Will Miami step up for Navarro?

It will be interesting to see what Pat Riley does now that Steve Francis chose to sign with Houston rather than Miami. It's no secret that Riley is near desperate to add a playmaking guard with Gary Payton entering retirement and Jason Kapono now a member of the Toronto Raptors. Riley made a strong pitch to Mo Williams but he took more money to stay in Milwaukee and now Francis is off the board as well. The market is getting tight.

So, the question is: how badly does Riley want Juan Carlos Navarro and what is he willing to give up for him? I've heard that Miami has called offering a combination of draft picks but I have no idea what kind of picks they are. Would a first and second get it done? And even if Riley makes a sexy offer, does Ernie Grunfeld really want to help a division rival by handing over an experienced scorer who will also have a chip on his shoulder whenever the Heat comes to town? The wild card in all of this continues to be Memphis. I hear that Pau Gasol has all but demanded that the Grizz do whatever it takes to get JNC.

Bottom line: something is going to get done one way or the other pretty soon. One thing to keep in mind is that Navarro could just say: "forget it" and go back to F.C. Barcelona. In that case, the Wiz would lose any chance of getting something for him. He may not get that sweatheart buyout option ever again. Don't be shocked if we start reading stories coming out of the Spanish media detailing how Navarro is being done wrong and should just stay home.

As for the Andray Blatche situation: I continue to hear that teams have interest but that nobody is willing to cough up a full mid-level. I think Ernie did a savvy thing by making it clear early on that he planned on matching any offer made to Blatche. That may have scared teams off. We'll see.

I have heard that Andray is working his tail off this summer and that's a good thing all the way around. He'd better be ready because it appears that Eddie Jordan is going to have some serious decision to make when it comes to handing out playing time, especially if Dominic McGuire comes into training camp and does what he did in Las Vegas.


By Ivan Carter |  July 20, 2007; 12:19 PM ET
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Comments

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We should stand pat and wait until December 15th to trade with Memphis for Darko.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 20, 2007 12:34 PM

All I can say is Ernie would be crazy to let Miami get JCN - especially for flippin' draft picks. Miami is our enemy.

Posted by: Lisa | July 20, 2007 12:34 PM

I disagree that the Wizards risk losing any chance of getting something for Navarro if they don't trade him soon. Sure, Navarro could think, "I know I just sprung the fact that I could get out of my Barcelona contract on the Wizards a couple of weeks ago, but if they don't sign me to a big enough contract or trade me soon, I'll give up on my NBA dreams and just play in Europe the rest of my career." But what are the odds that he adopts that unreasonable line of thinking for the long haul?

(I imagine Ivan might be saying this because Navarro's agent told Ivan that Navarro could just say "Forget it." All part of the negotiation process.)

Ernie can and should look for a deal he finds appropriate for someone with the abilities of Navarro, and if he doesn't get it, either sign Navarro this summer if he has any money available, or sign him next summer, if Navarro is available then. If Navarro wants to play in the NBA, Ernie holds all the cards.

Posted by: Sean | July 20, 2007 12:42 PM

Lisa, I don't think Ernie is that crazy and that's why he hasn't taken Riley up on any of his offers. Other than D-Wade or Shaq, he has no assets to give up (maybe Haslem). IMO, I think Ernie is trying to use Miami's offer to get a little bit more out of Memphis.

Posted by: C.Bell | July 20, 2007 12:43 PM

And Ivan was right... While reading espn.com last night, I came across an article that said FC Barcelona was going to make an offer for Navarro. Maybe he doesn't want to leave and is just gassing everybody up to drive up his price! Kudos to you Ivan for pointing this out even before JCN was let out of his contract.

Posted by: C.Bell | July 20, 2007 12:48 PM

And no, we shouldn't try and trade him for Darko.

Posted by: C.Bell | July 20, 2007 12:51 PM

If Memphis is desperate enough, they'll bite. And there's no sense in them not trying to make Gasol happy. Lord knows he wasn't happy last season. But right now, Ernie's really got all the cards. He's got a chip that he can't use here (now that Stevenson's signed/Daniels hasn't been traded), but it also isn't going to expire. If someone wants it badly enough, he'll make the trade. (Top 3 protected #1 from Memphis? Throw in Thomas or Haywood and get a trade exemption?)

Posted by: TG | July 20, 2007 1:01 PM

Thanks Ivan for the new post. I guess all we can do is just wait. Again, could you do a story or a post on Ted Leonis and his relationship with Abe Pollen and the Wizards?

Nothing against Abe, but I think Ted would be a great owner for the Wizards. The guy would bring great "energy" to the Wiz and I think he would promote them better.

I also think he would not be afraid of the dreaded luxury tax if he had to go over it a little. How close is Ted to finally getting the Wiz?

Posted by: Bullets Fever (formerly Mikie) | July 20, 2007 1:13 PM

Ok, I'll break my silence. If it turns out that EG is working the channels with the Heat to leverage his negotiating ability with Memphis, first let me say, well done EG. Second, I'll say: Kyle Lowry in a Wiz uniform and draft pick is what it's gonna take.

Posted by: Nick | July 20, 2007 1:15 PM

Help me out...

If Miami needs a reliable playoff quality Point Guard, and we have one in AD who no longer fits, why don't we trade AD for a Draft Pick and free up the space to sign JCN? Is trading a player for a draft pick allowed?

Posted by: Cballer | July 20, 2007 1:26 PM

Yup I agree ya Dork (Nick) j/k...but Kyle Lowry and a 2nd Round Draft Pick should do or maybe EG wants a protected pick in next years draft so we could get one of the many high prospect Centers there is like about 3 in the Top 10...which is great...but if we could work out a deal for a poven center that can rebound and get blocks we will be good!!(Camby)

what do you think it would take to get Amare Stoudemire...Maybeif we trade JCN we can trade Memphis's or Miami's draft picks along with our 2 in next years add Antwan and Haywood and it might work......but if we dont trade JCN we can include him in the package to get Amare

Posted by: Fulvio | July 20, 2007 1:36 PM

Help me out...

"If Miami needs a reliable playoff quality Point Guard, and we have one in AD who no longer fits, why don't we trade AD for a Draft Pick and free up the space to sign JCN? Is trading a player for a draft pick allowed?"

Posted by: Cballer | July 20, 2007 01:26 PM

That's a good idea C-Baller...we can trade AD and swap 2nd Rounders

Posted by: Fulvio | July 20, 2007 1:38 PM

AD for picks only works if Miami is far enough under the cap to absorb AD's salary without going over. That's not the case. Since the Wiz and Miami are both over the cap, salaries have to match within a few percent.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 20, 2007 1:45 PM

fellas, only teams under the cap can take on salary without having to match it in the trade. There are no teams that can take AD's salary outright. Even if there were, that doesn't open room for Navarro here because the Wiz would still be over the cap.

if we move AD to Miami we'd have to take salary back, like Doleac and Dorrell Wright or Simien if its a straight salary dump. Miami only wants to give up Antoine Walker nad his deal that makes Etan's look fiscally sound.

Posted by: JJ | July 20, 2007 1:50 PM

Donnell Taylor + Daniels for 3 South Beach Diamond Doll Strippers

Posted by: Anonymous | July 20, 2007 1:52 PM

I'm thrilled about the Dominator too but let's be real. Blatche has started NBA games and has gone toe to toe with the greatest player in his mold currently playing (KG). McG has put up some nice #s and highlights playing against scrubs in summer league. I'm definitely more excited to see what Andray is going to bring this season.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 20, 2007 2:02 PM

Trade:

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=207~2423~183&teams=27~27~14

Miami Gets:

-AD
-2nd Round Draft Pick

Washington Gets:

-Mike Doleac
-Dorell Wright

Posted by: Fulvio | July 20, 2007 2:11 PM

Folks, EG is NOT going to trade AD, for both cap reasons and leadership reasons. EG and EJ like what AD provides on the court (asist to TO ratio) and, even more importantly, in the locker room. Like AJ, AD is a proven leader type who is excellent for team chemistry. EG is pitting Miami vs. Memphis and will accept the best offer for JCN, but it is looking more and more that the deal will not include Etan or Brendan. My souces tell me that it will be a combination of picks.

Posted by: Rockville | July 20, 2007 2:13 PM

I'd trade Navarro's rights and Haywood/Thomas to Memphis for Darko in a heartbeat, but I can't see then doing that, no matter how happy it makes Gasol.

Posted by: kalorama | July 20, 2007 2:14 PM

Last friday night I ran into our boy Andray Blatche at Hotel Monoco in Chinatown. To be honest, he didn't look like he's put on that much weight, but it was late and I hope I'm wrong. I love hearing how Wiz players are working their butts off in the offseason to only come back and produce the same. Our bench really needs to step it up this year or Agent Zero is out of here. We definitely want to trade JCN with BHaywood, so EJ doesn't have to put up with him next year!

Posted by: Chiggy | July 20, 2007 2:16 PM

Trade: (Milwakee (about8.5 mil actually is Far under The Cap and Could Use AD)

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=2215~183&teams=27~15

Milwakee Gets:

-AD
- Future 1st Rounder

Washington Gets

-Lynn Greer
-4 mil in Cap Space

noguh money to sign JCN and Blatche

Posted by: Fulvio | July 20, 2007 2:17 PM

rockville -

are you ken beatrice...your sources...

Posted by: Anonymous | July 20, 2007 2:17 PM

and we go about $100,000 under the cap

Posted by: Fulvio | July 20, 2007 2:19 PM

my sources tell me to crack a joke at you.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 20, 2007 2:21 PM

With Pau Gasol demanding to play with Navarro, and also previously demanding a trade, Why haven't the Wizards looked into that?? Why not package Etan, Jamison & something else to get Pau Gasol. Then he can play with Navarro on the Wizards and we can afford both by trading Etan & AJ.

Posted by: Robert S. | July 20, 2007 2:21 PM

I wonder if we could get Miami to trade
Jay Williams
Chris Quinn(S&T 1 yr deal at ~850K or minimum whichever is lower)
2008 First Round Pick
for
Antonio Daniels
Etan Thomas
Rights to JCN

That's about 10M off the books next year, and 2M(still within the 125% though) to make sure we don't go over the luxury tax.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 20, 2007 2:23 PM

some of you have the dumbest ideas i've ever heard. nobody wants jamison and haywood or etan or daniels or a draft pick or whatever.... for their star palyer, get over it.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 20, 2007 2:26 PM


Breaking News:

The Miami Heat acquired the rights to guard Juan Carlos Navarro and center Etan Thomas from the Washington Wizards on Friday night for Antoine Walker and the rights to the 2008 second round pick.

The trade was first reported by ESPN.com's Andy Katz.

Posted by: OMG | July 20, 2007 2:29 PM

who the heck is lynn greer ? not that it matters because he's just a throw in to make the deal work. EG really needs to do something to free up some money. If we have enough cap space to sign JCN without going over, it would spur memphis to do a deal quickly.

Posted by: mark | July 20, 2007 2:30 PM

I didn't report nuffin!!

Posted by: ESPN's Andy Katz | July 20, 2007 2:32 PM

My sources tell me they have no sources in Rockville.

Posted by: Sean | July 20, 2007 2:38 PM

How about trading Thomas, Daniels and Navarro's draft rights to Miami for Williams, Doleac and a future 1st round pick? I was chatting with a group of Heat fans and most thought Miami would bite. Both Thomas and Daniels seem to fit better with the Heat's half court than Washington's uptempo game.

For Washington, it gives us salary relief after next season when the contracts for both Williams and Doleac expire (which should allow us to resign Gilbert and Antawn, plus be a player what is predicted to be a great free agent market next offseason).

I've checked both ESPN's Trade Machine and RealGM's Trade Checker, and the trade seems to work.

Posted by: DanPeter | July 20, 2007 2:42 PM

1st: Why Kyle Lowry? What do we have AD, Gil, DeBrick, and NiYo for?

2nd: Someone said they didn't want Milicic for Navarro and Thomas. Why the heck not?

3rd: Who do we keep? Thomas or Haywood? The team seems to like Haywood more, see the famous 3 pt contest video. And Thomas is so absorbed in politics, music, and poetry that he doesn't focus on basketball. Hell, his nicknames the Poet.

Posted by: Emmet | July 20, 2007 2:44 PM

Let's get real Fulvio we have nothing to trade for Amare Stoudamire. But I was thinking that we might be able to work a three way deal, how I don't know but all options should be open at this point.And let's leave Antoine Walker out of any talks, he will do nothing for the Wizards as he has done for the Heat. Wayne Simien is a polished player who hasn't got a lot of playing time. He's much like Etan, but has a mid-range jumper that can go along with 7,8 rebounds.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 20, 2007 2:52 PM

"How about trading Thomas, Daniels and Navarro's draft rights to Miami for Williams, Doleac and a future 1st round pick?"

I think that this is the best that we can realistically hope for from Miami. I'd even take a 2nd rounder in place of a 1st. I can see how Riley would be reluctant to pull the trigger on this one though, because I'm sure that he, too, wants to be a player in the '08 free agency market.

Also:

Any (futile) hope that any of us had in Seattle using its trade exception to take Etan has now been crushed, as they used it to trade a pick to PHX for Kurt Thomas.

Posted by: GBH | July 20, 2007 2:56 PM

And...
This easy-to-read tutorial explains EVERYTHING about the salary cap and why you can't clear cap space simply by trading a 15 million dollar player for a 3 million dollar player
http://members.cox.net/lmcoon/salarycap.htm

Link originally posted on Washingtonwizardsblog.com

Posted by: Emmet | July 20, 2007 2:59 PM

Just an FYI for the Etan and JCN for Darko folks: Darko can't be traded until December 15 since he just signed with them. No chance of that trade going down this summer

Posted by: MDBaller1 | July 20, 2007 3:01 PM

You guys have all lost your minds. Could you come up with worse trade offers. You should just say hey I think a good trade would be JCN and etan for Dwade and Shaq. You guys are a bunch of goobers come up with something realistic.

Posted by: beas13 | July 20, 2007 3:02 PM

You guys have all lost your minds. Could you come up with worse trade offers. You should just say hey I think a good trade would be JCN and etan for Dwade and Shaq. You guys are a bunch of goobers come up with something realistic.

Posted by: beas13 | July 20, 2007 3:02 PM

some of you have the dumbest ideas i've ever heard. nobody wants jamison and haywood or etan or daniels or a draft pick or whatever.... for their star palyer, get over it.

Posted by: | July 20, 2007 02:26 PM

Yeah Fulvio put down that crackpipe!

Posted by: Anonymous | July 20, 2007 3:03 PM

This is not good for us. Walker's contract runs for a while, I think. Why would we do this deal ? Tell me you're kidding, OMG.

Posted by: mark | July 20, 2007 3:05 PM

Hey, Beas -- Miami's the team that wants JCN. Why should Washington agree to something fair?

Posted by: Sean | July 20, 2007 3:06 PM

that person was impersonating me come on get real

Posted by: The Real Fulvio | July 20, 2007 3:07 PM


Heat fan here. Hold your fire!

Riley might take back one bad contract, but I doubt he'll take back two. I agree with DanPeter in that Etan Thomas would be more comfortable in Miami's halfcourt set.

I would imagine that the Heat would have to take back a bad contract to stop Grunfield from sending JCN to the Western Conference, i.e. Memphis.

Posted by: Ashlov | July 20, 2007 3:07 PM

Fulvio is an idiot. The Suns could have had KG!!! but didn't pull the trigger cuz they didn't wanna lose Amare. But they would be willing to trade him to us for scraps? Stop posting all these dumb trade ideas.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 20, 2007 3:08 PM

apology to fulvio is that really wasn't you

Posted by: Anonymous | July 20, 2007 3:09 PM

Don't worry Sean, that's definitely made-up. Walker's contract is even worse than Etan's. It would solve nothing for the wiz over the short or the long term.

Posted by: GBH | July 20, 2007 3:10 PM

Thing is Chris Wallace and new coach Mark Ivaronni like Gasol and want to keep him. The guys who were tempted to move Gasol for the Bulls young players are gone. Gasol is effectively off the block.

They also like Darko and didn't sign him to move him.

fulvio, as for those Milwauke numbers, they don't include Mo Williams' deal or adding Voskuhl.

I was gonna say keep trying, but I won't. finding ttrades that work in online software is not all it takes. Teams havce to actually want what we're giving up.

IMO, Miami will take on one of our ugly contracts but not 2.

Posted by: JJ | July 20, 2007 3:11 PM

Walker's salary is 8.5, 9, 10, and 11 (rounded off) for the next 4 years. We cannot be that stupid. Now that I think about it, there's no way we did that. Give up Etan and JCN for a washed up shooter who can't shoot and plays no defense and a 2nd rounder ? Nah. I don't believe it.

Posted by: mark | July 20, 2007 3:13 PM

i just saw that phoenix gave up kurt thomas and 2008/2010 1st round picks for seattle's trade exception of about 9 mil. too bad we couldn't have gotten into that action with AD and/or etan.

right now, i think our best move is to work with memphis. they have much better assets than miami, and more incentive to acquire JCN.

i'm assuming they're not going to give up any of their young guys, miller, or gasol. that being the case we should try our darnedest to get them to take etan in exchange for swift. even if we have to throw in a pick next season.

with jamison coming off the books, if we also get rid of etan 6.5 mil, we'll be able to make a play for guys like garnett, brand, marion, j. o'neal...

Posted by: JC | July 20, 2007 3:15 PM

I am gay

Posted by: GBH | July 20, 2007 3:21 PM


Actually, the last two years of Walker's contract are a team option. So in reality, he only has two more years left on his contract, which would be less than Etan Thomas, Antonio Daniels, or Brendan Haywood.

Posted by: Ashlov | July 20, 2007 3:22 PM

Nothing on ESPN.com about a JCN-Walker deal, and Andy Katz is a college BB writer. Are you messin' with us, OMG?

Posted by: rbpalmer | July 20, 2007 3:25 PM

Maybe Steve Kerr will trade us three future first rounders for Etan Thomas

Posted by: Jason | July 20, 2007 3:29 PM

Is there an easy way to see how many games Tim Donaghy ref'd for the Wiz the past two years? This is not going to look good for the NBA or their refs.

Posted by: DCMan | July 20, 2007 3:31 PM

"This easy-to-read tutorial explains EVERYTHING about the salary cap and why you can't clear cap space simply by trading a 15 million dollar player for a 3 million dollar player
http://members.cox.net/lmcoon/salarycap.htm"

Oh good god. This "easy-to-read" tutorial is longer than a harry potter book. There's gotta be somewhere in the rules that say we can simply trade AD to Miami for a 2nd round pick.

Posted by: Cballer | July 20, 2007 3:34 PM

u guyz should stop making fun of fulvio. i think his ideas are smart. at least hes trying to help the team!!!!1

Posted by: Wiz-Skins 07 | July 20, 2007 3:36 PM

Heat fan beat me to it.

want a mega deal?

AD and Etan to Miami
JWill, Jamison, Dorrell Wirght, a re-signed Blatche and a 1 to Minnesota.
KG and Trent Hassell to the Wiz

The wolves get over 25 mil in expiring contracts, out from under Hassell's contract, an extra pick and a young PF at a reasonable salary. OK, I took my turn.

Posted by: JJ | July 20, 2007 3:37 PM

We cannot trade AD (or anyone else, for that matter) to Miami for a draft pick. Because Miami is over the cap. Period. What part of "cannot" don't you understand?

That's the whole point of the friggin salary cap.

Posted by: DCinCO | July 20, 2007 3:37 PM

hey who was that Wiz-Skins07 thats my screename on washingtonwizardsblog.com

Posted by: Fulvio | July 20, 2007 3:39 PM

Grizz fan here . . . I posted this on a Grizzlie's board, figured I'd get it flamed here . . .

MEM trades Stromile Swift to WAS for Brendan Haywood and . . . . the rights to Navarro.

Why MEM does it: Why NOT have three 7-footers on the roster? Haywood backs up both Darko and Pau, maybe even pushes Darko for the starter's gig. And Navarro, in addition to apparently being the new Manu Ginobli, is Pau's boy. And we get that much-needed extra perimeter help.

Why WAS does it: The bad blood between Haywood and Etan Thomas is a major distraction in the locker room. Plus, Eddie Jordan likes Thomas, doesn't like Haywood. One of them has to go, and Thomas has a trade kicker which makes it harder to trade him. Stro would also figure to be a solid backup to Antwan Jamison and/or an insurance policy in case Jamison takes flight when his contract expires this season. Maybe we throw in a draft pick or two to sweeten the pot.

For those of you who would knock Stro, although he's not lived up to his potential, he's also had to play out of position here in Memphis a lot. Presumably, if allowed to play the 4, and with regular minutes, you'd see him bring in 15-8 a night with a block or two.

Thoughts?

Posted by: L3E | July 20, 2007 3:39 PM

add JCN to Miami's portion of that deal...

Posted by: JJ | July 20, 2007 3:40 PM

hey Griz Fan if you throw in a draft pick or TWO i would be more than delighted to take your deal

Posted by: Fulvio | July 20, 2007 3:42 PM

I'd be ok with Etan and JCN for Stromile and a second rounder. I'd also do Etand, JCN and AD for Stoudamire, Stro and a pick.

Posted by: JJ | July 20, 2007 3:46 PM

Swift is a career underachiever who's well past the point where his supposed "potential" can be used as a lure. The idea that he'd blossom into a near double-double guy in Washington when he's never averaged more than 11 pts and 6 rebs in 7 years in the NBA (during which he's gotten plenty of regular minutes) is extreme wishful thinking. And it would seem unlikely that he'd be playing much PF in D.C. given that the Wiz would be trading the guy who plays half the available minutes at C to get him.

Posted by: kalorama | July 20, 2007 3:46 PM

Fulvio,

If it's a protected first in 2008/unprotected in 2009, and maybe a second-rounder in either year, pick up the phone and call Ernie!

Our squad doesn't need to get ANY younger.

Posted by: L3E | July 20, 2007 3:48 PM

That deal does nothing to make the team better, doesn't give the Wiz any cap relief (because Swift and Haywood's contracts both run the same number of years, and loses Navarro without getting anything good back.

Posted by: kalorama | July 20, 2007 3:50 PM

kalorama, you're killing me here. . .

Presumably Stro MIGHT put up better numbers in the decidedly weaker Eastern Conference, not going up against Duncan, Stoudemire, KG, Dirk, Elton Brand, Yao, etc.

Plus he's more athletic than many he would be going up against in the EC, Eddy Curry, Zach Randolph, anybody in Miami, Tony Battie . . .

Finally, his contract expires in 2 years, he could opt out in '08. So if it doesn't work out, at least you get cap relief sooner than with either Haywood OR Thomas.

Alright, now that THAT'S settled, somebody get Ernie on the phone and let's GIT-R-DUN! =)

Posted by: L3E | July 20, 2007 3:56 PM

I would pull the trigger if it was etan, for haywood (better player, less money) you would have to throw in a pick. But with the pick, i would definitely do that deal. The Wiz NEED to dump a contract and sign blatche, this would let us do both, and get a young player in next years draft

Posted by: Ben | July 20, 2007 3:57 PM

I quess in the coming days we'll get to see who has more leverage or who is willing to cough up more for one more shot at glory. Pau Gasol and his lobbying to play with Navarro, or Pat Riley and his quest to put together one title run.
If Ernie plays this right, and he has so far, he might be able to make a deal with them both to help us out. I haven't seen where Posey has gotten any FA offers. And a Posey for Navarro deal just doesn't cut it. But if Posey were to sign a one year sign and trade a Posey for Daniels swap could have an upside for both teams. We would gain a strong wing defender with three point range and cap releif next summer. Riley would get a veteran point gaurd.
If we also then dealt Navarro's rights & Taylor on a sign and trade to make the salaries match and swapped 1st rounders with Memphis and took back Lowry we'd get a backup point at a low cost. And a shot at a center in next year's draft. They'd get Navarro, a happy Gasol and they'd still be in the first round next year.
No, we wouldn't dump Etan in either deal but we wouldn't be taking back another bad contract either. But we would be getting rid of one of the three bloated contracts we have. And of the three Haywood's might be the easiest to move on it's own. And we could have a shot at upgrading center in the draft next year.
Not ideal, but maybe workable.

Posted by: GM | July 20, 2007 4:01 PM

Griz fan, you are obviously a Griz fan. What yuo may not know about the Wiz is that Haywood has been deemed to be the better player and is not going anywhere. Etan is being traded. Grunfeld likes Haywood and he has more pull than Eddie Jordan. Also, EJ is probably outta here after this year. Substitute Etan, add a 1st and we got a deal. JCN is our asset. Why would we just give him away to you ?

Posted by: mark | July 20, 2007 4:02 PM

kalorama, you love shooting people down. How about stepping up with an original idea for once?

Posted by: Anonymous | July 20, 2007 4:02 PM

"Presumably Stro MIGHT put up better numbers in the decidedly weaker Eastern Conference, not going up against Duncan, Stoudemire, KG, Dirk, Elton Brand, Yao, etc."

What, you could come up with any more speculative qualifiers? Stromile Swift has been a mediocre player, at best, his entire career. The idea that he would suddenly bloom into a legit player after 7 years and plenty of opportunities to start and play regular minutes is just a wild stab in the dark (as evidenced by the heavy use of "presumably" and "might" in that prediction).

"Finally, his contract expires in 2 years, he could opt out in '08. So if it doesn't work out, at least you get cap relief sooner than with either Haywood OR Thomas."

According to this:

http://www.eskimo.com/~pbender/contracts

both Haywood's and Swift's contracts expire in 2010. And even if Swift does have an opt out in 2009, it's highly unlikely he'd use it, because the odds of anyone paying him more than the approximately $6+ mill he'll be making in that last year are slim to none.

Posted by: kalorama | July 20, 2007 4:07 PM

Not a bad thought if you ask me L3E. I think our best bet would to be to trade with Memphis because I can't see them keeping four power forwards with one true center in Lorenzen Wright. They have Milicic, Warrick,Pau,and Swift. I would take Warrick or Swift for Haywood and JCN. We all have to think of things like this, JCN is a great talent, but where would he playat this point,Eddie Jordan is going to have a hard enough time trying to find playing time the players we have now. Another thing is that we haven't even seen JCN playto know what he can do in the nba. grant it we had scouts going to constantly see Pesh and JCN play but what do we know about him, i'm sure the staff knows the same thing, why do you think EG is trying to trade hime. I mean goodness we drafted JCN five years ago and its not like he's 21 or 22, he's 27. I'm sure he would get limited playing just as Pesh would, but at least we know that Pesh needs work because we have all seen him play the last two summer leagues. And forget draft picks we need to win now not to keep bulding up players from the bottom up. We have added pieces to our bench that will eventually pay off, but I think that's why EG waiting to see if we can add a post player that will actually help in some sort of way because we would be losing nothing if we lose Etan or Haywood. I heard there were other teams other than Memphis and the Heat, such as Cleveland but what could we get from them, nothing. I really don't EG is interested in draft picks, could be wrong ,but at this point none of us know what the heck he is thinking. But L3e, not a bad pitch if you ask me. Your thoughts!and anybody else.

Posted by: Easy "E" | July 20, 2007 4:07 PM

"I really don't EG is interested in draft picks, could be wrong"

You're wrong. Sorry, but that's exactly what EG is looking for. Memphis offers a first rounder then they'll get JCN. Otherwise, he'll go to Miami.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 20, 2007 4:11 PM

"kalorama, you love shooting people down. How about stepping up with an original idea for once?"

Someone posted a trade idea and asked for peoples' thoughts. I thought it was a bad idea, said so, and explained why. If that upsets you, that's not really my problem. Take it up with the guy who posted the trade and specifically asked for responses.

On a more general note: Don't like what I have to say? Then don't waste your and my time responding to it.

Posted by: kalorama+- | July 20, 2007 4:11 PM

Stromile is a solid player. For the poster up higher who claims he's gotten good minutes his whole career, try looking it up before spouting off. Actually, his career average is about 20 mins/game. Jamison, to take an example, hit about 40 last year (a little less). So extrapolate Stro's numbers to Jamison's minutes, and here's what you get. Stro: 18 pts, 10 rebs, 2.6 blocks. Tawn: 20 pts, 8 rebs, .5 blocks.

This is why I always say Jamison is SOOOO overrated. He gets stats because he gets tons of minutes. Lots of guys around the league, like Stro, would get similar numbers if given the same minutes. Plus Stro plays defense.

Do this deal in a micro-second.

Posted by: DCinCO | July 20, 2007 4:17 PM

Thanks to the salary cap, winning in the NBA is largely a result of economic decisions. All teams have essentially the same amount of money to devote to salaries, so the successful teams are the ones that get the most bang for their buck. So, the question is, how can a team get more for its money?

The best way is to get a mega-superstar. In their prime, players like Shaq , Duncan, or MJ are worth far, far more than a max contract. Even at max money, these guys are a bargain.

Another type of bargain is a rookie who can contribute immediately. Players like Duncan, Magic, and Larry were fully prepared to step in and contribute and were far more valuable to their teams than their modest rookie contracts. With players entering the draft early, this option is much less available nowadays. (Maybe this is part of the allure of drafting older, more seasoned European players.)

A third way to get a bargain is if players are willing to play for you for less than their market value. Grant Hill going to Phoenix this year is an example. A subset of this category is players who have been bought out by their former teams, such as Francis this year and Webber last year.

Unfortunately, there is relatively little that a team can do to get one of these bargains. It basically comes down to luck. So, what can a team do to improve its chances?

One part of the solution is to find players that complement each other so that the whole is greater than the sum of its parts. Obviously, every team tries to do this, but some are better than others.

Another part of the solution is to play a different style from the rest of the league. By playing a different style from the rest of the league, you can emphasize certain skills and hide certain deficiencies. Again, all teams try to do this, but the more unusual your playing style, the more that certain players will fit better with you than anyone else. A number of the Suns are certainly more effective there than they would be anywhere else. If the players and their agents recognize this, they may be willing to sign for less money to play where they fit best rather than signing a bigger contract elsewhere and get dumped on when they can't meet expectations.

The biggest part of the solution is to get a good GM. Someone that doesn't overpay for players and who comes out on the better end of trades is invaluable.


So how are the Wiz doing?

In terms of luck, our one #1 draft pick turned into Kwame Brown. Ugh. But recently, Nick Young fell to us at #16, we found Dominic McGuire in the second round, and JCN managed to get out of his contract with Barcelona. So maybe things are turning around, knock on wood.

As far as players complementing each other, I think DeShawn is a good complementary player. He plays far better with the Big Three than without them. Not sure if he recognizes that fact, but regardless, EG managed to get him to sign a reasonable contract. Another big step in the right direction will be to get rid of BTH and/or ET, if we can manage it. I wish EJ were better at getting the guys to play nicely together, though.

Where EJ is valuable is in getting the Wiz to play a different style from the rest of the league. Compared to other offensive schemes, the Princeton offense puts more emphasis on the ability to read the defense, make sharp passes, and move without the ball. These skills are less valued in the NBA than, say, the ability to get away from a defender off the dribble. Players that fit into our scheme may be undervalued by the rest of the league, so we may be able to build a contender while avoiding the luxury tax. This is the blueprint that was used to build the Kings teams that challenged for league supremacy but lost out to overwhelming talent of Shaq/Kobe every year.

And for the last part of the equation, EG is as good of a GM as there is in the NBA.


Now, the question is whether EG can pull a rabbit out of his hat and get us the last piece of the puzzle- a reasonably priced center who meshes with the rest of the team and who can excel in the Princeton offense. Unfortunately, there aren't a lot of options out there. Centers who can read the defense and pass on the offensive end, and block shots and bang in the paint on the defensive end are awfully rare. There's an outside chance that Darko might fit the bill, but the odds are slim. Given the lack of options, it's worth a shot, though. (And to add to the degree of difficulty, let's make EG wriggle around the luxury cap and Darko's December 15th trade restriction.)

Posted by: TC | July 20, 2007 4:20 PM

Kal,

For the record, I know Stro is, for all practical purposes, a bust. What I'm trying to do is "sell" him. I do think he'd shine more in the Eastern Conference, but hey.

Anyway, my "pitch" isn't working for you. Sue me.

Besides, on further thought, I'm wondering if we should KEEP Stro . . . not for his talent, but for the cap space. A lot of our young core (Gay, Kyle, Kinsey, Warrick) will all be coming due for extensions about the time Stro's contract expires, so . . .

But if EG would trade JCN for a pick straight up, I'd do it. Like I said, our squad doesn't need ANY more youth than we have now.

Posted by: L3E | July 20, 2007 4:20 PM

We shouldn't blink first. We made the playoffs without JCN (or Blatche playing much for that matter) and we'll do so again. I like Blatche but if not trading JCN means we lose Blatche (which is unlikely), then so be it. I am just adamant about not giving JCN away for little or nothing. Swift counts as little or nothing. I'm in full agreement with Kalorama. NO DEAL !

Posted by: mark | July 20, 2007 4:20 PM

It's GM suicide for Memphis to send a number 1 pick for JCN. A team that could quite easily be in the lottery doesn't trade its pick for an unknown quantity. If Ernie wants a pick, playoff caliber teams are where to look.
It's silly trading with the Heat, but taking away next years draft from them could be crippling enough. What if Shaq & Wade can't stay healthy and the pick becomes a 9-12? Then it makes sense.

Posted by: lasarte | July 20, 2007 4:21 PM

Kalorama I agree, I just think that EG really wants someone that can compete now.I don't see us getting anymore guards we have enough now. Good thought though. I wouldn't say i'm wrong because none of us know where this headed, none of us have talked to EG about it, were all just giving our ideas and opinions.

Posted by: Easy "E" | July 20, 2007 4:22 PM

For the poster up higher who claims he's gotten good minutes his whole career, try looking it up before spouting off.

Take your own advice.

I never said he played "good" minutes (whatever that means). I said he played regular minutes, and he has. He's been a regular rotation player (and sometime starter) on every team he's been on. The reason he only averages 20 mpg is because he's only good enough to be a 20 mpg player.

So extrapolate Stro's numbers to Jamison's minutes, and here's what you get. Stro: 18 pts, 10 rebs, 2.6 blocks. Tawn: 20 pts, 8 rebs, .5 blocks.

And there is absolutely zero chance Swift would play 40 mpg on the Wiz. He'd likely be playing the same 20 mpg he's averaged everywhere else, which means there's no reason for predicting a big jump in his production.

Posted by: kalorama | July 20, 2007 4:23 PM

Mark,

I appreciate the kudos, but just to be clear:

If it comes down to a choice between Navarro and Blatche, I'm going Blatche all the way.

Posted by: kalorama | July 20, 2007 4:26 PM

Hey, Ivan. Are there any summer interns lying around the Washington Post looking for something to do? How about having them investigate the Wizards games Tim Donaghy called the last two years and whether there were any significant or controversial calls made by him in those games? That would make a nice article in the Post (if they'd give you more than a couple of inches).

Posted by: Sean | July 20, 2007 4:53 PM

kal goes 0 for 1 on original ideas. Or are you 'that guy' that prefers to tell everyone how bad their ideas are, but never brings any of his own?

Posted by: Anonymous | July 20, 2007 5:01 PM

This is a hell of a market Memphis and Miami are drumming for Navarro. But there is no way draft picks are going to be enough in my opinion. If those two teams want Navarro bad enough then it is a first round pick (somewhat protected) and take Etan's contract.
I mean lets face it if we are going to help that backstabbing Riley and the SOB Heat, lets make those #($@#$#@$@#$ pay through the nose in the process and since the Grizz are so desperate to keep Pau happy they will pay through the nose too. It's too bad, that the Wizards aren't likely to keep Navarro, but they damn sure don't have to give them to anybody and that's the key.

The best case (and somewhat reasonable) scenario among all the trades mentioned here in my opinion is DanPeter's (How about trading Thomas, Daniels and Navarro's draft rights to Miami for Williams, Doleac and a future 1st round pick?).

Posted by: George Templeton | July 20, 2007 5:14 PM

"Or are you 'that guy' that prefers to tell everyone how bad their ideas are, but never brings any of his own?"

That's pretty funny, coming from the author of such substantive, constructive responses as:

Donnell Taylor + Daniels for 3 South Beach Diamond Doll Strippers

Posted by: | July 20, 2007 01:52 PM

my sources tell me to crack a joke at you.

Posted by: | July 20, 2007 02:21 PM

some of you have the dumbest ideas i've ever heard. nobody wants jamison and haywood or etan or daniels or a draft pick or whatever.... for their star palyer, get over it.

Posted by: | July 20, 2007 02:26 PM

Yeah Fulvio put down that crackpipe!

Posted by: | July 20, 2007 03:03 PM

Fulvio is an idiot.

Posted by: | July 20, 2007 03:08 PM


Very few things truly offend me, but hypocrisy is at the top of the list. And exactly what kind of glass is your house made of?

Wake me when you have something to say to me that actually involves basketball. otherwise, don't waste my (and everyone else's) time.

Posted by: kalorama | July 20, 2007 5:16 PM

Kally also loses the irony contest...

"On a more general note: Don't like what I have to say? Then don't waste your and my time responding to it."

On a more specific note, well if you didn't like his post about not liking your post shouldn't you just not reply? Based on your reply that is...

lol

Posted by: heh | July 20, 2007 5:33 PM

Yawn.

(Oh, and you're not fooling anyone, BTW.)

Posted by: kalorama | July 20, 2007 5:39 PM

Kalorama, all those comments weren't made by one person. That is just what appears when you leave the "Name" field blank.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 20, 2007 5:40 PM

I'd have to agree with Heh there, I mean, it's a bit pedantic...

But it seems like the sole point of the forum is for people to voice there opinions about things. Including other peoples opinions, which they don't like.

Doesn't need to be a pissing contest, but I don't think telling people not to waste your time if they don't like your opinion is quite the height of irony.

Is there something more time wasting that pointless repetitive posting on this forum?
and how I love it!

But dear god, think of the all-ready wasted time you are wasting even more... Or is this considered a service to society?

Ha, too funny!

Posted by: greg | July 20, 2007 5:40 PM

Memphis won't send us their number one for Navarro if they anticipate going to the lottery. But by adding Conley, Navarro, Lowry, and Milicic as well as having a healthy and happy Gasol they should be looking at a big improvement in their minds. Giving up their number one wouldn't be that major if it helps keep their cornerstone happy. Otherwise they could be faced with having to deal Gasol with a gun to their heads. Never a good situation, and since their trade partners are drying up they could be left coming back to Ernie.
By giving us the option of swapping picks it would give us the chance to move up in the draft and they would still have a first rounder next year. If they want the deal without giving up Lowry ask for for their pick straight up in the end they might do it. In their shoes everything considered, it might be their best play because of the Gasol angle.
It would be nice to move Etan's contract in a deal for Navarro but so many of the contracts being talked about aren't much better.
Clever move by Seattle in getting two number ones and Kurt Thomas from Phoenix for their trade exception that they generated from Orlando. But if they let Thomas retire after next season they're creating cap space that they won't need until Green, Durant and their three number ones next year come off their rookie deals. Timing expiring contracts to when the space is needed to keep their young core together is going to be important.
Would they be in the market to trade Thomas for our Thomas a number one and Cash? They'd gain another draft pick, more cash to offset Etan's salary and still have cap space available when their picks come off their rookie deals. They'd have generated 3 number ones out of the trade exception they got from Orlando. We'd get 8.1 m off the books next summer if we want it.
If we could pick up Memphis's pick for Navarro and swap Etan,cash, and our pick for Kurt Thomas. We'd get a vet capable of playing the high post in the Princeton and have a number one in the draft to look for a young center next year.
If Thomas works out and we do well next year we try and resign him and Jamison while creating the cap space we need to sign Arenas next summer. If not both could be let go and we'd create about 24m in cap space to go after Arenas and another major FA.

Posted by: GM | July 20, 2007 6:08 PM

I think EG has done a superb job. I troll all the websites looking for any more information on a potential JCN deal and can't find it. I don't think he'll send JCN to Miami given our record (1-14?) over the last 3 years with our divisional rival. I agree that he's trying to get more out of Memphis, and perhaps a steal??

Posted by: Manny | July 20, 2007 6:13 PM

GM - I like it. Thomas is a pretty good player too. Nice mid-range jumper, and he can rebound.

Posted by: Rook | July 20, 2007 6:18 PM

If JCN is pouting or getting impatient, then that's too bad for him. He's not a free agent so he has no leverage within the NBA. EG has the leverage and it is to his credit that he takes all the time he needs. I really don't think EG is going to get suckered into a bad deal, that's at least one reason why still nothing has happened yet.

Posted by: low | July 20, 2007 6:32 PM

I have called a number of Wizards games. I try to give them as many calls as possible. Remember that Don Nelson tech? Yeah that was me. Nobody bets on the Wizards. I'm rich beyotch!

Posted by: Tim Donaghy | July 20, 2007 6:58 PM

GM that is a very interesting idea. Certainly the Sonics would like the extra pick and Etan is the sort of coachable player that Carlesimo would want. But do you think Seattle would balk at that because Etan doesn't fit the style the Sonics want to play?

Posted by: George Templeton | July 20, 2007 7:02 PM

Anyone wonder why Phoenix paid up the nose for that trade exception? Are they stocking up for a KG deal?

Posted by: Dante | July 20, 2007 7:06 PM

Maybe this forum is infiltrated with Grizz fans.
We don't want Stro. He's 28, played 7 years in the NBA, averaged 8.8 pts, and 4.6 rbds in his career.
Receiving draft picks makes zero sense. If we don't win and win now, we will lose Gilbert Arenas and Jamison (who's not going to choose the Wizards minus Gil over the hometown Charlotte Bobcats who are on the rise). What legit center are you predicting we get in the draft that would make it worth waiting a year and risking losing Gil and Tawn?

Posted by: Emmet | July 20, 2007 7:51 PM

OMG you are that guy!

Can you put something out there, other than snarky replies? Or are you staring at 0 for 3?

Posted by: Anonymous | July 20, 2007 8:00 PM

GM,
That is the most insightful and well-informed user post that I have seen on this or any of the other Wizards blogs. Share your opinions more often. Thanks

Posted by: Emmet | July 20, 2007 8:29 PM

Graet Post GM, but for this trade to go down we would have to wait 30-days i believe b/c he just got signed

Posted by: Fulvio | July 20, 2007 8:51 PM

but now that Seattle just got Kurt Thomas do you think we can make a move for Chris Wilcox...

Maybe Trade Haywood + 1st Rounder + AD

for

Chris Wilcox + Earl Watson

Posted by: Fulvio | July 20, 2007 8:54 PM

seattle is running on a slippery slope. It's not a good thing to have a whole team of rookies and 2nd year players. you need some veteran leadership and experience. also, fulvio, another terrible idea, got anymore?

Posted by: Anonymous | July 20, 2007 9:01 PM

Its an interesting idea. I'd love to have Kurt Thomas banging inside for us.

If I'm Seattle, you're asking me to give you cap space AND take on over 13 Million (Etan's deal minus Thomas' figure for one season) for 1 first rounder. Phoenix just gave me 2 #1's to take on 8M. Plus, we saw how good he was first hand the way he played Duncan. We have the better player and the better contract.

we'd have to sweeten the pot to make anything happen. I'd rather try to take one of their projects off their hands. I imagine Sene and Petro are the 'most available'.

fulvio, they now have so many big men:
Thomas, Wilcox, Collison, Sene, Petro, and Swift that all bets are off. Trade scenario away my friend!

As for anonymous' slippery slope comment, no one said they have to MAKE all those picks. Thats just more ammunition to make deals or move up.

Posted by: JJ | July 20, 2007 9:54 PM

Great post Emmet. A no. 1 pick is a waste for us because we need to win now to keep Gil. Swift might be worth a try. Especially if we could get rid of Etan "I Played Hard in my Contract Year so I Could Sign a Bloated Contract and Then Camp Out on the Disabled List and Write Poetry" Thomas.

Posted by: Fat Lady | July 20, 2007 9:59 PM

I'd make it a 09 pick. With Arenas maxing out we're gonna need one more top 20ish player before we're left with only the MLE or a portion of it. Its not that that 08 pick would have to fill an immediate need. It could be one of those picks that keep you from having to spend money a year or so later.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 20, 2007 10:18 PM

Magnificent, my friend, that is very courageous!

Posted by: Hugh Gerection | July 20, 2007 10:49 PM

So, based on the Suns/Sonics it looks like its going to take 2 first round picks (at least) for your team to get rid of ET's contract. You figure JCN is worth one first round pick, so EG needs to package a JCN, ET, and another of your team's first round picks in exchange for some other team's conditional 2nd round pick to get a deal done that moves ET. Doesn't seem worth it. I guess its a draft pick for JCN or nothin.

Posted by: oddjob | July 20, 2007 11:39 PM

Just talked to a friend on left coast, who talked to a friend in Orange County, who talked to a guy who lives in the same neighborhood as guy who know one of the assistants, blah, blah, blah.
Anyway she heard the Clippers have made an offer to EG involving Tim Thomas, AD and JCN and a draft pick. Didn't even think Thomas was still in the league...and not sure who would get the pick, I assume it would your Wiz-ards. Anybody else sniffin this brand of perfume?

Posted by: oddjob | July 21, 2007 12:03 AM

Kurt Thomas is a soft bum. Seattle wasted pics getting this guy. He did nothing for PHO, which is why they traded him.

Posted by: DC Man88 | July 21, 2007 12:39 AM

Just a couple of points written from Barcelona.

It is nosense saying that Navarro is just creating rumours to get his contract in Europe improved. Mainly because it's FC Barcelona who has made it public that Navarro had reached an agreement with them, not Navarro or his agent:
http://www.fcbarcelona.cat/web/english/noticies/basquet/temporada07-08/07/n070703101180.html
It's simply that Navarro has been a symbol of Barcelona for years. He's been in the top ten of non-NBA players for the last five years. He's been called to the NBA too much times before and the only way the club could keep him was promising to let him go later. Navarro made a sacrifice for the team and stayed, and in exchange now the team does a sacrifice for the player and lets him go to the NBA. In fact Navarro is too much good, and even Barcelona fans would like to see him in the NBA, so it's now or never.

This situation wouldn't let the Wizs to keep Navarro waiting for many months. If he doesn't play in the NBA now, he'll have to keep active, so then he'll go back to Barcelona. Then if the Wizs come in december or later and say "now we want to trade you", Barcelona can say "now it's too late, we're in the middle of the season and at this point we aren't going to release our star". It would be better for the Wizs to trade him quickly because Barcelona failed to sign the first option to replace Navarro and if they fail many more, they can change a bit their mind and begin to put things difficult (for instace, asking for a player for them in the trade too). The most they could wait would be the end of the European Championship this september, hoping it is going to increase his value in front of the scouts of all the other teams.

Pau Gasol is pushing for Navarro for something else than friendship from the National Team. They both come from Barcelona's youth system and they've been playing together since they were 13. (As a curiosity, there's a video on youtube of them playing together at the age of 17, a summary made by someone of the opposite team: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ZEvEdGDa0g Navarro is yellow nr 7 and Gasol nr 14) And the best of them both was Navarro, it is Gasol who went first to the NBA because there are less players for his role.

Gasol is 27 now and he wants to play for something more than just the statistic. With Navarro, he wouldn't be playing for the championship, but he knows they could make something special together, as always they have done. Gasol is not in the time of beggining a long-time work with the franchise again. So it's with Navarro or with another team.

To be true I'm not a pure basketball fan, just an affeccionate, I've neven seen a full NBA match, they weren't on tv before, and now they are too late at night. But I'll finally have a reason to follow the NBA if Navarro goes there. Does he play well or not, he has something special, it's like watching Ronaldinho in soccer, you know that at any time you can see something you never expected. But I find it a bit hard to see La Bomba as a sixth player as the scouts say. He's better than Garbajosa, who I believe is more or less that role in his team. He's smart, as selfish as the coach wants him to be, and the last two years he has begun shooting the 3-pointer from far of the line, so he should get used easily to the new distance. Probably refereeing would be the hard point for him.

Posted by: Catalan | July 21, 2007 2:43 AM

Catalan,

Thanks for the insight. This sort of entry makes reading all these posts worthwhile. Simply can't get this kind of perspective anywhere else.

Posted by: pyt | July 21, 2007 5:07 AM

Another thought-provoking post was this one:
"Posted by: TC | July 20, 2007 04:20 PM"

Too bad it got buried in BS.

TC's post puts the NBA in a new light for me. It gives me hope that the Zards are just one piece away from a title. But at the same time, it's discouraging how unlikely it is that we will be able to get that necessary final piece. C'mon, I mean if our hopes are resting on Darko....

Kinda makes me wanna say, screw it. Let's bring in White Chocolate and Employee Number Eight and just let them go nuts. We'll be the exact opposite of the Spurs-- we'll lose, but we'll be hella fun to watch.

Posted by: pyt | July 21, 2007 5:40 AM

What I dont understand is this the luxy tax is at 67.9 million. Hoopshype says the Wiz is at 63.8 million,that leaves us about 4 million to sign three players. Two min. contracts equals 1.4 million (DMac & maybe Miles).That leaves 2.6 million for the first year to sign Blatche.More likely Blache is going to get 3 years 12 million more or less. So why not just give Blatche 2.6 first year,4.9 second year,5 million third.That equals 12.5 million for 3 years (an extra 500 thou. for the low first year). Now I understand that this might prevent us in re-signing Antawn(plenty for Gil)but if you are going to give someone 3/12 million I hope that he can start for you. Therefore making this Antawns last year. Trade JNC for a number one, that gives us 2 number one picks and a second rounder for ony 2 roster spots left, next year. Keep Brendan and Etan until a better deal come though or just let them play out there contracts and get over it. I think the trades that everyone is talking about is either foolish on our part(Posely,Swift,Walker or Williams)or just not going to happen(Gasol,Miller,Lowery,Haslem or K.Thomas).

Posted by: d square | July 21, 2007 6:57 AM

D square,

Unless you are or will be under the cap the following year... you can't offer more than a 10% annual raise to your players.. thus making it impossible to sign blatche for 2.6 mil this season and then pay him 5 mil the following season

Posted by: Dante | July 21, 2007 8:54 AM

I have one question is there any team out there that has a 8mil trade exception like Seattle had...that might want JCN and is willing to give that up??

Posted by: Fulvio | July 21, 2007 9:11 AM

Dante, your right that we can't just offer random amounts in different years but I thought it was 10% raise to sign other peoples players but 12.5% or something like that to sign your own. That way teams have more leverage to either sign their own players or be used in a sign and trade. I am not positive on all the rules for this (Bird rule, Arenas rule) on how exactly this works or if Blatche applies but I thought I read something about this before.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 21, 2007 9:25 AM

as some one suggested on here...

what do you think??

Wiz Get:

-Tim Thomas (11ppg-6rpg in 27 min)
-Clips First Round Pick or Second Round Pick

Clips Get:

-JCN
-Etan

The Trade works

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=851~847&teams=12~27

Tim Thomas F/C 6-10 235 lbs
Salary: $5,632,200 Years Remaining: 3
PTS: 11.0 REB: 5.0 AST: 2.3 PER: 13.67

Outgoing Players: Etan Thomas

they both can play the Center position (both same hieght) Tim Thomas is more Athletic and is about 15 lbs lighter

both entering they're 30's

by far Tim Thomas is more effective and i have heard a rumor on Washington Post that has that being an offer that EG has recieved..not sure if it is true though...but i still like the trade we get a 1st or 2nd Round Pick...and Tim Thomas is about 1 mil cheaper per year!!!

Posted by: Fulvio | July 21, 2007 9:25 AM

as some one suggested on here...

what do you think??

Wiz Get:

-Tim Thomas (11ppg-6rpg in 27 min)
-Clips First Round Pick or Second Round Pick

Clips Get:

-JCN
-Etan

The Trade works

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=851~847&teams=12~27

Tim Thomas F/C 6-10 235 lbs
Salary: $5,632,200 Years Remaining: 3
PTS: 11.0 REB: 5.0 AST: 2.3 PER: 13.67

Outgoing Players: Etan Thomas

they both can play the Center position (both same hieght) Tim Thomas is more Athletic and is about 15 lbs lighter

both entering they're 30's

by far Tim Thomas is more effective and i have heard a rumor on Washington Post that has that being an offer that EG has recieved..not sure if it is true though...but i still like the trade we get a 1st or 2nd Round Pick...and Tim Thomas is about 1 mil cheaper per year!!!

Posted by: Fulvio | July 21, 2007 9:25 AM

What do Tim Thomas and Stromile Swift have in common? They were both high lottery picks that are career under achievers. I hope EG can do better than that.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 21, 2007 11:07 AM

The point of moving Etan is to get out from under his contract. We'd be trading 3 years and 20+M for Tim Thomas and his 3 years 18+M. He got that huge deal for his playoff perforamce with the Suns in a few weeks of work versus the Clips.

The only reason to do that deal is to add his 3pt shooting (38%). Thats not a terrible reason mind you. Keep in mind we've added Songalia and Pecherov for similar abilities at a fraction of the price.

Otherwise Thomas is as big and soft as big out there. It would guarantee Haywood a starting spot with Thomas our 2nd team C.

Seattle is open to moving Earl Watson. The new regime knows Daniels from his time in San Antonio and he has history in Seattle as well.

Posted by: JJ | July 21, 2007 1:39 PM

Tim Thomas can barely play the 4 let alone the 5! Even AJ plays the 4 ovearll better than Thomas. Saying he can play the 5 is ridiculous and shows what little you know about these players. EG knows about Tim Thomas too well during his time at Milwaukee. He ain't taking Thomas unless there's some serious sweetner to go with that.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 21, 2007 2:24 PM

Simmer down.

I said that deal would guarantee Haywood would be starting center, and Thomas is a big softy. He'd be a backup 5 because Eddie will play small ball before he goes to a tradition 5-4-3-2-1 lineup. If you've been paying attention our players don't fit tradition roles.

Good point about Ernie in Milwaukee though.

Posted by: JJ | July 21, 2007 2:57 PM

fulvio, Phoenix now has the trade exception and is expected to use it in their attempt to get Garnett.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 21, 2007 3:00 PM

Seems like a lot of Wiz fans have learned that JCN is too short, cannot play defense, and may not be as athletic and fundamentally sound as the US players (even though these foreign teams seem to beat up on US teams). Besides, many Wiz fans feel that with DeShawn on the team, how could JCN get any playing time? So JCN is not even good enough to beat out Stevenson!

Even though we know all this, why are Miami, Memphis and other teams that want JCN so ignorant of these basic facts that even we the fans know? I don't get it. Don't they know the obvious JCN shortcomings? Or maybe JCN is legit--is that possible too?

I would also like to know if all the rules allow the Wiz to buy out the Poet or someone else to create cap room to sign Blatche and JCN? Could someone knowlegeable of the rules answer that?

Posted by: Ed | July 21, 2007 3:02 PM

The buyout (salary paid) still counts against the cap. Portland won't see any cap relief from the buyout until after the 08-09 season I believe, because thats when Francis' contract expired.

btw, you're painting with a wide brush. There are a lot of us talking trade only because we believe Navarro can't come here due to having only 1.8 to spend. I prefer he be our third guard and veteran weapon off the bench.

Posted by: Stringer | July 21, 2007 3:40 PM

Stringer,

Thanks for the good info. Very knowlegeable and helpful.

Suppose for a moment that the Wiz thought JCN could be an excellent addition and wanted to keep him and not trade him away.

In that case, what are the Wiz options, along with their financial obligations?

My intuition tells me they could keep him, but they have to trade him to avoid financial consequences that are too high for the Wiz. But would they be too high for most winning organizations?

Posted by: Ed | July 21, 2007 4:01 PM

Miami, Memphis, and other teams want the Euro players b/c the euro players leave it all on the court and play their @sses off without the unnecessary drama. I doubt if JCN played here, would he be obsessed about throwing his fiance an engagement party, passing out t-shirts about not feeling his face, talk about coming out parties, giving themselves stupid nicknames, hosting video games teams, and all that unnecessary BS.

Posted by: DC Man88 | July 21, 2007 6:23 PM

It is about money, but not money Washington is unwilling to spend. We don't have enough left under the MLE or BAE to pay Navarro. Dealing Etan, Brendan and/or Daniels doesn't change that unless we go under the cap, virtually impossible. His buyout is 1 million euros per year for 3 years. The most we can offer is 1.8M in dollars. At 27, he can't afford to give away these seasons in his prime.

People like to take a hardline, saying he should play for what we offer because we own his rights. Its a little late for that now. He's an established star in Europe, not a kid with "potential". His market value is beyond what we can offer.

He came over one year too early.

Posted by: Stringer | July 21, 2007 6:53 PM

To the Memphis fan a while ago, I agree and have posted the same scenario several times here...

Etan + rights to Navarro

for

Swift + 2nd round pick

I like the deal because Memphis' 2nd rounder should be a fairly high pick in the 30's.

I also agree Swift would be a good fit for our uptempo style of play. He would add athleticism to our front court, a shot blocker, a nice alternative to Jamison or Songaila at PF, and a legit smallball center off the bench.

With that deal we are looking at a roster like this:

Haywood, Blatche, Pecherov
Jamison, Swift, Songaila
Butler, McGuire, Hall
Stevenson, Young, Mason
Arenas, Daniels, Miles

Posted by: Darnell | July 21, 2007 7:10 PM

with that lineup, we're gonna get abused whenever we face anyone with a legit center. blatche and pech are fun and have potential and all that (both at the 4, notably), but they'll get owned when they're playing post defense against any self-respecting actual center in this league.

Posted by: yikes | July 21, 2007 7:30 PM

Sign Navarro and Blatche. If you have to go over the luxury tax, bite the bullet and do it. There is always a possibility that Navarro could be traded closer to the start of the season.We don't need Swift, or Walker types. We don't want to give Navarro away like we did with Webber and Wallace.

Posted by: Bill07 | July 21, 2007 7:38 PM

If we trade Haywood or Etan for Swift he, by default, becomes either the Wiz's starting or primary backup C. Any notion of Pecherov or Blatche playing significant minutes at C next center is wishful thinking.

Posted by: kalorama | July 21, 2007 8:10 PM

bill07, sign them with what? For Blatche we have early bird rights. With Navarro we have... 1.8M, which he won't accept. The luxury tax doesn't come into play for Navarro.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 21, 2007 8:43 PM

We are gonna get too greedy and Miami is gonna sign or trade for a proven NBA player elsewhere. JCN is gonna end up back stay in Europe and we are gonna end up with nothing. Miami already said they are not gonna go crazy and go over the tax, thats why they lost out on the MO Williams or make some ridicolous trade. We can dream all we want but the fact is JCN will probably at best a back up (Miami just want an assuranace for J-Will, who supposedly is 100% now) Why would any team offer a 1st rounder for somebody that we've all read may have too many faults for the NBA??? I'm very sure Miami is gonna sign/trade elsewhere and we'll end up with ZIP.

Posted by: MikeD | July 21, 2007 9:20 PM

keep your dress on Mallory.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 21, 2007 9:49 PM

Miami is in a must-win-now situation. They're tied to Shaq's huge contract for several more years. Building for the future is not an option. Navarro could easily be worth a first rounder to Riley if he thinks Navarro can be a key player in a championship run for them next season (even as a backup). If they win 50 games and get a top 3 or 4 seed in the East, their first round pick won't be worth much.

Posted by: kalorama | July 21, 2007 10:24 PM

You'd trade him straight up for a first round pick?

Posted by: Anonymous | July 22, 2007 12:36 AM

How about AD, ET, and the rights to JCN to Miami for JWill and Mourning?

In terms of on-th-court production, AD and ET give you pretty much the same as JWill and Zo. Miami gets JCN as a bonus, plus AD is better for Riley's indigestion than White Chocolate.

In return, the Wizards get a ton of expiring contracts. We will have our pick of players from the free agent market next year. Have you checked out the list of next year's free agents? As ESPN's Hollinger put it: "could be best ever." In addition, now that JWill has won a championship and gotten (over)paid with Miami, maybe he will be willing to re-sign with us for less than market value, because we play same Princeton offense that he played back when he used to chalk up SportCenter highlights every night.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 22, 2007 6:26 AM

The suggested Wiz-Heat trade of AD, ET and JCN's rights for JWill and Mourning would be great for the Wiz from a salary cap perspective. It also would be good from a talent perspective.

However, I can't see the Heat trading Mourning. If you substitute Doleac and a future draft pick from Miami, you have a more plausible trade.

The Heat do lose cap flexibility for the future, but they improve considerably from a talent perpsective. Both AD and ET fit better in the Heat's offensive set than they do with the Wiz, plus JCN has a considerable upside.

The Wiz do pretty good from a talent perspective and, more importantly, they pick up a lot of cap flexibility in 08 to resign Agent Zero and be a player in the free agent market.

Posted by: Dan Peter | July 22, 2007 7:42 AM

well what i think about the Wiz Heat Trade...well i dont think that the Heat is willing to give up Zo and i dont think he wants to come here either...if does get dealt he might just end up retiring...

So the trade Dan Peter metion sound more reasonable...

Wiz Get:

- J-Will
- Mike Doleac
- Future Draft Pick (likely *2nd Round)

Heat Get:

- AD
- Etan
- JCN

next year we would have about 38 mil (J-Will 9mil...Antwan 16mil...Arenas 13mil) in expiring comtracts 38mil and subtract the 20mil Gil will ask for that leaves us with about 18mil for free-agents...if Jamison wants to come back then let him sign for 6-8mil that leaves us still with 10-12mil for free-agents...if and only if we can bring back J-Will for 3mil or so but doubt he would take that offer..but thats all i would give him considering he is getting old and injury-prone...we can have about 9mil next year in free-agnecy to sign a double-double center that is a moster on the boards and can get blocks

if anyone has ESPN insider they can check this site and give us knowledge on who will be coming out next year!!!

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/insider/columns/story?columnist=hollinger_john&page=FreeAgents08&action=login&appRedirect=http%3a%2f%2finsider.espn.go.com%2fnba%2finsider%2fcolumns%2fstory%3fcolumnist%3dhollinger_john%26page%3dFreeAgents08

*2nd Round Draft Pick- Never say no to a 2nd Round Draft Pick when EG is around knowing what he can do with 2nd Rounders

Posted by: Fulvio | July 22, 2007 8:12 AM

Mourning would be a great addition to the Wizards, he does many things well that we need at center. But, John Thompson is in tune with Mourning, he mentioned on his show that Alonzo would not except any trade and would retire if traded.
The question was asked if he'd make an exception and play for the Wizards since he comes back to Washington every summer. Thompson said without hesitation, no, he likes Riley and the Heat and he'll finish up there.
I'm not sure, does Williams' contract end after this year? Or does he have a player option for one more?
In the end I think Riley's trying to deal picks because he doesn't play rookies and he won't coach long enough for a pick to get experience and to become useful in a couple of years.
Another team that hasn't been getting much mention that is really hurting at point is the Clippers. Livingston may not be ready to go this year and some are saying his injury is career threating. That doesn't leave them with much besides 37 yr old Sam Cassell who is entering the last year of his deal. The other interesting thing about the Clippers is they are thin at center as well.
Wonder if Ernie has them on speed dial?

Posted by: GM | July 22, 2007 9:42 AM

yes GM this J-Will's last contrat year and he has no player option this would free up about 9 mil in cap space next year and i alos for got to metion in my last blog that if we get Mike Doleac his contract will also expire next year which is worth about 2.5 so we would have about 41 mil in expiring contracts!!!then pay Gilbert about 20 mil and Antwan 8 mil and maybe J-Will 3 mil 10 mil in free-agency money!!!

Posted by: GM | July 22, 2007 11:20 AM

yes GM this J-Will's last contrat year and he has no player option this would free up about 9 mil in cap space next year and i alos for got to metion in my last blog that if we get Mike Doleac his contract will also expire next year which is worth about 2.5 so we would have about 41 mil in expiring contracts!!!then pay Gilbert about 20 mil and Antwan 8 mil and maybe J-Will 3 mil 10 mil in free-agency money!!!

Posted by: Fulvio | July 22, 2007 11:20 AM

sorry GM i posted the last comment under your name i just ment to direct it towards you

Posted by: Fulvio | July 22, 2007 11:21 AM

If they deal JWill they're right back where they started from needing another PG. Daniels can't be more than a part time player at his age.

We'd be swapping Etan's blocks for Doleac's interior strength and 17 or so million in salary owed.

Could the teams include Mourning in the deal knowing the Wizards would release him? Did they ever close that loophole? Gary Payton traded to ATL?, released and right back in Boston.

Posted by: Monte | July 22, 2007 12:03 PM

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/4987190.html
The heat are talking to Houston about Rafer Alton. Sounds like Houston asked for Haslem and Miami offered Doleac. Alston comes cheaper than Daniels too.

Posted by: Monte | July 22, 2007 12:25 PM

Our best bet is Memphis. We better do something soon. At this point I'd send JNC to the Griz straight up for a 2nd rounder.

Posted by: Darnell | July 22, 2007 2:27 PM

Can't see us dealing with the Clippers because they don't really have anything (that they'd be willing to part with) that the Wiz would want (in terms of players; not sure what their expiring contract situation is).

And forget about Mourning. The only reason he's still playing is to get another ring. That's his only motivation at this point.

Monte,

I believe they did close the "catch and release" loophole a couple years ago.

Posted by: kalorama | July 22, 2007 4:53 PM

kalorama, I would do Etan + JNC for Maggette in a hearbeat, which does work salary wise.

Posted by: Darnell | July 22, 2007 8:02 PM

Off subject, but I want to say something!

I find it VERY annoying that the top story on the Wizards website is the danceteam auditions!!

And they are REALLY pushing the lame blue and bronze colors more than ever. I really hate these colors and I am so disapointed the Wizards refuse to return to the glory of the Red White and Blue! Even that lame Wizard basketball moon emblem would look cool if it were red white and blue. I really hate our colors and especially our smurf blue road uniforms. And don't even start on the gold uniforms which they also seem to be pushing on their website which leads me to believe they'll be returning again this season which makes me want to puke!!

We have the dumbest uniforms in the league and the worst colors. Whoever is doing the marketing for the team must have their head up their butt.

Posted by: Darnell | July 22, 2007 8:13 PM

Darnell:

The main reason Maggette's name keeps coming up in trade talks is because he's been very open in his unhappiness at being a backup. He wants to start, which he wouldn't do on the Wiz, esp. after Grunfeld just inked Stevenson to a new long-term deal.

Posted by: kalorama | July 22, 2007 10:58 PM

Kalorama, you really think Stevenson would start over Maggette??

Posted by: Darnell | July 22, 2007 11:38 PM

I would take Maggette over DS any day, although DS is a better 3 point shooter. In any regard, Maggette makes a lot more $$$$ though.

Posted by: DC Man88 | July 23, 2007 12:10 AM

Ivan can you please write an article investigating why the Washington NBA franchise in our nation's capital abandoned it's Red White and Blue colors??

Posted by: Darnell | July 23, 2007 12:44 AM

IMO we should trade the rights to JNC to Utah for the rights to Kyrylo Fesenko.

That would be an excellent trade!

Posted by: Darnell | July 23, 2007 1:09 AM

Cassell is in the last year of his deal which makes a large expiring contract. Daniels would give them a starting point, which they don't have, since Cassell is 37 and breaking down. Meggette and Cassell would be two players that we would have interest in. And they are one of the few teams that has a skilled 7 footer to offer.
Kaman's extension kicks in this year and their owner is said to be unhappy with paying what he regards to be an average center 10m per year. Haywood and Daniels and the rights to Navarro for Kaman would work. And Kalorama, before you say "they'd never" review the history of the Clippers' deals and remember the same people are still in charge. Elgin and Wes used to be regulars at the lottery draw together.
So there's two different possibilities to go with Meggette, but Kalorama's right, we should never consider talking to the Clippers. Why ever even think about talking to a team that has traded away more allstar players than any other team in the history? Does the name Elvin Hayes ring any bells?
If I was running a team the first guy I'd be calling every day would be the Clippers, just would want to be sure that when they were ready to make another really stupid move that they still had my number.
And sooner or later they will!

Posted by: GM | July 23, 2007 8:34 AM

If we can get good value for JCN (including ET's salary), then it makes sense to trade him. If not, the Wiz can force him back to Europe and hope that he will return when we're in a better salary cap situation. While there's no guarantee that he'll return next year (or ever), JCN will have to deal with the Wiz in order to realize his NBA dreams.

It's interesting to me that, before JCN announced that he wanted to come to the NBA next season, Ernie had been quoted in the media that he didn't expect JCN to leave Europe anytime soon. I suspect that Ernie had spoken with JCN's agent about the very limited cap room for the 07 season and that it would be better for JCN to come out for the 08 season (when the Wiz would have more flexibility). JCN's decision to come out this summer -- and all of his and his agent's comments about Memphis and Miami being high on their list -- can be viewed as an attempt to force Ernie's hand.

It would be a mistake for Ernie to cave into what I perceive as posturing by the JCN camp. If we can get good value, then let's trade him. But let's not feel like we need to give him away.

When we drafted him in the second round several years ago, it was as a long-term investment that might never pay off but could pay off big. I would maintain that strategy.

Posted by: DanPeter | July 23, 2007 9:16 AM

I have no idea why so many guys in this blog are nutting. We don't HAVE to do anything !! AS much as I like Blatche, he played an insignificant role the last 2 years while the team played very well. If we lose him, we lose what ? Again, while I'd prefer to keep Andray, we'd probably be better off letting him go and signing JCN if it comes down to one or the other. Even Gil says we need a guard who can shoot. Let's not just give JCN away for a #2. That's ridiculous. His value is higher than that.

Posted by: mark | July 23, 2007 9:28 AM

Mark, it doesn't come down to one or the other. We have early bird rights on Blatche, no exceptions and thus 1.8 to sign Navarro.

If they moved Cassell for Daniels they'd still need a PG because Daniels is a part timer. I think he averaged fewer minutes than Cassell. Maggette is a favorite of Donald Sterling which is part of the reason they've never pulled the trigger on deals.

Posted by: Monte | July 23, 2007 9:59 AM

I didn't think it was one or the other either exactly. The reason I said that is because it seems that our only strategy is packaging Etan and JCN, which frees up space for Blatche. I'm assuming that Abe will not pay the luxury tax. I'm almost sure of that. If freeing up space for Blatche to keep us under the cap has to be done, that's why I referred to it as one or the other. If there's a way to keep Blatche and JCN, I'm all for it. I think we can deal with the Etan/Haywood drama one more year. We just need to stick with one or the other ALL YEAR...preferably Haywood. I know there'll be days when he gets 5 rebounds in 30 minutes but Etan is NOT the answer. Feed the post a few times a game and Haywood is happy and he'll rebound. Snatch him out for Etan and he sulks on the court. It's real simple.

Posted by: mark | July 23, 2007 10:19 AM

Monte, are you saying that we can sign Blatche for whatever without regard to the luxury tax? If that's the case, why are we all panicking in this blog? Just sign JCN, sign Blatche and we have no luxury tax issues next year when Jamison comes off. It seems like we are all intent on doing something when maybe doing noting is the best course of action. On thing i'm sure of is...we need to keep Blatche because he's young, talented and an asset. Another thing is that JCN is worth more than a 2nd round pick now and we should not trade him just to free up space or just to get rid of Etan. If we have to do it to sign Blatche, yes. Otherwise, let's sign 'em all. AJ is making 18mill this year. Next year, it'll be a third of that.

Posted by: mark | July 23, 2007 10:24 AM

No. I'm saying that we can't sign Navarro because we don't have the money. Re-signing Blatche doesn't effect the cap but does count toward the luxury tax. We have money, via exception in the CBA, for Blatche. The only thing left for Navarro is 1.8 and he's not taking that. So the "just sign him" thinking doesn't work.

Ernie is trying to move salary because we're gonna be very close to the tax threshold and going over by 1 dollar costs 1.9 million... and 2 dollars. Seeing as how there is no clear advantage to paying it, its a worthy exercise not to.

Posted by: Monte | July 23, 2007 11:44 AM

The problem is that now that we've signed Stevenson, everyone knows we're not able to sign JNC so why should they offer anything good. We had more leverage before completing the deal with DeShawn. At this point we'll be lucky to get anything better than a 2nd round pick IMO, and may end up getting nothing if we don't do something soon.

Posted by: Darnell | July 23, 2007 1:54 PM

I hate this lack of news... what is going on with the rest of the team? What about guys like Booth, Mason, Hayes, Taylor, Ruffin? Are we trying to keep any of these guys? I know Mason has been working out at Verizon this offseason and doing team functions in the community as if he's still part of the team. Ivan reported a long time ago they intended to keep Booth. What is going on with Blatche? Are we really going to keep Brendan and Etan??

I think Visser was a total bust in Vegas by the way. I hope we get Darryl Watkins in our training camp!

Posted by: Darnell | July 23, 2007 2:00 PM

they know we have to deal him, or he goes back to Europe. There's no leverage that he has to play in the NBA this year. I don't think it helps us sign him next year, but its more than enough to keep from being taken advantage of. If Ernie doesn't get the right offer he can go to Navarro and say that waiting would be the best option and that they couldn't get anything done for a player of his skill level.

Posted by: Stringer | July 23, 2007 2:59 PM

"..."but Kalorama's right, we should never consider talking to the Clippers."

And where, exactly, did I say that? Oh wait, I didn't. I said I "can't see us dealing with the Clippers". There's a difference between stating an opinion (which is what I stated) and an intentional misrepresentation of fact(which is what you did when you willfully twisted what I said).

And I stand by my opinion. I don't see it as at all likely that the Clippers and Wiz would make that trade. Is that a fact? No. But then neither is your opposing opinion that the Clippers would make such a deal.

Your trade scenarios are no more irrefutable fact than my response to them. They're all just opinions. I understand and accept this. You should try to do the same.

As for the specifics of what you said:

"Cassell is in the last year of his deal which makes a large expiring contract. Daniels would give them a starting point, which they don't have, since Cassell is 37 and breaking down. Meggette and Cassell would be two players that we would have interest in. And they are one of the few teams that has a skilled 7 footer to offer.".

We just signed Stevenson to a long-term deal to be our starting SG. Is Magette a better player than Stevenson? Sure. Could Magette start in D.C. Sure. But what to do with Stevenson? He thrives almost entirely from his role as a starter between Arenas, Jamison, and Butler. He would be much less effective coming off the bench. And given the Wizards need for scoring off the bench, Magette would make much more sense as a backup SG choice. But he doesn't want to be a backup. And Stevenson re-signed to be the starter. So if they traded for Magette they'd end up with two SG's making starting salary, only one of them would be a backup, a role to which he would (A)not be well-suited and (B) overpaid.

And Daniels is not a starting caliber PG at this stage of his career. As many here have pointed out in the past, he's best suited as a backup.

And if the Wiz trade Navarro's rights and Daniels to the Clippers, who are the Wiz going to have for a backup PG going forward? Not Cassell, since (as you made clear in your proposal) the whole point of trading for him would be his expiring contract, which would come off the books at year's end.

Posted by: kalorama | July 23, 2007 4:21 PM

"The problem is that now that we've signed Stevenson, everyone knows we're not able to sign JNC so why should they offer anything good."

Because the Wiz don't actually have any urgent need to trade him. If it's really all about money, they could just as easily not offer him a deal (or offer him a league minimum deal, which he would reject) and let him go back to Europe. The Wiz can afford to hold out until they get an offer they like, because waiting really costs them nothing. It's not like not having him in camp hurts the Wiz, because they're clearly not planning on him being there anyway. Ernie can drag this thing out for as long as he wants.

Posted by: kalorama | July 23, 2007 4:28 PM

Bottom line is, for the teams that really want Navarro, the Wiz still have more leverage, because they have something that those other teams want but that the Wiz don't really want/need.

It's kind of like E-bay. Most of the stuff for sale is junk the sellers want to get rid of. If they don't sell it they'll probably just toss it into a corner and forget about it, or throw it away all together. But all it takes are two bidders who really want to have it to create a bidding war that drives the price up.

Posted by: kalorama | July 23, 2007 4:39 PM

"And where, exactly, did I say that? Oh wait, I didn't."

"Your trade scenarios are no more irrefutable fact than my response to them. They're all just opinions. I understand and accept this. You should try to do the same."

"There's a difference between stating an opinion (which is what I stated) and an intentional misrepresentation of fact(which is what you did when you willfully twisted what I said)."
-----------------------

Does anyone else read this garbage and picture the comic book retailer from the Simpsons like I do?

Posted by: Anonymous | July 23, 2007 5:24 PM

We would be better off letting Navarro go back to Europe than trading him to the Cavs or the Heat for a draft pick or a bum (Jason Williams, Posey, Newble, David Wesley), even if they do take Etan or Haywood.
We have no incentive to help a rival.

Posted by: Emmet | July 23, 2007 10:45 PM

Hey Ivan, Wizards hired Randy Ayers.

Also Spurs waived James White, an athletic sg/sf from Kensington MD, who was 31st pick in draft last season out of Cincinnati. Please tell me we will pick him up and invite him to camp!

Are you awake bro??

Posted by: Darnell | July 24, 2007 3:01 AM

Given our salary situation, I'd be going hard after some of these young guys out their with upside, add to our youth and athleticism, and hopefully find a gem in the rough.

I'd be sending the rights to JNC to Utah for the rights to Ukranian center Kyrylo Fesenko. Keep him in Europe a year like we did with Pesh. He would be a lottery pick in next year's draft.

I'd be bringing in James White, Darryl Watkins, and Zabian Dowdell to training camp, in addition to Aaron Miles.

Posted by: Darnell | July 24, 2007 3:11 AM

this "lottery pick in the next draft" line is getting old. Fesenko was a second rounder in 07 but would have been a lottery pick in 08? You don't actually believe that or think its in some way relevant do you?

Randy Ayers? Ouch. Welcome coach "won't step on any toes by making an impact".

Posted by: Monte | July 24, 2007 10:03 AM

Gilbert would be a lottery pick next year.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 24, 2007 10:41 AM

I am so tired of looking at the Wizards Washington Post page and seeing that headline "It Took a Compromise" and seeing that picture of Brian Chase who did nothing in Vegas! What is going on?!

Posted by: Darnell | July 24, 2007 12:30 PM

James White can run and can jump through the roof. Unfortunately, that doesn't make him a good basketball player, which he isn't. Although the Wiz have nothing to lose by inviting him camp, I wouldn't expect too much from it.

Posted by: Bill Baxter | July 24, 2007 12:30 PM

its pretty bad that the Spurs spent a year plus on him and he still doesn't play good ball. they cut him to get out from under a couple hundred grand... thats bad.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 24, 2007 1:12 PM

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/basketball/nba/07/24/ayers.wizards.ap/index.html

SI.com piece on Randy Ayers joining the Wiz staff.

Jordan is quoted as saying "As an assistant with the Philadelphia 76ers, he implemented the defensive schemes for a team that advanced to the NBA finals..." But that was working under a head coach who lived and breathed defense. It's hard to imagine him having the same impact on the Wiz.

Posted by: kalorama | July 24, 2007 5:50 PM

"We would be better off letting Navarro go back to Europe than trading him to the Cavs or the Heat for a draft pick or a bum (Jason Williams, Posey, Newble, David Wesley), even if they do take Etan or Haywood.
We have no incentive to help a rival."

We do if it helps us at the same time. It's all about the plus/minus cost/benefit analysis. Does what the Wiz get back help them as much or more as what they're giving up. Ultimately the whole thing hinges on what kind of player Navarro turns out to be. I get the distinct impression that Ernie isn't expecting much out of him.

Posted by: kalorama | July 24, 2007 5:54 PM

Posted by: | July 23, 2007 05:24 PM

yawn.

Posted by: kalorama | July 24, 2007 6:02 PM

keep JCN...some how some way cuz i dont want the wiz to make another big mistake in letting a guy they drafted years ago and let him develop into a superstar in europe and then trade him to a rival like miami....keep him

Posted by: mjc | July 24, 2007 10:01 PM

I'll take Haslem for JCN and run. Fast.

Posted by: Seymour Scagnetti | July 25, 2007 10:15 AM

The Wiz look pretty deep to me. Who are the odd men out though of this group? By my count five have to go.

Arenas, Stevenson, Daniels, Nick Young, Mason, Navarro

Hayes, McGuire, Ruffin, Butler, Jamison, Songaila, Pecherov, Blatche

Thomas, Haywood, Booth

Posted by: NatSkinWizCap | July 25, 2007 12:03 PM

Ivan where are you brother??

Wizards have until Aug 3rd to deal Navarro, or he's gonna stay in Europe and sign a new contract.

His agent say other teams are interested other than Miami and Memphis. We gotta at least get a draft pick!!

I still wish we had signed him instead of DeShawn.

Posted by: Darnell | July 25, 2007 3:47 PM

I think the max is 14, so three need to go:
Ruffin, Mason, Hayes

Posted by: Emmet | July 25, 2007 11:52 PM

i think we should trade the rights of JCN to the Utah Jazz for Kyrylo Fesenko ...he is regarded to be a hard worker on the boards and can get blocks but his offfense need a little work...


Full Name: Kyrylo Fesenko (KI-ree-low FEH-senk-o)
Position: Center
Height/Weight: 7-0 / 235
Birthdate: December 24, 1986 (Dnepropetrovsk, Ukraine)
High School:

Team: Cherkaski Mavpi
Country: Ukraine

Strengths: Aggressive rebounder and shot blocker who prefers to operate from the perimeter offensively.

An early entry candidate for the 2007 NBA Draft. Originally an early entry candidate for the 2006 NBA Draft before withdrawing his name from consideration.
Career Highlights: Has grown up and played professionally in his native Ukraine. Started his career in the Higher League playing for Azovmash Mariupol's Second Team before moving on to the First Team in the Ukranian SuperLeague for 2004-05 and the first half of the 2005-06 season. Played with SC Mariupol during the second half of the 2005-06 season and with Cherkasi Mavpi during the 2006-07 season. A member of the Ukranian National Team. Averaged 6.8 points, 6.9 rebounds, and 2.0 blocked shots at the 2005 U20 European Championships in Moscow. Contributed 12.0 points, 6.6 rebounds and 2.6 blocked shots at the 2004 U18 European Championships in Zaragoza, Spain.

2006-07: Averaged 6.7 points, 6.2 rebounds and 1.6 blocked shots in 18.5 minutes a contest. Scored in double figures seven times, posting a season-high of 17 points. In six games at the FIBA EuroCup Challenge, averaged 7.2 points, 8.0 rebounds and 2.0 blocked shots in 18.7 minutes a contest.

2005-06: Started the season with Azovmash, averaging 5.1 points, 4.4 rebounds and 1.3 blocked shots in 11.8 minutes a contest in nine games in the Ukraninan league. Also appeared in two FIBA EuroCup games and scored two points. Moved on to SC Mariupol, averaging 15.3 points and 8.7 rebounds in nine games.

2004-05: For Azovmash, averaged 7.3 points, 3.8 rebounds and 0.8 blocked shots in six games in the Ukranian League. Appeared in five FIBA EuroCup contest (then called the FIBA Europe League), averaging 3.2 points and 1.8 rebounds. Tallied 14 points, five rebounds and two blocked shots vs. Besiktas.

Posted by: Fulvio | July 26, 2007 8:19 AM

2006-07: Averaged 6.7 points, 6.2 rebounds and 1.6 blocked shots in 18.5 minutes a contest.

he averaged this in only 18.5 min imagin what he can do in 30 min

Posted by: Fulvio | July 26, 2007 8:20 AM

Posted by: Fulvio | July 26, 2007 9:10 AM

Propsed Trade

Trade:

Washington Gets:

-Kyrylo Fesenko


Utah Gets:

-JCN
-maybe 2nd Round Draft Pick (if they dont accept the swap for only the players)

this would wor beacfuse niehter players are signed and i Fesenko would come at a much cheaper price about $600,00 a year

hey guys try the trade machine on ESPN they have put up a new thin its at the bottom now every team has trade assessts (unsigned draft picks, cash compensation)

Posted by: Fulvio | July 26, 2007 9:25 AM

Memphis signed G Jacobsen. Miami is talking with houston 'bout trading Doleac for Alston. These were the main 2 teams asking about this guy. Memphis is now outta the picture.

(I can't think of any other team that'll really be interested like his agent said.)

I said it a couple of days ago we are gonna end up with nothing for this guy. Especially since now there is a deadline (AUG 3).

Miami has a couple of 2nd rounders maybe we should ask for that instead. Not bad 2 second rounders for 1 VS losing a second round pick.

I would also prefered to have sign him and see how his skills translated on the court here.


Posted by: MikeD | July 26, 2007 9:29 AM

all i know is if we let him go back to europe we get nuttin...and his buyout goes back up to 14 mil. which means hes gonna stay over there for like 2 to 3 more years.
just sign him and go over the luxury tax a little its not gonna kill them.

Posted by: mjc | July 26, 2007 11:07 AM

all i know is if we let him go back to europe we get nuttin...and his buyout goes back up to 14 mil. which means hes gonna stay over there for like 2 to 3 more years.
just sign him and go over the luxury tax a little its not gonna kill them.

Posted by: mjc | July 26, 2007 11:07 AM

if Navarro is as good as I keep hearing, whey dont we just sign him?

Posted by: bulletsfan | July 26, 2007 12:19 PM

Fulvio, yeah I've been sayin that! That would be a very good deal for us to make. Utah is close, and can compete for the finals. It makes sense for them to add an experienced player who can contribute now, rather than a player who may not be ready for a year or 2. JNC would fit very well with the style of play in Utah, and add a perimeter scorer who can pass with championship experience.

I would love to get Fesenko, a legit center 7-1 270 who plays physical, and has a low post game. He played in the same league as Pecherov.

Here is a very good scouting report on him:
http://draftexpress.com/viewprofile.php?p=1065

Scouts a game he played against Pecherov's team, and compares him to GS's Andris Biedrins. I've seen footage of him playing, and he is going to be very good.

Rights to Navarro to Utah for rights to Fesenko.

Posted by: Darnell | July 26, 2007 3:47 PM

Ivan, can you ask Grunfeld if he'd have interest in a player like Fesenko who may be considered a "project" in return for JNC??

Posted by: Darnell | July 26, 2007 3:51 PM

yea Darnell you gave me the i dea i looked him up and i was impressed at least we agree on something he can be a double double center easily

in 18.5 min he averages almost 7 points and 6 boards and 2 blocks i can see him going for 12-14 ppg 10 rpg and 3 bpg if he can get 30 min i really like this guy

Posted by: Fulvio | July 26, 2007 8:47 PM

What does Jason Kapono have to do with anything? He's not a "playmaking guard".

Posted by: Joe Blazer | July 30, 2007 7:27 AM

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