

Posted by: Anonymous | July 31, 2007 3:25 PM

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