"Israeli chief of Staff Dan Halutz this week ordered the Air Force to bomb 10 buildings in south Beirut for every rocket that falls in Haifa "

If this is true it's an act of immense stupidity as it will create a "Lidice" effect that will add another generation of combatants to this cycle of madness.

One major element no one seems to notice is the total lack of regret displayed by Hizbollah's leaders for the sufferings their aggression has brought to the civilians they place their installations and weapons among.
Another major element is the 'bragging done' by ' Hizbollah' at the losses (however small in number) inflicted on Israel, and the hiding of their own much greater losses.
Israel and Israelis by the way are not good at 'propaganda' and emphasize the same thing, our own losses. We also do not boast about killing others, an admirable trait morally but not psychologically wise in dealing with a cruel enemy.

Civilian death toll in Lebanon reaches 600 people.

just a whim, now we can stop hearing the boast of the 6-day war.

i believe that war is never good. but if i "have to" choose who to cheer between Israel and Hizbollah, the later i pick.

the rarionale is: civilian casualty is inevitable in wars. weird enough, that doesn't give the reason to stop killing(war) but to justify it. in a sense it says that we shouldn't care about civilian casualty. i think that's right. it's so remote to me that i don't feel the pain of the unfortunate people there. so i should just sit down watch the "game" unfolding and as i do as usual, rooting for the underdog.

The current rules of war established post WWII are about to start changing to the colonial era about 100 years earlier where civilian casaulties were an expected result of war. Terrorist and insurgent organizations are successfully using civilians as shields placing national armies at a strategic disadvantage. As the capability of these para-state organizations increases with their new weaponary, national armies will be increasingly called on to take more extreme measures to destroy the insurgents. The initial success of the insurgents will only lead to increasingly large civilians casualties. This will also lead to a growing division between the West and Arabs/Persians.

terrorism should never win. Those who support it should be attacked and brought down. Iran, Syria, and North Korea should all be eliminated

War sucks, nobody wins! People die and for what! Live and let live!

i just want to give a reminder about the argument about the hiding of Hizbollah among civilians (because it sounds so apologetic to me).

Hizbollah is in southern Lebanon, while the Israel bombing occurred during the first 10 days covered the most of the Lebanon territory. The targets they picked are strictly civilian. their motivation of punishing the Lebanese civilians was so obivious. it's after the international tide turned against their such action, they changed the rhetoric and limited their targeting areas.

Right after 9/11, almost all U.S. citizens vowed to procsecrote terrorists, State-based or otherwise. There was unanimity on this point. Since then, for years we have watched the Iranian government snub its nose at this concept and at us as a people and at our Government. It is now high time for the U.S. Congress to declare war against the Iranian Government. If we meant what we vowed and what was said and agreed to by nearly all Americans as regards to terrorist governments, we must declare war against the Iranian Government now and no longer yield to their treachery towards us and our ally, Israel, which all modern governments acknowledge, including most governments in the Middle East, has a right to their State there. Indeed, there will never be any pushing of Israelis into the sea allowed, how ridiculous for the Iranian Government to pursue such a policy any longer. Such an absurd and warrior policy must no longer be tolerated by great nations. Because of their beliefs, the Irranian Government will never be allowed nukes and surely they can see why. Do they think we are so stupid as to allow this considering their public stance? So, it is either peace or war and no nukes. After declaring war, the Iranian government should have no more than 24 hours to decide, and then we attack if no armistice is signed. Peace or war, which is Mr. and Mrs. Iranian Government?

This "Hezbollah is hidding among civilians" is Israeli propaganda.

Who was hidding in the airport when they bombed it?

Israeli governments bans the press from reporting on the location of its military bases when they expect Hezbollah to tell them where they exactly are.

BOYCOTT ISRAEL.

All that we've managed is to add another country starting with an I to Bush's long list of failures, managed to turn off virtually the entire world (ok, UK and the US, big whoop), and by shipping guided smart bombs to Israel made it obvious Bush and his red commies have no real plans other than lining the pockets of the party elites.

And all this in a place that fits inside my state. It's like Seattle is at war with Redmond.

Talk about farce ...

An army of technological inferiorities will use guerilla tactics to outsmart the enemy. Is that so hard to understand for the people who claim Middle Easterners use hospitals as shields? People are complaining about the inaccurate Katyusha rockets killing Jewish civilians. The same could be said for the "accurate" Jewish rockets killing Lebanese. All I'm saying is, if you had to fight against an army 10 times your size with 10 times your rockets, hit and run would be your strategy too.

When Israel attacked our naval vessel the USS Liberty in 1967 it said that it was accidential. For over ninety minutes Israeli jets bombed and machine gunned a US ship that was flying the flag Amidships and aft. That is an example of how Israel "defends" itself.

Now with its intentional targeting of Lebanon's civilians Israel has created more ememies then ever before. Syria has taken in thousand of victims of Isreali aggression. It has provided the Lebanese refugees with medical care, food and shelter.

A smart person will realize that Israel has lost its remaing captial of sympathy from the international debate.

Hi Will in Seattle. To 'action jackson':

'terrorism should never win. Those who support it should be attacked and brought down. Iran, Syria, and North Korea should all be eliminated'

I presume you'll be the first volunteer to go fight--right?

I'm afraid when the Israeilis staart talking about 'ethnic cleansing' they've lost me. When you join a religion, do you check your heart and brain at the door?

karim wrote:
"This "Hezbollah is hidding among civilians" is Israeli propaganda. Who was hidding in the airport when they bombed it?"

This is a silly argument that ignores the stated reason for bombing the airport, to enforce an air and sea blockaid. Hezbollah has offices in the southern Beirut, where only Hez members are allowed, thus the bombing there. And Nasrallah has a command and control bunker ... a bunker ... there. Isn't it against Geneva Protocol One to place military headquarters in populated neighborhoods? http://abcnews.go.com/International/Mideast/wireStory?id=2192803
When you fight a war you don't just fight the frontline fighter, you go after command, control and supplies which since Hez headquarters being located in southern Beirut make it a legitimate target. Can you tell me why Haifa neighborhoods are a legitimate target of Hezbollah?

As for Hez's addiction to using Muslim civilians as human shields, this has been reported by many neutral observers over many years. What is probably not as well known is that many of these shields willingly become shields. Not all though. Its currently being reported that Hez is setting up roadblocks to prevent civilians from leaving southern Lebanon and preventing the UN from coming in to assist in the evacuation. What a nice bunch of guys...

Nothing could come from a cease-fire conference (even if it is held in Rome!) if the ones firing - Hezbollah and Israel in this case - are not attending and neither of them obey those who do attend.

The UN can only be viewed as incompetent by leaving its observers in southern Lebanon and in the direct line of fire. The result being tragic loss of life. For no good reason. They were equally incomptent in refusing additional security in Iraq which resulted in their offices being bombed, staff killed and their eventual withdrawl.
Kofi Annan has to go.

Drindl wrote:
"I'm afraid when the Israelis start talking about 'ethnic cleansing' they've lost me. When you join a religion, do you check your heart and brain at the door?"

Don't be fooled by Arkin's twisting of words. He reads about military cleansing, meaning to rid the area of fighters, and he hears ethnic cleansing and then reports it as such. It doesn't even make sense. What would Israel cleaning? In Kosovo it was serbs ethnically cleansing muslims from towns leaving only serbs in the towns. What type of ethnic cleansing is Arkin talking about? Go back and read what Arkin wrote and see for yourself. A Post commentator should not be taking words and twisting their meanings.

Both sides are clearly monsters. I just don't understand why my tax money goes to support one monster (the Zionist state) versus the other. Especially since Israel has done this:
1: Attacked a naval vessel the USS Liberty in 1967.
2: Stole Nuclear Weapons technology from us in the 60's
3: So indiscriminantly kills civilians including Red Cross workers and clearly marked United Nations Posts.
4: Is so cowardly stupid to think what they failed at 20 years ago will be successful today. If Israel really wants to stop Hezbolla they need to attack that weed at the root. The root is Syria/Iran. Only they are too cowardly to attack people that can defend themselves on equal ground.

As a US citizen I am saddened by my country's support of Israel. In fact MOST US citizens don't give a damn about Israel. It's the rich Jewish lobby that has our dear republic hostage to supporting their monstrous brothers in Israel. Funny it was that same rich Jewish lobby that helped slavery last so long in the US and profited the most from it, in owning the slave ships, and selling insurance on slaves.

I'm not anti-semitic, but the people of Israel and Jews as a whole need to start giving people reasons to love them instead of despise. Perhaps then terrorism would be abated. Their destruction of Israel does not help their cause.

Geo wrote:
"The UN can only be viewed as incompetent by leaving its observers in southern Lebanon and in the direct line of fire."

Agreed. They even let Hez place rocket and morter launchers in the shadows of UN buildings in S. Lebanon. You'd think military people would be worried about that, but not UNIFIL. And of course UNIFIL, which dutifily verified Israel left S. Lebanon never verified the other part of the agreement, the disarming of Hezbollah. Just what is the UN doing in S. Lebanon anyway? Acting as human shields is all I can surmise.

Most Arab terrorist countries want the US to perish. I have been there and spoken and seen the reactions of Arab people. They rejoice at the site of American women and children being killed. They talk big about drowning us in a sea of blood. Only good thing is they sure dont like to fight a fair fight and give up real easy when confronted with force. Time to take out the trash, lets get rid of these terrorist groups and the governments that back them. My opinion only, we live in a free country, I would like you to go to one of these countries and say something bad about their government in the open, can you say "Opps their goes my head". :)

*"Their destruction of LEBANNON does not help their cause."

Sully, I really doubt anyone acts as a human shield voluntarily. I don't trust anything I hear about this, because both sides and lying and acting like animals. 'Cleansing' has only one meaning. Please, stop making excuses.

The world see this as a proxy war with Israel acting for the US against muslims. The fact that Israel is using US cluster bombs, that are designned to maim, doesn't help. There will be retribution. If my family dies, will anyone in Israel care? For that matter, will anyone in my own government? I sincerely doubt it. We're all being used as pawns in a war over land and oil.

Hizbollah (and the IDF too) must have thought ahead of time. they ran hiding in the hospitals, in the grocery stores, in the paper factories, ... etc, in ... not to mention, the beirut apartements before the bombings even started.

the casualty in Lebanon in the 1st 10 days was strictly, 100%, civilians.

be careful when one says it's okay to bomb civilian targets just because he doubts the other side's combatants might hide in those places no matter how slim the possibility is. and if that gives you the rationale for bombing, it justifies the other side's bombing similar targets, too.

Also, this is so awful to think the civilians should die in company with the death of the combatants.

Israel is not good for propaganda. only they know to intercept Lebanonese TV broadcasting signals and rebroadcast their content. and they know to dispatch cellphone text messages among the Lebanese.

why Hizbollah bombed Haifa? isn't it because they perceived Israel's killing of Lebanese civilians giving them the reason to retaliate? Or do you think only Israel is justified for retaliation actions?

is it so hard to see that war is NOT the solution.

What do Persians and Shias have to do with the arab-israeli conflict? Many Sunni arabs don't even consider them muslims anyway. Iran is a large and wealth country with an educated and progressive population that could be a regional super power if only got its act together. What the world needs is another revolution in Iran.

it is so awful to think that the vast civilians should die in company with the destruction of few combatants.

Do any of you posters have any idea whatsoever of what you are debating? Not a single one of you has made a logical argument opposing Israel or Hezbollah (let alone being able to correctly spell the terrorist group's name). Have a single one of you studied the history instead of just listening to the porpoganda fed to you by the american media? If not then I suggest you close your mouths and turn off your computers because none of you has done your due dillegance and therefore have no rational, countable opinions. Hezbollah is in fact a terrorist group, and the fact that they are hiding in civillian area's is a fact to which they have in the past and present not denyed or attempted to hide. They have actually always openly admitted to doing so. The UN was responsible for disarming Hezbollah when Israel pulled out of Lebanon back in 2000, and never followed through with their promises. Now once again Hezbollah has come into the frey and decided that it wants their turn to enter the new Jihad. This war in the middle East is and has always been about getting rid of Israel. Israel has fought and won it's right to exist and has attempted to live peacefully with its neighbors. It's neighbors however have always had a different idea, and instead of standing up and being honest about the circumstances they are taking a back alley approach by claiming injustices by Israel which are actually preformed on the common man in the Middle East by their own governments. The Palestinian Government get's a huge allowance every month, and yet the common man lives with no electricity or running water while their leaders live in palaces with gold toilets purchased with the money that was intended to feed the nation. But no, blame Israel. Give me a Break!!!
Enough with victimizations! Im sick of hearing people believing that they are owed luxuries. If you want a better life...WORK HARDER! No one owes anyone anything. Get over yourselves.
Terrorism in all forms should never be tolerated nor allowed to occur without severe reprocussions! Hezbollah had it comming. Ignoring acts of terrorism such as the unprovoked capture of soldiers, only allows the terrorists to believe that we will do nothing about it. We must stand against all acts of Terrorism with such force as to ensure that it will never happen again.

Cleanse: to free a place, person, or society from something wrong or unwelcome. ie. to cleanse the government of corrupt influences. Encarta Disctionary. The term makes perfect sense in the context of removing Hez fighters from their S. Lebanon strongholds.

I don't think the US can really afford another two years of Bush. We go from one disaster to another. Somebody, please, take him out! March to the WH and take him out of there.

"They rejoice at the site of American women and children being killed."

The U.S is rushing deliveries of precision guided bombs to Israel (which just happen to be so inaccurate that the majority of casualties are civilian). Why would the Arabs not be happy to see the U.S suffer? This administration has basically been egging on the Israelis to keep killing. The U.S is complicit in whatever atrocities Israel commits in Lebanon. Don't whine when Iran and Syria provide Hezbollah a small fraction of the support that the U.S provides Israel.

"Only good thing is they sure dont like to fight a fair fight and give up real easy when confronted with force."

The British were complaining about the same thing when the American revolutionary war took place. So the U.S was founded by terrorists eh? As far as giving up when confronted with force is concerned, it has not happened in Palestine. The U.S and the Israelis were kicked out of Lebanon after trying to occupy it the first time, and last time I checked you had pretty much no control over Iraq. When people make statements such as "those people do not understand and respect anything but force" it sounds like they need to be living in Lawrence of Arabia's world. Sixty years of "confronting with force" have not pacified the Palestinians. Get a clue. Start negotiating without pre-conditions. Give them their land back.

annoyed mama,

please recommand a history book.

"Israeli chief of Staff Dan Halutz this week ordered the Air Force to bomb 10 buildings in south Beirut--for every rocket that falls in Haifa "

WOW,

That is what the Nazis did.
Stalin and other, Saddam Hussein etc prescribed to the same method of dealing with resistance. For any attack on them they would will kill 5 or 10 or 100. You pick the number.

I guess the Jews are not the helpless victims they are like to claim. More like Nazis or Stalinists or... You pick it.

Kieran Cox wrote:
"Both sides are clearly monsters. I just don't understand why my tax money goes to support one monster (the Zionist state) versus the other."

Let not forget what those nice Hezbollah people have done to the US:

1) 1983 Bombed the marine barracks in Lebanon killing 241 peacekeeping marines.
2) 1982-1991 Thirty US and other Western hostages kidnapped in Lebanon by Hezbollah. Some were killed, some died in captivity, and some were eventually released. Terry Anderson was held for 2,454 days.
3) 1985 TWA Flight 847 en route from Athens to Rome hijacked to Beirut by Hezbollah terrorists and held for 17 days. A U.S. Navy diver was executed.
4) 1985 Tortured and killed the CIA station chief William Buckley.
5) 1996 Hezbollah bombed the Khobar Towers in killing nineteen American servicemen.

Israel has appologised for the Liberty attack and others. Haven't heard any amount of sorrow from Hezbollah, just "Death to America". These people are uncivilized barbarians.

annoyed mama:

"This war in the middle East is and has always been about getting rid of Israel."

Well yeah. They are the ones who came and occupied the land in 1948 aren't they? What did you think the Arabs would do? Roll over and say tickle me under my turban for occupying my land?
But that's history now. The war will stop when Israel either at least retreats to the 67 borders, or becomes a non-ideological state with equal rights and votes for both Arabs and Jews.

"Ignoring acts of terrorism such as the unprovoked capture of soldiers"

So you would rather they attack civilians? If two soldiers can provoke the destruction of a nation and hundreds of dead civilians (one third children), perhaps attacking civilians is the best route. Israel provokes the actions committed against it by continuing to occupy lands that do not belong to it. Hezbollah was born out of the atrocities committed by the Israelis the first time around. Perhaps it is you who needs to brush up on history.

Jo: If the Israeli chief of Staff really did order Air Force to bomb 10 buildings in south Beirut--for every rocket that falls in Haifa, then that must be condemned. Do we know he really said that?

This does not fit with so many other statements by Israeli leaders, who have expressed a strong policy in favor of minimizing civilian casualties and damage to civilian infrastructure.

"1) 1983 Bombed the marine barracks in Lebanon killing 241 peacekeeping marines.
2) 1982-1991 Thirty US and other Western hostages kidnapped in Lebanon by Hezbollah. Some were killed, some died in captivity, and some were eventually released. Terry Anderson was held for 2,454 days.
3) 1985 TWA Flight 847 en route from Athens to Rome hijacked to Beirut by Hezbollah terrorists and held for 17 days. A U.S. Navy diver was executed.
4) 1985 Tortured and killed the CIA station chief William Buckley."

Let's see this was around the time that Israel occupied Lebanon. Over 20,000 civilians killed by Israel and the militia it supported (South Lebanese Army Militia of Lahad). Seems like the retribution was pretty minor.

Hey annoyed mama

My grandparents came from ireland 100+ years ago. I visit my grand cousins every couple of years or so and they love when I come and visit.

I wonder how they would feel and react if I showed up one day and claim the land of my ancestors. I would not be surprised if they would have me shoot (these terrorists grand cousins)

Think about it. Maybe you get it.

Zian wrote:
"Let's see this was around the time that Israel occupied Lebanon. Over 20,000 civilians killed by Israel and the militia it supported (South Lebanese Army Militia of Lahad). Seems like the retribution was pretty minor."

So you see it was justified? You approve?

'annoyed mama' don't talk about history when you have no idea. What arrogance... it only makes you look more ignorant and clueless.

Sully, I don't beleive anyone ever said Hizbollah were not terrorists. I didn't. As long as they attackng Israeli civilians, they should be disarmed. The UN should have done this... perhaps if it wasn't constantly demeaned in this country it might have more power. [Or why didn't the US go in wiht their bunker busters and root out Hizbollah instead of Saddam Hussein, who was not a threat to our interests?]

But that doesn't mean that Israel should do the same thing, does it? Discriminately kill, and terrorize civilians? Use weapons of mass destruction on a civilian population? I don't think so. How are they better then? Why should I care who 'wins'? And what will than mean, anyway?

Sure, Israel apologized for attacking us on numerous occasions, and spying on us, and stealing state secrets. But they still keep doing it.

Muslims and jews always fight to their own grave. What bothers me is American credibility suffers to new LOW!.

America is blocking UN from acting at all. World knows what is happening but its hands are tied.

They are watching. They will strike back when the right time comes.

It is really pathetic to see this kind of obscene support for jews killing innocent civilians from america.

World is shocked but helpless. They are upset at the impotency of all the world leading countries including russia,china,japan, germany and france.

Yes every one hate muslims and nothingw rong with that. They are worst.

But you can't condone the murder of lebanse civilians and UN by Israels Jews army.

World is seeing the JEWS with a suspecion. May be it is jews who are keeping palestenians under house arrest and palestenians just reacts.

Anyway religion is the stupidest thing humans created!.

Sully:
"Israel aplogized for attacking for the Liberty and others."

If you had a loved one among the over 200 killed and wounded by the deliberate and porlonged attack by Israeli jets and boats you wouldn't be dismissive of the terroist attack on our Naval ship.

It is a sign of what James Forestal, said when he opposed America's involvement with Israel after that country's founders committed numerous and contiuous terroist attacks against Palestinian and British civilians and civil servants.

Forestal, the first US Secretary of Defense, died from a fall of 16 floors from the Bethseda hospital. He believed that agents of the Israeli Mossad were out to murder him because of his opposition to America financing Israel from US taxpayers.

annoyed mama ,

The real terrorists are Israel. israel should n't exist at all. They exist because america is hijacked by rightw ing jews. simple as that.

Hizbollah and hamas are not terrorists. They are freedom fighters. They don't have high tech weapons to bomb israeli buidling like israel does witha merican weapons. So they fight where it hurts israel.

Even though i am no fan of muslim as i see Islam is a virus against civilized world but israel is occupying arab land illegally and should be wiped out when arabs get their chance. it is arabs right exterminate israel. Israel is doing all terrorism acts to stay in arab land. if there is a warcrime , it has to be all isrealis to be put in jail forever.

But again that is a dream.

So this war will go on and on until no muslims left in the world. By that time world will not exist as much as we see now.

Religion is evil.

Zain -- no, annoyed mama was right, it is indeed you who need to learn some basic history. The end of WW2 meant the redrawing of lots of borders, and the creation of many new states, not just Israel. The Israelis did not "occupy the Palestinians land." "Palestine" was a territory of the British, the Jordanians, et al but there was never a sovereign state of "Palestine." The so-called "Palestinians" fled the land because they hated the Jews and didn't want to live among them. Fine. But quit whining, and save that breath instead to ask why, SIXTY YEARS LATER, they are still in squallid refugee camps. When the modern state of Poland was created, the ethnic Germans who had been living there returned to their historic homeland, and the Germans already there helped them settle and reassimilate, because that is what decent people do. The Arabs have kept the "Palestinians" in poverty because it suits their most indecent purposes.

And no, Hezbollah was not created post-1948 to counter Israel, but rather is one of the current offshoots inspired by Sayyed Qutb (who also gave the world Wahhabism) in the 1920s. (PS, confidential message for Zain, the 1920s PREDATE World War II and the modern state of Israel. That means they came BEFORE, wouldn't want you to get confused AGAIN.)

Annoyed Mama, you are right, this blog is the exclusive province of the bigoted and the aggressively ignorant. It's a waste of time. You cannot reason anyone out of positions they were not reasoned into.

Here is the first politician I have ever seen who has brought up the issue of the ME as part of their main campaign message and spoken truthfully and insightfully about the Issues, and who has real credibility while other politicians work to shut down real debate just to save their own asses. Furthermore, he's running against Hillary and begging her to debate him on these issues!!! She's probably hiding in her basement, rolled up into a fetal position and quaking with fear over the prospect!

If you live in New York, Vote for Tasini against Hillary!

There are some really great insights here,
enjoy!

J

Touching The Third Rail: Speaking Some Truth
Submitted by Jonathan Tasini on July 26, 2006 - 2:24am.
When I announced that I was entering the race for the U.S. Senate, I began with a quote from Martin Luther King, Jr.: "Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter." I am not a professional politician whose sole goal is to accumulate power so I have the freedom to speak my mind and I will not be silent.

I've touched the "third rail" of politics in New York: the Israel-Palestine conflict, the dreadful occupation and the never-ending violence that is spinning out of control, in large part because the United States--and politicians like Hillary Clinton--continue to blindly pursue a one-sided policy in the Palestinian-Israel conflict, a policy that is causing more death and sorrow for civilians on all sides of the conflict and, ironically, is hurting the security of Israel.

From the beginning of this race, I was committed to speaking the truth, whether about the Iraq war/occupation or abusive corporate power or the corruption coursing through our political system. People are simply fed up with the pandering, the triangulation and the inability to speak the truth that is endangering our country's future, our relations in the world and our well-being at home. We need a real opposition party, a Democratic Party with a vision that has the spine to stand for something authentic and honest.

Voters should know a little about where I come from on the issue of Israel-Palestine and the raging conflict engulfing the region today. I speak about Israel out of love and pain, in the same way that I am a deeply patriotic American who is harshly critical of our government and its behavior in Iraq--and of Hillary Clinton's vote to send our men and women to die into an illegal, immoral war.

My father was born in then-Palestine. He fought in the Haganah (the Israeli underground) in the war of independence; my father's cousin, whose name I carry as a middle name, was killed in that war. I lived in Israel for seven years, during which I went through the 1973 war: a cousin of mine was killed in that war, leaving a young widow and two children, and his brother was wounded. My step-grandfather, an old man who was no threat to anyone, was killed by a Palestinian who took an axe to his head while he was sitting quietly on a park bench. Half my family still lives in Israel. I have seen enough bloodshed, tears, and parents burying their children to last many lifetimes.

For that reason, I believe passionately in a two-state solution, which includes a strong, independent, economically viable Palestinian state existing along side a strong, independent, economically vibrant Israel. It is the only solution that will bring peace to the civilians who now live in fear of death raining down from above--either because of the missiles of Hezbollah or the bombs of Israeli aircraft.

I do not believe Israel is a terrorist state. I do believe that Israel has committed acts that violate international standards and the Geneva conventions. In Israel, such a statement that the military has committed acts that violate the Geneva convention and international standards and has also engaged in torture (or, as it is called, "moderate pressure") would be a subject of debate but hardly considered novel or particularly radical. Among the many sources for the truth, beyond my personal experience, is the Israeli human rights organization, B'Tselem. If you visit the organization's website, you will find condemnation of both Israeli and Palestinian violence against civilians of each side.

Here is what B'Tselem says about the current escalation: "...the organization reiterates that international humanitarian law (IHL) obligates all parties taking part in hostilities to refrain from launching attacks against civilians or against civilian objects."

"IHL requires that the combating sides direct their attacks only against specific military objectives, take cautionary measures to prevent injury to civilians, and refrain from disproportionate attacks, i.e. attacks directed against legitimate targets, but that are likely to cause excessive harm to civilian. Furthermore, IHL clearly forbids the intimidation and terrorising of civilians, as well as collective punishment."

"Over the past week, Israel has killed hundreds of Lebanese civilians in its attacks against targets in Lebanon. There is a concern that at least some of them were disproportionate attacks, which constitute war crimes. In addition, Israel has launched deliberate attacks against civilian infrastructure throughout Lebanon, such as bridges, the Beirut international airport , the electricity supply and fuel reservoirs. There is a concern that such attacks are intended to put pressure on the Lebanese Government and not to obtain a specific military advantage. If this is the case, these attacks constitute collective punishment and a grave violation of IHL. Moreover, even if these targets constitute legitimate military objects, or civilian objectives that may be used for military purposes, Israel must respect the principle of proportionality and refrain from attacks that would cause excessive harm to civilians."

The problem is not the debate in Israel. The problem is the debate--or lack thereof--in the United States.

Senator Clinton's spokesperson has called my comments about Israel's conduct "beyond the pale." With all due respect, it is Senator Clinton's behavior, lack of leadership and failure to call for a respect for international law that should be questioned by the press, the Jewish community and the voters of New York. At a time when the violence against people on both sides of the border has killed hundreds of innocent people (mostly Lebanese), Hillary Clinton has fanned the flames of the conflict by recognizing and condemning the violence only against Israelis and effectively encouraging military action. I, too, have stated clearly, from the outset, that Hezbollah's actions violate international law. But, to ignore Israel's actions is abhorrent, weak and cowardly.

Senator Clinton, you are no friend of Israel. A friend of Israel, not someone who simply seeks votes, would understand that employing collective punishment against people in Lebanon only embitters a population, possibly for generations, and that even a short-term military victory will be empty if it leaves behind a shattered country. As an article in The New York Times illustrated: "We're not Hezbollah supporters, but we cannot excuse what the Israelis are doing," said Rima Beydoun, a secular Shiite who owns an advertising agency. "We knew there would be repercussions, but no one expected they would be like this," Mr. Salhab, the filmmaker, said of Shiite support for Hezbollah. "I am very critical of that part of my country, but I have to put it aside, because we are being destroyed. At this point, I can't just say: Hezbollah, go to hell."

A friend of Israel, not someone who simply seeks votes, would never have stood before the "security wall" in the West Bank, as Senator Clinton did, and praised it--even though it has been found to be illegal under international law and by the Israeli Supreme Court (which said that, if a wall needed to be built, it should not stray outside the "green line" into the occupied territories). A friend of Israel would argue strenuously that Israel's moral fiber and its security is weakened every moment that that wall stands in its place, in violation of the law of Israel, severing families from their land, separating people and filling more people with rage and despair.

A friend of Israel, not someone who simply seeks votes, would deplore the collective punishment employed by the Israeli army in Gaza. As Rabbi Michael Lerner has suggested, in the wake of the democratic elections that brought Hamas to power in Gaza, "Instead of narrowly focusing on Hamas' capacity to make war, the Israelis chose the path of collective punishment, a frequently ineffective counterinsurgency policy used to eliminate public support for resistance movements. In the height of the oppressive summer heat, Israel bombed the electricity grid, effectively cutting off Gaza's water and the electricity needed to keep refrigeration working, thereby guaranteeing a dramatic decrease in food for the area's already destitute, million plus population. This act was yet another violation of international law that include[d] the arrests of thousands by Israelis and the shooting of Qassams at population centers by Hamas."

I make this offer: Senator Clinton, come out into the public arena, stop hiding behind your spokespeople and spinners and image consultants. Let's debate the future of Israel and Palestine, publicly, on television, in front of the voters. Right now, in the coming days because the violence in the Middle East is rising. Pick the time and place.

I would end with this thought: As a Jew, I have always been proud of the Jewish concept of "Tikkun Olam" or "repairing the world." I like to think that that is what brought so many Jews into the civil rights and labor movements in the 1960s and 1970s, and into the current anti-war movement--and, personally, guided me into the world of social justice work. I feel great sorrow that Israel is an occupier of another people and I believe that Israel can never be whole and can never be at peace until that occupation is ended in a just way. And I also believe that the concept of Tikkun Olam means that we must never be silent.

Jonathan Tasini's blog

Thank you, J. I love Tasini. I thoroughly agree that it saddens me to say Israel occupy another people. We expect more of them... to be better than those who would attack them.
'
'Annoyed Mama, you are right, this blog is the exclusive province of the bigoted and the aggressively ignorant.'

So, annie, why are you here? Feel free to leave.

Drindl -- to remind myself of reality, whenever I catch myself thinking that most people are smart, and informed, and decent. This blog is a bracing corrective to naive optimism.

So on NPR yesterday there was a news report that said the IDF had moved into Gaza and 23 people had been killed...14 of whom were militants!!

I was waiting to hear what came next but that was it .....didn't reporting used to be "x were civilians".....

Looks like even NPR is starting to knuckle under...

Annie and Annoyed Mama,

Please comment on the Tasini statement I posted above and let me know if your arguements regarding the opinions and factual basis of the beliefs of most of the posters on this forum apply to Mr. Tasini and his experiences as well.

Does he strike you as misinformed or disingenuous in any way?

God willing, those who would close their eyes and ears to the truth for polical gain will increasingly be called out to defend their views by the likes of Mr. Tasini, who happens to be Jewish, has lived in Israel, has family there and denounces the current Israeli policy on Lebanon and advocates an immediate end to the occuaption and Settlement movement.

(Watch out Hillary, you may be forced to make a fool of yourself in front of the entire nation (again) if you ever have the guts to debate this guy on these issues!)

J

Hi Annie

Quick question: What about the West Bank, Golan Heights and all the other occupied land after the Six Day War.

Do you expect the Palestinians to help the Jews to settle and re-assimilate in the West Bank, Golan Heights and all the other occupied land, because that is what decent people do.

I call that colonialism.

This is a sad day in the annals of history. Our country is about to be drawn into a war because of the racist, apartheid policies of the state of Israel. It's bad enough that the US is slaughtering freedom-fighting Arabs in Iraq, now the U.S. is providing bunker-busting bombs to enhance Israel's ability to do the same. Shame shame shame on U.S. War is a symptom of failed dimplomacy. Which shouldn't be surprising since failure is a sympton of U.S. policy under Bush.

This is a sad day in the annals of history. Our country is about to be drawn into a war because of the racist, apartheid policies of the state of Israel. It's bad enough that the US is slaughtering freedom-fighting Arabs in Iraq, now the U.S. is providing bunker-busting bombs to enhance Israel's ability to do the same. Shame shame shame on U.S. War is a symptom of failed dimplomacy. Which shouldn't be surprising since failure is a sympton of U.S. policy under Bush.

Yes, annie, only people who agree with you are informed, intelligent and decent. Good for you.

Looks like Hezbollah's done sprung the Malaysian monkey trap on Israel, and without the connivance of Damascus since Triangle Head never could grasp the concept. So will rookie Ehud let go the banana before Pakistan and India fill the air with their own devices putting Lebanon somewhere in the back slot of what's hot and what's on the drainboard in the daily hit brigade?

I have to add that Tasini's comment is the most rational here. I'm not happy with what Israel is doing, becuase I believe in it, I believe it can be so much more, becuase I too believe in Tikkum Olam too. And I am sad to see people here who are advocating for the destruction of Israel.

There must be another solution besides endless war. But no one seems to be looking for one any longer. No good will come of any of this.

Drindle,

If you live in NY, vote for this Tasini. If he built up steam running a campaign like this and made it to the Senate, It would send shock waves throughout US politics.

Also, the end of the settlement movement will spell the begining of the end of this "endless war". I think that can only commence by lending whatever support we can to poliicians like Mr. Tasini.

When that happens you will see a stronger and safer America and a Stronger and safer Israel.

J

Well J, I do live in NY. I've gotten more interested in Tasini lately. The question is, can a decent guy with no money win in with today's money politics?

And I think you're right. The settlers are very, very radical and holding the rest of Israel hostage.

Tsunami wrote:
"This is a sad day in the annals of history. Our country is about to be drawn into a war because of the racist, apartheid policies of the state of Israel."

Hmmm, I thought the war started because Hezbollah launched a raid into Israel, kidnapped two Isreali soldiers and killed 8. You tell the families of those 8 soldiers how their racist attitudes started this war. What unbelievably nieve thinking on your part.

And which side, Israel or Hezbollah, allows both Arabs and Jews to live in the lands they control?

Be careful when you use words like racist and apartheid in the ME. Israel is the one place where these are least practiced. Lebanon was another until Hezbollah set up shop.

Sully,

I have bad news for you. Virtually the entire popultion of the Planet, with the exception a relatively small group of Israelis and about half (and probably less) of America disagrees with what you are maintaining.

By the way, if you think that Israel should be allowed to devastate the Infrstructure of an entire country, Kill 600 civilians and displace half a million or more people (many for a very long time)
over taking a few soldiers hostage, what reprisals should the US allow the Palestinians for the 30 innocent civilians (many of them Children) that the IDF killed with indiscriminant shelling in the Gaza only a week before this happened?

It's a ridiculus assertion on either side, but god willing, and for Israel's sake, you will never meet your palestinian or arab counterpart, only able to reason as far as you are, and capable of reigning similar destruction down upon Israel for past sins.

Think past your hatred and blood lust. There is a terrible crime against humanity called the Settlements. They have persisted throughout this entire period, causing it to fester when it would have healed long ago in their absence. Start there, doing something constructive that does not result in loss of life and in fact will give back a real chance at good life for millions of people. ie get the log out of your own eye before picking at the speck in someone else's.

One more thing, I am curious about your thoughts and feelings about the Tasini Statement I posted above.

J

To the prime minister of Lebanon,
Sir, please end this fighting, end this agression on your beautiful country. You have no F16 but you have a nation that loves you.
Please go to the southern Lebanon border with TV crews, and your people, women and children preferentially, sit in front of the Israeli tanks, and hold your position. Please reoccupy your villages in the south, and let it known by the media, so the Israelis will know you are there. If the Israelis are asking your people to vacate a particular village, reply by telling them that they will not leave their home, that it their right, as lebanese, to live there, and go in that particular village with some of your government people, even the President, and let it know to the Israelis you are there, bring as many tv crews as you can.
It's risky, but it is the only choice you have!
I still have that image of the chinese student standing in front that tank in tiananmen square a quarter century ago! (http://www.freedomtocare.org/Tiananmen.jpg)
You can only fight Israel invasion peacefully. I am sure you will find all the volunteers you want.
Do it!
Yours Truly,

The true face of the Israeli regime, expansionist, militaristic and barbaric has been now shown to the world. Israel will not only lose this brutal aggression against the whole sovereign country of Lebanon, this collective punishment and massacre of civilians; but it will retreat in shame, and will be forever isolated as a international pariah. This is the fate that awaits those who engage in state-sponsored terrorism! Israel has already lost the war.

annie:

"Hezbollah was not created post-1948 to counter Israel, but rather is one of the current offshoots inspired by Sayyed Qutb (who also gave the world Wahhabism) in the 1920s"

So you are telling me that the current Shiite Hezbollah was founded by the same man who gave the world Wahabism (a branch of Islam that does not necessarily consider Shiites Muslims)?

How can you reconcile the contradiction here? Of course the current Hezbollah movement in Lebanon might have nothing in common with that set up by Sayyed Qutb, other than the name (party of god), in which case I would be correct.

Sully:

"So you see it was justified? You approve?"

I do not believe any killing is acceptable. I mentioned the 20,000 killed by Israel and the Militia it supported because you seemed so bent out of shape over the 240 marines killed. The magnitude of atrocities committed by Israel has always overshadowed anything the Arab groups have done. I, like a lot of other posters critical of Israeli policies, am not trying to say that that makes it ok for Arabs to become suicide bombers; but it does help in trying to provide some context and background for the violence. The beef (if you would allow me to call it that) that critics of Israel have is that it gets a blank check to indulge in whatever it thinks necessary to advance its goals, while the Arabs get branded terrorists for trying to advance their goals using whatever means they have at their disposal. Both sides are committing crimes, but the Israelis are exonerated. You cannot have lasting peace by unjustly demonizing one side (the Arabs) and then trying to use that psychological advantage to offer them scraps as a solution.

Sully:

"Israel is the one place where these are least practiced."

What's the problem with Israel (and the disputed Arab territories) being a non ideological state (call it something else if you have to) and allowing both Arabs and Jews to live there with equal rights? Sincere question this one.

Oops. just browsing...you let only pro israeli views here. Not a good sign. Another website taken over by right wing jews.

Not a good sign. No more washingtonpost reading. I will stick with ny times and newyorker magazine. They reports truth.

I am not against jews though , i am only against how media is muzzled by jews. They blame every one anti-semite to suit isreals agenda. Someone has to tell the world and america exactly what is going on.

No cherry picking the news to suit israels Greater Israel agenda.

Israel exploiting america's anger towards arab and muslims to capture as much land as possible. When the world worried about muslims , islam and alqaeda , israel jsut keep occupying lands. Only issue israel has is they need more jews people. It takes time.

With lebanon in every ones mind israel killed 143 innocent palestinians.

Bush is an idiot. You can't solve this muslim problem with force. Unless the intention is something else.

Which makes me wonder , America just uses israel toc reate war and just keep selling weapons and keep war economy running.

I say it is evil economy. You can't live on someones blood money.

No more of washington post. I am done with this jewish site.

Hmm...what happen suddenly , you let me post?

Change of mind?

This is frigging forum...even if it is your blog...you have to let everyone vent and say anything as long they don't curse people personally or attack...

You can't muzzle opinion and cherry pick the news like FOXNEWS does.

I think you are doing good job other than blocking my posts. I have bookmarked this link because i can read what the world is saying about this tragedy in lebanon from your blog. Good reporting so far. Keep it up.

no jews living in Lebanon?
you must be kidding me.

annie,
i too don't like smart asses, e.g. those who don't even seem to understand that most people in Lebanon speak arab not english but would try to teach others to pronouce some arab names in english.

would you please provide us some chronological statistics(numbers) of the jewish and arab(palestinian) populations in the region since 1900?

"And which side, Israel or Hezbollah, allows both Arabs and Jews to live in the lands they control?"

i'll have to say, no other countries is recruiting Jews from all over the world like Israel does. and ALL countries on earth have implemented some sort of immigration laws. plus we don't see Hizbullah or Lebanon expel their Jewish population out of the country. contrary to that claim, it actually has happened that israel did this to the palestinians.

Why is the two state a solution? With any luck the Israel will follow the path of South Africa. From 50's to 80's both countries had a problem controlling "lower class" citizens. In South Africa a "second
state" aka "Homeland" was provided for those, shall I call them, citizens. The best land was kept for the 1st class citizens. During this time Israel and South Africa shared technology on chemical and nuclear weapons. Both nations suffered the effects of "terrorists".
Organisations which did not fight the battles according to the rules defined by the stronger force. The terrorist organisations support came from an oppressed people. In the case of South Africa, one of those terrorist organisations is the ANC, and one of the members of the organisation a man by the name of Nelson Mandela.
A two state solution is not a solution. A solution is the acceptance that all people are equal, and the land of Israel can be shared. A solution exists. It existed before the state of Israel was created,
when all the Semites of the region lived together.

Why is the two state a solution? With any luck the Israel will follow the path of South Africa. From 50's to 80's both countries had a problem controlling "lower class" citizens. In South Africa a "second
state" aka "Homeland" was provided for those, shall I call them, citizens. The best land was kept for the 1st class citizens. During this time Israel and South Africa shared technology on chemical and nuclear weapons. Both nations suffered the effects of "terrorists".
Organisations which did not fight the battles according to the rules defined by the stronger force. The terrorist organisations support came from an oppressed people. In the case of South Africa, one of those terrorist organisations is the ANC, and one of the members of the organisation a man by the name of Nelson Mandela.
A two state solution is not a solution. A solution is the acceptance that all people are equal, and the land of Israel can be shared. A solution exists. It existed before the state of Israel was created,
when all the Semites of the region lived together.

Why is the two state a solution? With any luck the Israel will follow the path of South Africa. From 50's to 80's both countries had a problem controlling "lower class" citizens. In South Africa a "second
state" aka "Homeland" was provided for those, shall I call them, citizens. The best land was kept for the 1st class citizens. During this time Israel and South Africa shared technology on chemical and nuclear weapons. Both nations suffered the effects of "terrorists".
Organisations which did not fight the battles according to the rules defined by the stronger force. The terrorist organisations support came from an oppressed people. In the case of South Africa, one of those terrorist organisations is the ANC, and one of the members of the organisation a man by the name of Nelson Mandela.
A two state solution is not a solution. A solution is the acceptance that all people are equal, and the land of Israel can be shared. A solution exists. It existed before the state of Israel was created,
when all the Semites of the region lived together.

I think the Israeli mentality that they have to kill 10 times as many Insraelis killed, as the Jerusalem Post says, is driving this war out of control.

While Hezbollah may lose a lot, Israel will keep adding to the list of its implacable enemies who will stop at nothing but the destruction of that country. I think that though Israel will survive for a time with US support, its long term survival is very much in doubt...

The establishment of a state exclusively for Jews in the Middle East was a monumentally flawed idea (even a 'racist' idea) and all the knee-jerk pro-Israeli reactions and the 'root cause' peddlers ignore this 'root cause.'

What is missing from all the pundit pronouncements is an essential and fundamental truth--that there is no God and religions only perpetuate fraud. Until all believers--Jews, Muslims, Christians and other believers--realize this truth and become rational (thereby have the same frame of reference, minimizing competing perceptions of the same reality) conflicts like this will unfortunately continue and innocent people will die.

It will be easier to stop fighting when the combatants recognize that there is nothing 'holy' about the 'holy land.' Religions provide people a self-deluding moral gloss to their most immoral and most idiotic actions. In this context, George Bush, Hasan Nasrallah and the Israelis, are all the same. Expose this irrationality once and for all, then there is no religious cover for these idiot believers to hide from the truth of their egregious immorality. The world has to take this one bold step first to solve all conflicts.

I used to think peace was possible when i was canvassed by us media to believe israel is the victim.

I no longer think Israel is the victim. It is the occupier and agrressor. If i am palestine i would n't accept israels existance in next 100 lives.

Because Israel is a forced occupier. To accept that is accepting fasle as truth under force.

Israel is a bad idea. It will keep creating wars. World war III and more destruction will happen because of israel existance.

It is time to move israel to florida. Then we will see how america will react.

khula ye raaz key ishq nahi hai kuch is key sawa
razziee yaar jo ho apna haal banai rekhna

Thank you Katrina and Yashik. The two of you have articulated what I have been alluding too. It is ironic that the self professed propagators of democracy, equality and freedom in the West would support not only the creation and existence of a theocratic state (I do not care how good non Jews allegedly have it in Israel, a theocratic state by its definition designates one group of people as being superior to another), but continue to advocate further divisions along religious, cultural and racial grounds. Unfortunately the divisions, hatred, and violence of the past sixty years make this particular line of reasoning seem naught but wishful philosophical rambling.

annoyed mama said it best!

Breaking news:

Moslems have decided to REALLY follow the religion of "peace" and stopped their wars and confrontations with
1. Jews
2. Hindus
3. Atheists (china/russia/europe)
4. Buddhists (thailand)
5. Secular humanists (the dutch)
6. Christians
7. animists (sudan).
8. Shia ;-)
9. Sunni ;-)

Just kidding of course.

The cancer hasn't affected one major culture/civilization - Japan. Why? Ponder on that for a while.

Breaking news:

Moslems have decided to REALLY follow the religion of "peace" and stopped their wars and confrontations with
1. Jews
2. Hindus
3. Atheists (china/russia/europe)
4. Buddhists (thailand)
5. Secular humanists (the dutch)
6. Christians
7. animists (sudan).
8. Shia ;-)
9. Sunni ;-)

Just kidding of course.

The cancer hasn't affected one major culture/civilization - Japan. Why? Ponder on that for a while.

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/index.html#Attacks

Wrong blog Raj.
While you are out and about, see if the local drugstore has any medication for racism. You do have drug stores in India don't you? Or did the Muslims steal those from under your noses as well?

Here we have an attack on a military patrol, the response from Israel is to bomb civilian targets, then civilians, the response from Hezbollah is to bomb civilians, we then have Israel bombing the Red Cross and the U.N and with the latest rumours of using chemical weapons.

Did we in the west not fight against Hitler and Hassan for doing exactly the same things, even they did not bomb the Red Cross ambulances. Although they were both known for using chemical weapons, and for killing civilians.

So tell me who is the terrorist state in this case, the people who first attacked a military unit or those who attacked a civilian population?

Interesting Article regarding Israel's handling of Palestinians-American's.

The same malign intent by Israel towards the Palestinians is stamped through its history like the lettering in a children's stick of seaside rock. But despite the consistent aim of Israeli policy, generation after generation of Western politicians, diplomats and journalists has shown a repeated inability to grasp what is happening before its very eyes.

The Palestinian historian Rashid Khalidi once noted that the first goal of Israel's founders as they prepared to establish their Jewish state on a large swath of the Palestinian homeland in 1948 was to empty Palestine's urban heartlands of their educated elites.

Even before Israel's Declaration of Independence on 15 May 1948, most Palestinians had been terrified away from the two wealthiest cities in coastal Palestine, Jaffa and Haifa. Other Palestinian cities soon fell during the war of 1948: Israeli forces mostly cleansed Lydda, Ramle, Acre, Safad, Tiberias, Baysan and Bir Saba of their native populations. Today all these cities have been repopulated with Jews -- as well as renamed.

Khalidi has written: "These refugees from the urban areas of the country generally tended to be those Palestinians with the highest levels of literacy, skills, wealth, and education". Or, in other words, the small number of Palestinians allowed to remain in their homeland by Israel were peasant families living in isolated rural communities.

These Palestinians posed little threat to the new Jewish state: they lacked the education and tools to resist both the wholesale dispossession of their people and their own personal loss as their farm lands were expropriated by the state to establish the Jewish farming communes of the kibbutz and moshav movements.

And so history repeats itself. As Israel's violent siege of Gaza continues, the Associated Press reported this week that dozens of Palestinians with American passports have left Gaza, escorted out of the Strip in a convoy of United Nations vehicles. One Palestinian American mother said she and her children could no longer stand the terrifying sonic booms produced by Israeli aircraft flying overhead during the night.

These fleeing Palestinians have two things that most of their kin in Gaza lack: they have lots of money that they might have invested in rebuilding Gaza's economy were Israel not intent on destroying it; and they are familiar with a language and ideas that might have conveyed very effectively to Western audiences the horror currently being endured by Gaza's civilian population.

They are also among the least radicalised elements of Gaza's population and might have been the ones most willing to start a dialogue with Israel -- had Israel shown any interest in negotiating.

But of course their absence from Gaza, and flight to America, will not be mourned by Israel.

How much Israel fears the presence in the occupied territories of Palestinians who have lived in the West -- those who have money and influence, and speak in a language the non-Arab world can understand -- was highlighted in another piece of news this week that went mostly unnoticed.

According to the Haaretz newspaper, Israel's interior ministry has been quietly implementing a new rule since April that allows it to refuse entry to Palestinians holding foreign passports to Israel and the occupied territories. Most of those affected are Palestinians who today have citizenship in America or Europe.

Israel has this power over these Palestinians' lives because, since its occupation of the West Bank and Gaza in 1967, it has usurped control of the borders of the Palestinian territories. In another sign of how mistaken Western observers are in believing that the occupation of Gaza somehow ended with the withdrawal of Jewish settlers last year, Israel is still able to prevent Palestinians with a foreign passport (as well as those from the West Bank) from entering Gaza.

This new policy of exclusion affects thousands of the wealthiest and most educated Palestinians, some of whom have been living in the occupied territories for a decade or more investing in the economy as entrepreneurs, teaching in the universities or establishing desperately needed civil society organisations.

In another irony, many of these Palestinians have a foreign passport only because Israel stripped them of their rights to residency in the occupied territories in violation of international law. Using its control of the area's borders since 1967, Israel revoked the residency of these Palestinians while they were studying or working abroad.

As the Israeli journalist Amira Hass has documented, some of these Palestinians eventually came back to the occupied territories after marrying a local Palestinian resident but were refused rights of residency they should be entitled to according to the normal principles of family unification.

Instead most Palestinians with foreign passports have remained in the occupied territories at Israel's discretion: as long as they renewed their tourist visa every three months by crossing the border into Jordan or Egypt, they were left in relative peace.

But Israel is now unilaterally changing the rules (as it always does), even if it has been too embarrassed to declare the fact openly. Apparently the US embassy has been aware of the change for some time but does not think it should intervene in the "sovereign decisions" of another country -- or, more accurately, in the decisions of a sovereign country, Israel, in violating the rights of an occupied people, the Palestinians.

Palestinians with US passports have been told by Israel that, when their three-month visas expire, they will no longer be entitled to enter the occupied territories to visit their families -- except in rare "humanitarian cases" such as a close relative dying. Some will be separated from their spouse and children, while others will lose their businesses and everything they have invested in them.

With these foreign passport holders forced to leave the occupied territories, the pressure is sure to grow on their families left behind in Gaza or the West Bank to seek ways to emigrate abroad to be with them again.

The purpose of Israel's current bureaucratic obscenity is the same as it was in 1948 when its highest priority was the clearing of the Palestinian cities of their elites to make way for the establishment of the Jewish state.

This time Israel needs to empty the ghettoes it is crafting for the Palestinians of the most educated and well-connected of their number so that it can more credibly claim that there is no one "moderate" to talk to. Any Palestinian with a stake in an Israeli-imposed peace, even one that damages Palestinian national interests, will have been forced out by Israel's policies long before.

Those who remain behind, trapped by walls of concrete and steel, will be powerless to resist the unilateral and illegal expansion of Israel's borders explicit in Ehud Olmert's convergence plan.

When the only noise heard from the Palestinians in their cages is the occasional whine of a home-made Qassam rocket flying out of the ghetto into the Jewish state, we will be told by Israel and its US ally that terror is the only language the Palestinians know.

But, in truth, it will be the only language we have left the Palestinians to speak.

And the Idiot in Chief once again calls up Israel to say; "Heck of a job Olmert".

The details of Israli mistreatment of palestinians and "hyphenated Americans" (I'm one) are only secondary and incidental - however shocking and inhumane it may be when considered in isolation - to the bigger picture. Personally, I was shocked when I saw the news item about how an Israeli guard was forcing an arab musician to play his violin and the arab had to play ...trembling with fear. Now THATs inhumane - to violate the dignity of a civilized human being. However, Hamas calling for "moral" stance from America is as abusurd as Jeffrey Dahmer demanding people to go vegetarian.

How is Jordan surviving without any Israeli attacks since the peace treaty, if the "Zionists" are so expansionist? The more arrogance one experiences from islamists towards infidels, the more determined enemies, the infidels become.

All instinctive sympathy towards any suffering innocent islamic populations, is now tempered, if not dangerously and unconscionably obscured, with the memories of 9/11. After all, 9/11 was celebrated in the moslem world. Islamists who live in America should display less arrogance and more understanding for this ORIGINAL SIN if they need their legitimate view points to strike a chord with the infidels here in America and/or elsewhere - MORE humility, decency and less nonchalance.

Times have changed.

Raj,

for your info, if you don't see what human nature is and you don't know that it's might be in your blood too, in the time of viet war, it was the christian government(the south, supported by the us) that massacred the buddhist monks and the people.

Zain - You might want to get your racism in check as well. Maybe you can lend Raj some of your medication. Oh, never mind, it sounds like you've been so busy attacking everyone that you must be off yours.

why 2-state solution?
bcs one-state is not a realistic solution for the Jews(Israelis) and the Palestinians. i don't think that's in either side's interest. for one, Jews would be far out numbered and become small minority.

The Hezbollah militants have embedded themselves (with the full approval of the Lebanese people) within the civilian population. The civilians serve as human shields.

Even though the Israelis are clearly racist (since their immigration policy favors Jews over non-Jews), they are not targetting the civilians in Lebanon. They are targetting only the militants. The civilians are inevitably killed because they serve as shields.

Here in the United States, we would never tolerage a Mexican vigilante group launching military attacks against Americans from Mexico itself. We would kill the vigilantes. We would bomb Mexico.

Observations Only:

Try to read what I was responding to before you shoot your mouth off. Raj's post suggested that the majority of the violence in the world is the fault of Muslims. His statement; "Moslems have decided to REALLY follow the religion of "peace"", implies that Muslims, as a people and a culture, are violent.

You can call me a racist when you can quote me branding another ethnic group, or culture as violent, racist, or anything derogatory. My criticism has been of Israeli policy (I have criticized Hamas and Hezbollah as well).

"The more arrogance one experiences from islamists towards infidels, the more determined enemies, the infidels become."

This is the root of the problem. If you swap the words Islamists and infidels, then you have essentially summed up the opinion in the Arab and Muslim world as well. You criticize celebrations in the aftermath of 911; similar to the Israeli school girls signing messages on Israeli shells that end up killing civilians. Both are distasteful. It does help to try and understand why the other side reacted the way it did though, but then we end up falling back into that age old debate of who killed who first. Who occupied whose land? It is pointless. I had thought that perhaps my accusation of "racist" was a bit harsh, but your second post has even less tact. To use your own words;

"MORE humility, decency and less nonchalance."

Times have indeed changed. Violence only begets violence. Israel has had the military upper hand since 1948. It needs to negotiate with Abbas, Fatah, and the elected members of Hamas who had indicated willingness to, as a first step, at least implicitly recognize Israel. Israel's approach so far towards having peace is reflected in the moronic attitude of the Bush Administration towards ending the latest conflict. The occupation of Arab land drives the support and ideology of groups like Hamas and Hezbollah. You cannot realistically have them agree to disarm when the reasons for their existence continue to be present.

Can someone please explain to me why arabs all over the world think they have a birth right over the ancient lands of Judea and Samaria (renamed "palestine" by the Romans, after tehy destroying the Jews)?

Zain wrote:
"What's the problem with Israel (and the disputed Arab territories) being a non ideological state (call it something else if you have to) and allowing both Arabs and Jews to live there with equal rights? Sincere question this one."

No problem at all. Its been proposed but I haven't heard either Israelis or Palistinians ask for it. The only thing they seem to agree on is separate states. But right now only Israel is a democracy in the region. Lebanon was moving in that direction until Hezbollah decided to start a war the Lebanese government did not want and showed Lebanon did not even have an effective government. Hezbollah demands the heads of jews. The Saudi's won't allow a synagague (or church) to be built in their country or any religious service other than Islam to be held. Yet right now the are more than twice as many Arabs living in Israel than were displaced by the creation of Israel. And they have mosques. I'm not going to kid you and say life is lovely for Arabs in Israel. Its always tough being a minority, especially being a member of an ethnic group that globally wants Israel to be wiped off the map. But they are free to live and worship and vote. The right is not preserved for Jews in some of Israel's neighboring states. That is the reality. If you want to boil it all down to individual freedom, the people whose religion means surrender are the least supportive of individual freedom.

Zain wrote:
"The occupation of Arab land drives the support and ideology of groups like Hamas and Hezbollah. You cannot realistically have them agree to disarm when the reasons for their existence continue to be present."

Problem is Zain that Hezbollah and their sponsors Iran as well as Hamas believe all the land that is now Israel is Arab land. So, as long as Israel exists by your explanation they will not disarm.

I have heard this before from supporters of ME terrorists. The argument goes that Israel needs to withdraw, Israel needs to stop killing Arabs when they attack Israel. Israel needs to stop resisting. Yet no arab acknowleges that Hamas and Hezbollah are trying to not only eliminate the state of Israel, but its people as well. Israel is not calling for Palistinians to leave the west bank or gaza, lands that used to be part of Jordan and Egypt respectively, nations Israel is at peace with. Israel left S. Lebanon as the UN resolution demanded and UNIFIL verified. But Hezbollah not only did not disarm as the UN resolution demanded, they built up their forces and arsenals right in front of UNIFIL, which did nothing. Israel left Gaza and militants launch rockets from Gaza. And Israel is continuously called the agressor by the arabs. I'm sorry, I look at the reality and the reality says that Israel is continually being attacked even when arab demands are met. If the arabs want peace, they need to propose it. If the arabs want the support of peace loving peoples, they need to care about having peace. If they want to wipe Israel off the map and attack Israel as Hezbollah did a few weeks ago, they need to expect Israel to defend herself and peace loving peoples to see through the pleas that arabs are the victims.

Sully:

"Yet no arab acknowleges that Hamas and Hezbollah are trying to not only eliminate the state of Israel, but its people as well."

You are spinning the circular argument that has been the staple of pro Israelis for years. As you yourself said; "The argument goes that Israel needs to withdraw, Israel needs to stop killing Arabs when they attack Israel. Israel needs to stop resisting." That is indeed the argument for the existence of Hezbollah and Hamas, so adopting a position that Israel will not negotiate until Hezbollah and Hamas disarm is tantamount to putting the cart before the horse.

Look at the results of the policy pro-Israelis advocate. For all intents and purposes it has been practiced by Israel for the last sixty years. Israel has started a pre-emptive war, attacked Arabs with d